FUTURE DRAFT GAMES - NEW THREAD 2/21/22

[Snakebites]

I'll pitch this here- just so it can be workshopped where more people can see it:

Another twist on the modified core draft. The bare bones rules are the same as the previous draft, but with the following changes:

1) You can now pick players who have won a single championship with that franchise, but you still can't choose the season that they won. This should alleviate concerns about the 2008 Celtics being too powerful. This opens up the core options while still removing full on dynasties like the 90s Bulls, 00s Lakers and Spurs, and Splash Warriors.

2) No more than 2 All NBA First Teamers per ENTIRE TEAM.

3) The restriction on the wildcard is relaxed. You are now allowed to take any player who has never won an MVP. The important caveat is that you're still limited to two All NBA First Teamers per team, so if your core already has two of them you can't take another.

4) Per suggestion of others, you must start at least 3 players from your core.

Potential concern is that this does leave a couple of Lebron teams that could be selected. I'm not sure that's a non-starter. Cleveland Lebron would be forced to start alongside a couple of less-than desirable supporting pieces and the teams that lost to the Warriors weren't really THAT special. And the Lakers were kind of a mess outside of the one championship year.

Thoughts?

If I understand correctly, it adds LeBron's Cavs/Lakers, Giannis' Bucks, Jokic's Denver, Dirk's Dallas, and the modern Detroit Bad Boys, right?

Are all the four players required to play in the championship team? If they do, it kinda contradicts the ability to take no rings teams, unless they are handled differently in the rules.

Can I pick Spurs Kawhi without Parker/Manu/Duncan, or Miami Shaq without Wade?

Okay, one question at a time:

A) Yes it adds those players and their corresponding cores. You can't select them in the title season though. So no 16/20 Lebron, 21 Giannis, 23 Jokic etc.

B) No. All this does is allow players who won ONE championship with the core to be chosen, and not in those seasons. There is no stipulation that all 4 players be champions with that team. You could, for instance, take 2020 Jokic with Paul Milsap and Jerami Grant, even though those players weren't on the title team.

C) Yes. You could.

[flaco]

Digging on the core idea, how about we mix different eras but we keep the ''no rings'' rule intact?

• max one MVP per team
• max 2 all-NBA 1 teamers per team
• max one 2nd teamer or lower for non-core players
• at least 3 core players must play north of 36 minutes (avoids the loophole of starting a bench-calibre player for limited minutes)

For instance, here are some eligible cores:

• Jazz: Stockton, Malone, Royce O'Neale, Lauri Markkanen
• Wolves: KG, KAT, Edwards, McDaniels
• Blazers: Lillard, Drexler, Rasheed, Arvydas
• Clips: CP3, Kawhi, Batum, Beverley

You get the idea.

[Snakebites]

Digging on the core idea, how about we mix different eras but we keep the ''no rings'' rule intact.

- max one regular season MVP or Finals MVP per team (effectively banning Kawhi+CP3)
- max 2 all-NBA 1 teamers per team
- max one 2nd teamer or lower for non-core players
- at least 3 core players must play north of 36 minutes (avoids the loophole of starting a bench-calibre player for limited minutes)

For instance, here are some eligible cores:

Stockton, Malone, Royce O'Neale, Lauri Markkanen
KG, KAT, Edwards, McDaniels
Lillard, Drexler, Rasheed, Arvydas
CP3, George, Batum, Beverley

You get the idea.

Hmm. It's not really a real-life core then is it? Might be a good idea in and of itself but this feels like a different thing entirely.

Kawhi/CP would still be allowable under that restriction. CP does not have an MVP or a Finals MVP.

[flaco]

Digging on the core idea, how about we mix different eras but we keep the ''no rings'' rule intact.

- max one regular season MVP or Finals MVP per team (effectively banning Kawhi+CP3)
- max 2 all-NBA 1 teamers per team
- max one 2nd teamer or lower for non-core players
- at least 3 core players must play north of 36 minutes (avoids the loophole of starting a bench-calibre player for limited minutes)

For instance, here are some eligible cores:

Stockton, Malone, Royce O'Neale, Lauri Markkanen
KG, KAT, Edwards, McDaniels
Lillard, Drexler, Rasheed, Arvydas
CP3, George, Batum, Beverley

You get the idea.

Hmm. It's not really a real-life core then is it? Might be a good idea in and of itself but this feels like a different thing entirely.

Kawhi/CP would still be allowable under that restriction. CP does not have an MVP or a Finals MVP.

You are right, of course. My bad about Kawhi-CP3.

It's not necessarily a real-life core, but it's still a group of guys from the same team. Difference is we are allowed to mix players from different eras.

[durantbird]

Digging on the core idea, how about we mix different eras but we keep the ''no rings'' rule intact.

- max one regular season MVP or Finals MVP per team (effectively banning Kawhi+CP3)
- max 2 all-NBA 1 teamers per team
- max one 2nd teamer or lower for non-core players
- at least 3 core players must play north of 36 minutes (avoids the loophole of starting a bench-calibre player for limited minutes)

For instance, here are some eligible cores:

Stockton, Malone, Royce O'Neale, Lauri Markkanen
KG, KAT, Edwards, McDaniels
Lillard, Drexler, Rasheed, Arvydas
CP3, George, Batum, Beverley

You get the idea.

Hmm. It's not really a real-life core then is it? Might be a good idea in and of itself but this feels like a different thing entirely.

Kawhi/CP would still be allowable under that restriction. CP does not have an MVP or a Finals MVP.

You are right, of course. My bad about Kawhi-CP3.

It's not necessarily a real-life core, but it's still a group of guys from the same team. Difference is we are allowed to mix players from different eras.

We can add guys who were 2nd in MVP voting. This will remove Paul and Kawhi. Kawhi also finished second in 2016. It will not remove guys like Anthony Davis though.

[flaco]

Hmm. It's not really a real-life core then is it? Might be a good idea in and of itself but this feels like a different thing entirely.

Kawhi/CP would still be allowable under that restriction. CP does not have an MVP or a Finals MVP.

You are right, of course. My bad about Kawhi-CP3.

It's not necessarily a real-life core, but it's still a group of guys from the same team. Difference is we are allowed to mix players from different eras.

We can add guys who were 2nd in MVP voting. This will remove Paul and Kawhi. Kawhi also finished second in 2016. It will not remove guys like Anthony Davis though.

I think I prefer Snake's idea tbh. Arguing about real-life teams adds an element of nostalgia to the game which can't be recaptured if we mix players from different eras. This is probably what made the last draft so unique, not the fact we could draft several players all at once. It's unfortunate you couldn't make it. It was a fun game!

[Larry_Russell]

what about a franchise draft

First player you chose you have to also chose the franchise for which season you are chosing, then all other players you draft, you have to use a season that they played for that same team.

IE:
Chose Lebron in round 1, but you pick Cleveland Lebron, then all other players you chose must be a Cleveland season. .

Can have multiple posters select same team.

[Snakebites]

You are right, of course. My bad about Kawhi-CP3.

It's not necessarily a real-life core, but it's still a group of guys from the same team. Difference is we are allowed to mix players from different eras.

We can add guys who were 2nd in MVP voting. This will remove Paul and Kawhi. Kawhi also finished second in 2016. It will not remove guys like Anthony Davis though.

I think I prefer Snake's idea tbh. Arguing about real-life teams adds an element of nostalgia to the game which can't be recaptured if we mix players from different eras. This is probably what made the last draft so unique, not the fact we could draft several players all at once. It's unfortunate you couldn't make it. It was a fun game!

Do you still think the Celtics core is OP if 2008 (the year they actually won) can’t be taken?

I’m more concerned about Cavs Lebron, though those teams have their warts too.

[flaco]

We can add guys who were 2nd in MVP voting. This will remove Paul and Kawhi. Kawhi also finished second in 2016. It will not remove guys like Anthony Davis though.

I think I prefer Snake's idea tbh. Arguing about real-life teams adds an element of nostalgia to the game which can't be recaptured if we mix players from different eras. This is probably what made the last draft so unique, not the fact we could draft several players all at once. It's unfortunate you couldn't make it. It was a fun game!

Do you still think the Celtics core is OP if 2008 (the year they actually won) can’t be taken?

I’m more concerned about Cavs Lebron, though those teams have their warts too.

The 2009 Celtics recorded the best season start in franchise history, starting at 21–2, the longest winning streak in franchise history at 19 and the best season start in NBA history with 27–2. Long story short, they were a dominant team. Only reason they didn't win in 2009 is KG suffered a season-ending injury in February. Thing is, that's a non-factor for our draft cause he had already played more than half the games.

How about we expand the all-NBA 1st team restriction to include 2nd teamers as well? This way the big 3 core becomes ineligible cause both Ray and Pierce have made the all-NBA 2nd team.

[Snakebites]

I think I prefer Snake's idea tbh. Arguing about real-life teams adds an element of nostalgia to the game which can't be recaptured if we mix players from different eras. This is probably what made the last draft so unique, not the fact we could draft several players all at once. It's unfortunate you couldn't make it. It was a fun game!

Do you still think the Celtics core is OP if 2008 (the year they actually won) can’t be taken?

I’m more concerned about Cavs Lebron, though those teams have their warts too.

The 2009 Celtics recorded the best season start in franchise history, starting at 21–2, the longest winning streak in franchise history at 19 and the best season start in NBA history with 27–2. Long story short, they were a dominant team. Only reason they didn't win in 2009 is KG suffered a season-ending injury in February. Thing is, that's a non-factor for our draft cause he had already played more than half the games.

How about we expand the all-NBA 1st team restriction to include 2nd teamers as well? This way the big 3 core becomes ineligible cause both Ray and Pierce have made the all-NBA 2nd team.

I dunno. I suppose. It looked to me like KG wasn’t as good statistically that year. I feel like that could have unintended consequences and eliminate cores that aren’t OP. It also doesn’t eliminate the Cavs.

I’ve run out of steam for the moment. Only so much mental tinkering I can do on one idea at least for now. To me if it requires this many contrivances to mold a concept into something workable maybe the idea just doesn’t have a solid foundation.

Kill your darlings, as they say.

If someone else wants to pick up the ball go for it.

[durantbird]

East Cross Era Duos.

In each round you pick two players from the same franchise in the East, one from 1989-90 to 2008-09, and one from 2009-10 to 2022-23.

We did similar versions with other eras and all teams included. Limiting to the East should be more challenging.

[Laimbeer]

We need votes in the other games. Both are withering on the vine.

If memory serves, back in the day we didn't start a new draft until the prior game finished the playoffs. At least the new game commish sought the agreement of the prior game commish to do so. Now we started the East Coast Pairs draft while TWO playoffs were unfinished.

Policy change needed? No new draft until there is only one other game in progress?

[Fadeaway_J]

We need votes in the other games. Both are withering on the vine.

If memory serves, back in the day we didn't start a new draft until the prior game finished the playoffs. At least the new game commish sought the agreement of the prior game commish to do so. Now we started the East Coast Pairs draft while TWO playoffs were unfinished.

Policy change needed? No new draft until there is only one other game in progress?

Don't think it was ever an official policy, but it's definitely best to only have one game ongoing before starting a new one (and then preferably in the latter stages).

The pace of voting has also been way too slow lately.

[Snakebites]

We need votes in the other games. Both are withering on the vine.

If memory serves, back in the day we didn't start a new draft until the prior game finished the playoffs. At least the new game commish sought the agreement of the prior game commish to do so. Now we started the East Coast Pairs draft while TWO playoffs were unfinished.

Policy change needed? No new draft until there is only one other game in progress?

The Shaq one just finished right?

[Larry_Russell]

I think we should do a draft that eliminates players playing for any of the 10 last teams to win a championship or so years.
So no
Denver
GS
Bucks
Lakers
Raptors
Cavs
Spurs
Heat
Mavs
Celtics

no player seasons can be used for any of the above franchises

[Snakebites]

I said it in the draft thread, but I think the logical step is to do the draft we just did with the West.

[durantbird]

Vince Billups Draft, in honor of their HOF induction.

All their franchises included:

Toronto Atlanta Nets Dallas Memphis Orlando Sacramento Pheonix Detroit Denver Minny Boston Clippers Knicks

[MadNESS]

Vince Billups Draft, in honor of their HOF induction.

All their franchises included:

Toronto Atlanta Nets Dallas Memphis Orlando Sacramento Pheonix Detroit Denver Minny Boston Clippers Knicks

How about teammates of them but any year of that teammate

[durantbird]

Vince Billups Draft, in honor of their HOF induction.

All their franchises included:

Toronto Atlanta Nets Dallas Memphis Orlando Sacramento Pheonix Detroit Denver Minny Boston Clippers Knicks

How about teammates of them but any year of that teammate

I suspect that might be somewhat too short in talent even if we add Michael Cooper teammates

[MadNESS]

Vince Billups Draft, in honor of their HOF induction.

All their franchises included:

Toronto Atlanta Nets Dallas Memphis Orlando Sacramento Pheonix Detroit Denver Minny Boston Clippers Knicks

How about teammates of them but any year of that teammate

I suspect that might be somewhat too short in talent even if we add Michael Cooper teammates

Any year of these players:

Billups
VC
Cooper
Magic
Kareem
Worthy
Scott
Tmac
Kidd
Dirk
Marion
Marc
Conley
Trae
Christie
Dwight
Bosh
Brook
Brand
Jet
Fox
Grant Hill
Hakeem
Nash
Odom
Ben Wallace
Rasheed Wallace
Rip
Prince
KG
Carmelo
Webber
CP3
Blake
DeAndre
Amare
Bledsoe
Vlade

Maybe 8 guys?