2022 NBA Draft Thread

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Re: 2022 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1301 » by Xatticus » Fri Jun 23, 2023 3:26 pm

ThunderBolt wrote:
Old Man Game wrote:
Dadouv47 wrote:
what did I miss? Wallace got back injury?


He had back spasms during a game this season. Doesn't sound terrible.

There were some rumors about his medicals not being great. The more I try to read about it, the more it seems meaningless.


There are often injuries floated at this time of year to explain away a player's performance. Wallace hit 24% of his threes in conference play, so it's sort of to be expected that they would put something out there as an excuse.

I hadn't looked at him at all before the draft. I'd read a bit, but wasn't enthused by what I read.

I'll start by saying that I have a tough time believing that he was the target. It just seems really unlikely that Orlando had any interest in him, so unless we wanted Bertans, then I'd guess we moved up expecting someone else to be there that ultimately wasn't.

He looks fine as a prospect.

I've repeatedly heard him referred to as an elite point-of-attack defender since I started digging into him, but I don't see that. Firstly, you have to be great at getting over screens for that to be true, which he isn't. I also don't really like the angles he takes to cut off penetration. He doesn't really beat guys to the spot preternaturally as does a Davion Mitchell, but rather he plays wide and moves his feet to force them wide and make the angle of attack difficult until they run out of real estate. I think this will be exploited by savvy penetrators that will draw fouls or just pull up in front of him as he isn't in position to do much about that. He's really good at keeping his arms out while moving his feet, which isn't something you generally see. He has really good balance, active hands, good reach, and he doesn't switch off at all. All of these things allow him to pick up cheap steals when someone near him gets loose with the ball. I also really like his rotations. He plugs gaps and comes up with steals when the defense gets disorganized and starts scrambling. I like his defense a lot. I wish he was bigger. I'm not sure how switchable he is, but we will find out.

The shot is a concern. It looks good, but the numbers aren't there. His catch-and-shoot stuff is okay, but not great. The FT% is encouraging though. It was abysmal in non-conference, but he hit 29 of 32 in conference and I think you have to have some upside to rip off a streak like that. I think he'll be an adequate shooter.

His penetration is underwhelming. He just isn't very explosive. He is good at seeing a runway and driving into it, but he doesn't have the burst to create them and I think he often picks up his dribble too early. He needs to improve his ballhandling and keep his dribble active, because he makes good reads and he is capable in the pick-and-roll. I'd also really like to see him develop a pull-up from around 12 feet out so that he can snake out of screens. I think that would really open up his finishing and help him to evolve as a playmaker.

Overall, I like him as a prospect. I think he has some upside and I think he will be able to hold his own on the court right out of the gates, which will give him more opportunities to develop. This does seem to make Tre Mann's future with the organization rather precarious.
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Re: 2022 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1302 » by mr570 » Fri Jun 23, 2023 3:55 pm

I just really don’t understand the direction at this point anymore. Are they trading Dort? Why bring Micic in now if you’re just going to draft yet another guard at your highest pick? The prospects that made the most sense, to me, if we’re going to believe the draft direction that people like Andrew Schlecht have been espousing, were Leonard Miller or Trayce Jackson Davis. They’d fill a need and have the type of anticipation and BBIQ that the Thunder like.

But now there’s a glut of guards and little defensive presence on the inside. It’s just weird to me.
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Re: 2022 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1303 » by jake_swivel » Fri Jun 23, 2023 4:27 pm

mr570 wrote:I just really don’t understand the direction at this point anymore.

….

But now there’s a glut of guards and little defensive presence on the inside. It’s just weird to me.


The thing that stood out to me last season is that they are swarming on defense, trying to create turnovers, run, and get easy buckets. When they can’t run, the half court is spam shai mid range and let Josh create with cutters. Everyone on the court needs to be able to at least keep the defense honest with their shooting, and when they can, it opens up the defense for straight line drives. JDub and Giddey took advantage of it a ton. If dort wasn’t garbage at the rim, he would have too.

I do see how Cason works with that.

Without Chet, it gives you a semi competitive, overachieving, fun to watch team. With Chet, it has the potential to become explosively good.

I don’t love the pick. I don’t love the current roster composition. I think guys like joe and Wiggins (and even dort) are going to get their value dragged through the mud which makes trades more difficult to pull off. There are still a ton of draft assets.

This team has a lot of dogs on it. I like that. Cason adds to that.

I think we’ve reached the point where team chemistry starts getting dicey. People’s livelihoods are at stake. Generational wealth or being an assistant coach at a community college? The wrong situation can make or break your life. People can start getting a little frustrated.
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Re: 2022 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1304 » by Dadouv47 » Fri Jun 23, 2023 5:18 pm

Read on Twitter


Dawins being dirty :lol:

He had to know Presti liked him a lot.
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Re: 2022 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1305 » by Dadouv47 » Fri Jun 23, 2023 5:21 pm

Read on Twitter


maybe he wasn't sure of it but Presti didn't want to lose the guy he was targetting after Bilal and we have enough cap space to afford it anyway. Orlando kind of reached at 11 so I believe that the pick was indeed pretty open to move down 2-4 spots.
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Re: 2022 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1306 » by Dadouv47 » Fri Jun 23, 2023 5:22 pm

Read on Twitter


we gonna play Giddey at center if Chet is a bust.
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Re: 2022 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1307 » by jake_swivel » Fri Jun 23, 2023 5:37 pm

Dadouv47 wrote:we gonna play Giddey at center if Chet is a bust.


Everything kind of depends on Chet. Like the whole thing.
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Re: 2022 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1308 » by Zagor » Fri Jun 23, 2023 6:41 pm

Dadouv47 wrote:Presti is either overrating our roster depth, wants to see how it goes with Chet or think about improving via trades/FA...could be a bit of the 3 :)

OKC will have 5th best record in West next season. Mark my words.

SGA - JDub - Chet lineup will be deadly.
With Dort and Cason, Mark can put some crazy defensive lineups.

Last season this young team found their identity and style of play. They now know what they need to improve and what to expect.
Many other teams in the West are old and in identity problems.
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Re: 2022 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1309 » by Dadouv47 » Fri Jun 23, 2023 7:34 pm

Read on Twitter


nice video if Cason becomes a star
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Re: 2022 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1310 » by ThunderBolt » Fri Jun 23, 2023 9:00 pm

mr570 wrote:I just really don’t understand the direction at this point anymore. Are they trading Dort? Why bring Micic in now if you’re just going to draft yet another guard at your highest pick? The prospects that made the most sense, to me, if we’re going to believe the draft direction that people like Andrew Schlecht have been espousing, were Leonard Miller or Trayce Jackson Davis. They’d fill a need and have the type of anticipation and BBIQ that the Thunder like.

But now there’s a glut of guards and little defensive presence on the inside. It’s just weird to me.

Schlecht rubs shoulders with big names but I don’t know that he has much more insight than any of us. I think they are committed to giving Dieng another year of development and Poku at least until the trade deadline. If the team takes the next step I could see them moving Poku and bringing in a four that compliments chet. Picking Wallace shows that Presti knows Dort isn’t in the long term plans just due to salary. Just my opinion.
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Re: 2022 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1311 » by Dadouv47 » Fri Jun 23, 2023 9:48 pm

Cason shooting form is great. Also his midrange is decent which is something we need.

I really like the kid. Not all star potential but I just like the odds of him becoming an elite two way role player.
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Re: 2022 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1312 » by slick_watts » Fri Jun 23, 2023 9:57 pm

andrew schlecht has no insight into sam presti's actual thought or decision making process. okc media is just cheerleaders, really.

anyway, i'm ok with the draft mostly. i like cason wallace because he's the sort of player that, if he's good, probably won't take three years to find that out. i wanted to draft someone who could conceivably contribute in the next two seasons before shai is extension eligible. cason wallace fits that mold. i think this does say something about lu dort's status on the team. they just drafted a guy who counterfeits almost all his skills, is younger, cheaper, and potentially better. plus they have another guy who they could sign (micic) who is also probably better than him.

i'm not that thrilled about the cost of moving up. taking on bertans to move up two draft slots is thin value. but when you target a certain player you leave yourself open to poor value propositions. i suppose it's possible bertans could be rehabbed and flipped. his 2024-25 guarantee is tied to games played. so i suppose that either extreme makes the cost more bearable. if bertans plays well enough that he's useful or tradeable again, or if they don't play him at all and we're only on the hook for $5mm in 2024. it's still bad value, though. just thinking from dallas' perspective, what a boon it must have felt like to move down two spots and get off bertans' deal.

cason wallace had 3.6% steal rate last year which is much better than lu dort in college and his defensive identity imo is a lot more versatile despite having similar frame and skills. it's been three years hoping lu dort could learn how to make threes and that hasn't gone well and he's regressed in other areas offensively. wallace has some better shooting indicators than dort ever had so here's hoping once more.
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Re: 2022 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1313 » by mr570 » Fri Jun 23, 2023 10:23 pm

ThunderBolt wrote:
mr570 wrote:I just really don’t understand the direction at this point anymore. Are they trading Dort? Why bring Micic in now if you’re just going to draft yet another guard at your highest pick? The prospects that made the most sense, to me, if we’re going to believe the draft direction that people like Andrew Schlecht have been espousing, were Leonard Miller or Trayce Jackson Davis. They’d fill a need and have the type of anticipation and BBIQ that the Thunder like.

But now there’s a glut of guards and little defensive presence on the inside. It’s just weird to me.

Schlecht rubs shoulders with big names but I don’t know that he has much more insight than any of us. I think they are committed to giving Dieng another year of development and Poku at least until the trade deadline. If the team takes the next step I could see them moving Poku and bringing in a four that compliments chet. Picking Wallace shows that Presti knows Dort isn’t in the long term plans just due to salary. Just my opinion.

This all makes me feel a bit better. Because I did not understand the pick in the scope of any of what Schlecht's been saying, and he's done a lot of convincing. I like his podcasts a lot but some of his takes are bad imo. Especially denying certain players who were just never in the realm of getting picked by OKC anyway.

I'm hoping the thought is stick with Poku/Dieng this year and if neither can prove themselves then you have a warchest of first round picks to draft Cody Williams next year. Because skipping Miller and then drafting two more guards just didn't feel like the move imo
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Re: 2022 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1314 » by Dadouv47 » Fri Jun 23, 2023 10:35 pm

mr570 wrote:
ThunderBolt wrote:
mr570 wrote:I just really don’t understand the direction at this point anymore. Are they trading Dort? Why bring Micic in now if you’re just going to draft yet another guard at your highest pick? The prospects that made the most sense, to me, if we’re going to believe the draft direction that people like Andrew Schlecht have been espousing, were Leonard Miller or Trayce Jackson Davis. They’d fill a need and have the type of anticipation and BBIQ that the Thunder like.

But now there’s a glut of guards and little defensive presence on the inside. It’s just weird to me.

Schlecht rubs shoulders with big names but I don’t know that he has much more insight than any of us. I think they are committed to giving Dieng another year of development and Poku at least until the trade deadline. If the team takes the next step I could see them moving Poku and bringing in a four that compliments chet. Picking Wallace shows that Presti knows Dort isn’t in the long term plans just due to salary. Just my opinion.

This all makes me feel a bit better. Because I did not understand the pick in the scope of any of what Schlecht's been saying, and he's done a lot of convincing. I like his podcasts a lot but some of his takes are bad imo. Especially denying certain players who were just never in the realm of getting picked by OKC anyway.

I'm hoping the thought is stick with Poku/Dieng this year and if neither can prove themselves then you have a warchest of first round picks to draft Cody Williams next year. Because skipping Miller and then drafting two more guards just didn't feel like the move imo


He works for the Thunder so he usually tries to be pretty optimistic even if he says he doesn't like a specific move...but what he just posted right now is pretty fair and we knew it for a while:

Read on Twitter


I do think regression might come and is a real risk. We badly overperformed even if SGA/Giddey and JDub are legit.
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Re: 2022 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1315 » by Dadouv47 » Fri Jun 23, 2023 10:39 pm

I'm only pissed that we will start Dort over Cason next season.
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Re: 2022 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1316 » by mr570 » Fri Jun 23, 2023 11:31 pm

Dadouv47 wrote:
mr570 wrote:
ThunderBolt wrote:Schlecht rubs shoulders with big names but I don’t know that he has much more insight than any of us. I think they are committed to giving Dieng another year of development and Poku at least until the trade deadline. If the team takes the next step I could see them moving Poku and bringing in a four that compliments chet. Picking Wallace shows that Presti knows Dort isn’t in the long term plans just due to salary. Just my opinion.

This all makes me feel a bit better. Because I did not understand the pick in the scope of any of what Schlecht's been saying, and he's done a lot of convincing. I like his podcasts a lot but some of his takes are bad imo. Especially denying certain players who were just never in the realm of getting picked by OKC anyway.

I'm hoping the thought is stick with Poku/Dieng this year and if neither can prove themselves then you have a warchest of first round picks to draft Cody Williams next year. Because skipping Miller and then drafting two more guards just didn't feel like the move imo


He works for the Thunder so he usually tries to be pretty optimistic even if he says he doesn't like a specific move...but what he just posted right now is pretty fair and we knew it for a while:

Read on Twitter


I do think regression might come and is a real risk. We badly overperformed even if SGA/Giddey and JDub are legit.

The west was the worst it's been this year in a long time. I don't trust the top as it stands though sans the Nuggets. Every other team has really old stars and are only going to be good when the Thunder are still having their ascent. But if we can't get past Minnesota or Memphis or San Antonio in the future then that is an indictment on the way the team was built today.
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Re: 2022 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1317 » by Kizz Fastfists » Sat Jun 24, 2023 2:06 am

mr570 wrote:But now there’s a glut of guards and little defensive presence on the inside. It’s just weird to me.


Presti has never understood building a complete team. He gets a few great pieces and then fails to put the rest of the team in place. He didn't need to do much this off-season. He made the trade up he needed to make to get Lively, which is the defensive anchor the team needs, and let Chet play PF because he isn't a center. Then he could've moved Dort, with picks, for another solid big, like John Collins, and then you have Chet as your 6th man in his rookie season. They had enough 1-3 with SGA, Giddy, Jalen Williams, Mann, Joe, Wiggins, etc.

Then sign another solid center like Proeltl, which makes Lively your backup center to start his career. You now have enough balance and a properly constructed team that you should get out of the first round of the playoffs on paper. If Chet is healthy and lives up to expectations he replaces Collins, or whatever solid PF you traded Dort for, as the starting PF around the all-star break. You still have a lot of draft picks to fill in any role, mainly 3&D types at 2-4, with your remaining draft capital.

Presti has a team overloaded at 1-3 with nothing you can depend on as quality play at 4/5 unless you are going to play extremely undersized which is fine if you just want to be a fringe playoff team that is "exciting and scrappy", but it is absolute garbage if your goal is winning a championship.
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Re: 2022 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1318 » by Mr Thunder Nick » Sat Jun 24, 2023 6:19 am

Summer isn't done. We have trade value in Micic, Mann and Waters (Poku?) and a lot of picks. Perhaps Sam has already a plan to get a bigger player in the near future. Trust in Presti, he is a very good navigator.
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Re: 2022 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1319 » by Mr Thunder Nick » Sat Jun 24, 2023 6:25 am

I like our draft. Cason can be a very important piece for the future with his spirit and is another hustle-player. A kind of player OKC fans loves at all. When I watch his films, he remembers me a lot on M.Smart. I like those players. Also K.Johnson could be a steel at 50. Without his health story he would have been drafted much higher.
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Re: 2022 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1320 » by Zagor » Sat Jun 24, 2023 8:59 am

Kizz Fastfists wrote:Presti has never understood building a complete team. He gets a few great pieces and then fails to put the rest of the team in place. He didn't need to do much this off-season. He made the trade up he needed to make to get Lively, which is the defensive anchor the team needs, and let Chet play PF because he isn't a center. Then he could've moved Dort, with picks, for another solid big, like John Collins, and then you have Chet as your 6th man in his rookie season. They had enough 1-3 with SGA, Giddy, Jalen Williams, Mann, Joe, Wiggins, etc.

Presti has a team overloaded at 1-3 with nothing you can depend on as quality play at 4/5 unless you are going to play extremely undersized which is fine if you just want to be a fringe playoff team that is "exciting and scrappy", but it is absolute garbage if your goal is winning a championship.

On the contrary, Chet is center. Real center.
Whatever success this team will have, it will be with him playing center position.

Starting lineup is undersized, yes. But if Dieng improves by his third season, situation is drastically different.
Roster building is in middle phase. There is still a lot of time to add bigger bodies.

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