Put Them Over the Top Draft Round 1: Square vs Laimbeer

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Put Them Over the Top Draft Round 1: Square vs Laimbeer 

Post#1 » by Snakebites » Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:32 pm

Here is a quick list of what you need in your writeup.

1. Specific years for each player on your team
2. Rotations and minutes for each player
3. Reasoning as to why your team will win and/or why people should vote for you.

Do not vote in this thread until both managers have submitted their writeups.

If writeups aren't posted within 24 hours, we will vote solely based on the players they have drafted (and any rotations they have posted on their roster page).

**First to 3 votes advances**

Square wrote:...

Laimbeer wrote:...
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Re: Put Them Over the Top Draft Round 1: Square vs Laimbeer 

Post#2 » by Square » Tue Mar 19, 2024 4:30 pm

Team Square

Roster
G Russell Westbrook '16: 24/8/10/2, +8 BPM, All-NBA 1st
G Klay Thompson '15: 22/3/3, 46/44/88 shooting, 3.1 3PM/G, +4 BPM, All-NBA 3rd, NBA champ
G/F Brent Barry '06: 12/5/4/1 per 36, 40% 3P% on 6 3PA/36, +3 BPM
G/F Thabo Sefolosha '12: 8/5/2/2/1 per 36, 44% 3P%, 2nd in NBA in DRAPM
F Kevin Durant '16: 28/8/5/1/1, 51/39/90 shooting, +10 BPM, All-NBA 2nd
F Lamar Odom '09: 11/8/3, 32% 3P%, 2nd in NBA in RAPM (1st in playoffs), NBA champ
F/C Serge Ibaka '16: 13/7, 2 BPG, 33% 3P% on 2.4 3PA/G. Playoffs: +4 BPM
C Steven Adams '16: 8/7, 1 BPG, 62 TS% (Playoffs: 10/10 on +2 BPM), 5th in NBA in DRAPM



Picks and FGA:
Spoiler:
core: Durant (19.2), Westbrook (18.1), Ibaka (11.1), Adams (5.3)
all-star wild card: Thompson (16.9)
non all-star wild cards: Odom (9.0), Barry (4.7), Sefolosha (3.7)

Total FGA: 88.0


Rotation:
G Westbrook 38 / Barry 10
G Klay 38 / Barry 6 / Sefolosha 4
F Durant 38 / Sefolosha 10
F Ibaka 16 / Odom 32
C Adams 30 / Ibaka 18


About Team Square:

The '16 Thunder were built around size, athleticism, and two MVP-level players in their primes. In the playoffs, they overwhelmed the '16 Spurs -- one of the best regular season teams of all time (+11.3 net rating!) featuring peak Kawhi -- and came damn close to knocking off the 73-win Warriors.

What they lacked most was consistent outside shooting. Their non-KD wings were Dion Waiters, Andre Roberson, and Randy Foye. (Ugh.)

Now they have one of the greatest movement shooters of all-time in their old nemesis Klay Thompson. In Odom, we enhance their size and athleticism with a versatile big who can handle, rebound, shoot, defend, and was 2nd in the whole damn league in RAPM. Barry and Sefolosha add more shooting, ball-handling, and wing defense.

Offensively, Westbrook is impossible to keep out of the paint, and with Klay, Durant, and floor-spacers at the 4 the offense is going to be tough to stop. I also want to emphasize our offensive rebounding, which is going to be a major advantage with our size up front and the athleticism of Westbrook and KD.

Defensively, Ibaka, Odom, and Adams are all fearsome. (Adams in fact was 5th in the NBA in DRAPM.) With KD at the 3 and our ultra-athletic perimeter of Westbrook/Klay/Sefolosha, we are long with tons of rim protection. Gonna be hard to score on that.

The ‘16 Thunder were already awesome, and I don’t think it would take much to push them over the top. We’ve given them enough.


vs. Laimbeer:
Laimbeer built a nice team, but I think we have some advantages here. Mainly, I think our big advantages are size, rebounding, scoring at the rim, and defense.

When we are on offense, there is not a really a ton of resistance to our attacks. Like last game, I think if you are facing Westbrook/Durant with Klay spacing and you don’t have good rim protection, you are in serious trouble. Laimbeer’s team is lacking in this area – Perkins is a big body but by age 33 he had slowed down and was blocking a grand 0.5 shots per game. He is also pretty overstretched here, forced to play 36 mpg (vs. the 29 mpg he played in reality).

There are also no guards on Laimbeer’s team I really trust to stay in front of Westbrook. By ‘08 Billups was not really an elite defender in my recollection, and even in his prime he often preferred to use his strength to guard up and have Rip defend quicker guards. George and Kawhi I would think are not suited to the task, being more used to guarding wings.

Laimbeer does of course have good wing defenders in George and Kawhi (though both somewhat past their defensive peaks) but I think there is only so much they can do without size behind them. Even in real life, neither of them ever had much success against KD:

Durant vs. Kawhi (career, 37 games): 27 ppg on 61 TS%
Durant vs. George (career, 18 games): 30 ppg on 65 TS%

Lastly, as with last game, I want to point out that we are going to feast on the offensive glass against Laimbeer’s smaller squad.

On the other end, our size and athleticism makes things tough. Odom, Ibaka, and Durant at various times with their size will do a good job taking away Kawhi’s bully ball game, turning him into more of a jump-shooter (where he is still good, just not quite as dangerous). Certainly Klay and Sefolosha can also get time on him in our big switchy perimeter. Durant, Klay, Sefolosha can all take turns on George as needed, with Westbrook or Klay able to guard Billups or Bane as needed.

Overall, Laimbeer’s team (like the 20’s Clippers) is very dependent on guys setting up jumpers for themselves off the dribble. There’s not a lot of rim pressure or high-level passing. The shooters are good, but I think it makes them a little easier to guard than our more forceful attack.
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Re: Put Them Over the Top Draft Round 1: Square vs Laimbeer 

Post#3 » by Laimbeer » Tue Mar 19, 2024 8:48 pm

Sam Perkins ( 1995 ) 9.0 - All-D Votes, 39.7% on 4.2 3PA
Kawhi Leonard ( 2021 ) 17.5 - All-NBA, all-D, 39.8% on 4.9 3PA
Paul George ( 2021 ) 17.6 - All-NBA, all-D votes, 41.1% on 7.7 3PA
Desmond Bane ( 2023 ) 16.2 - All-D Votes, 39.7% on 4.2 3PA
Chauncey Billups ( 2008 ) 11.2 - DPOY Votes, 40.1% on 4.4 3PA

Robert Williams ( 2021 ) 5 - Highest PER of career, 3.3 blocks per 36
Nic Batum ( 2021 ) 6.1 - Excellent D, 40.4% on 4.1 3PA
Terrance Mann ( 2021 ) 5.2 - Highest PER of career, 41.8% on 1.4 3PA

87.9 / 88.0 87.8

Sam Perkins (36) / Robert Williams (12)
Kawhi Leonard (38) / Nic Batum (10)
Paul George (38) / Nic Batum (10)
Desmond Bane (28) / Terrance Mann (12) / Nic Batum (6)
Chauncey Billups (38) / Desmond Bane (10)


Offensively, we've got three elite scoring weapons, eye-popping spacing, and the perfect floor general for this group in Chauncey. Adams wasn't a great defender and will be useless away from the hoop. Ibaka will get stuck on Kawhi or George, which will take him away from what he does best defensively - help defense. Kawhi, George, and Bane should feast in this setting.

Their offense is quite limited spacing wise with Adams, Ibaka, and Westbrook offering little in that area. We've got solid answers all-around defensively in Perkins/Adams, Kawhi/KD, George/Ibaka, Bane/Thompson, and Chauncey/Westbrook. Chauncey hadn't declined by 2008. Sam Perkins was always respected as a defender (got a few all-D votes) and will have a standout cast in front of him as he did when he acchored outstanding units in Seattle.

In the end, I think the balance and spacing of our offense, as well as having solid covers in situations where they can thrive on defense wins this.

In the end
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Re: Put Them Over the Top Draft Round 1: Square vs Laimbeer 

Post#4 » by flaco » Tue Mar 19, 2024 9:23 pm

Square has the edge on talent. Laimbeer has the edge on fit thanks to superior spacing. I'd argue better spacing equals higher scoring efficiency despite the talent deficit. Adams would be all over the place on D trying to defend the perimeter.

Vote: Laimbeer
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Re: Put Them Over the Top Draft Round 1: Square vs Laimbeer 

Post#5 » by Colbinii » Tue Mar 19, 2024 9:28 pm

Kawhi/PG/Bane is a hell of a trio of wings [Extremely similar team to flaco's actually, with the 3 wings, a utility PG and floor spacing undersized C]. In this match-up, however, the Thunder are a perimeter oriented team with the penetration of Westbrook and Klay/Durant feeding off that rim penetration. The Thunder still have tremendous size without sacrificing much spacing here while Odom/Barry exceed Laimbeer's strong bench.

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Re: Put Them Over the Top Draft Round 1: Square vs Laimbeer 

Post#6 » by Dr Positivity » Tue Mar 19, 2024 9:45 pm

Bad matchup for Square as I don't love those bigs chasing around perimeter players on D and I can see Kawhi being the dominant player in the series. Bane also gives Laimbeer more of a 4th option. Square's bench is a bit better but Laimbeer's is solid. Vote Laimbeer.
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Re: Put Them Over the Top Draft Round 1: Square vs Laimbeer 

Post#7 » by Fadeaway_J » Wed Mar 20, 2024 2:25 am

Really believe Square should have gone smaller to start here with Odom replacing Adams. Ibaka would be better able to match up with Perkins, and Odom adds mobility to guard the perimeter without sacrificing much size. I feel like Square will struggle to deal with the five-out lineup during those early minutes, leaving them playing catchup for the rest of the game. Don't think Adams dominating the offensive glass does enough to redress the balance.

Vote: Laimbeer
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Re: Put Them Over the Top Draft Round 1: Square vs Laimbeer 

Post#8 » by Square » Wed Mar 20, 2024 1:24 pm

Ugh, even when I think my team is good it crashes and burns. GG Laimbeer.
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Re: Put Them Over the Top Draft Round 1: Square vs Laimbeer 

Post#9 » by Snakebites » Wed Mar 20, 2024 1:25 pm

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