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Our Projected Depth Chart

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Post#376 Re: Our Projected Depth Chart
Sat Oct 27, 2012 3:39 pm by loot

I was wondering, with Serpahin playing really well late last year and Okafor being quite limited, wouldn't it be smarter to play Serpahin with the starters? I'd assume he's the future at C and you want to 'evolve' him as a player rather than Giving Okafor most of the minutes? Okafor has got one year left so whether he plays or not: he'll be very interesting as a expiring contract next year. Plus, wouldn't the combination of Nene and Serpahin provide more front court scoring?
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Post#377 Re: Our Projected Depth Chart
Sat Oct 27, 2012 9:06 pm by SUPERBALLMAN

Agree final cuts are gonna be tough and very unpredictable right now.

Definites are Okafor, Seraphin, Nene, Vesely, Booker, Singleton, Ariza, Webster, Beal, Crawford, Price, Wall.

That leaves a max of 3 spots between Barron, Cook, Martin, Pargo, Mack.

Martin I think is the surest keeper of the group due to lack of depth at his position and lack of his skill (outside shooting) on the roster. He has also proven himself in the regular season for this coaching staff, accepts his role, works hard with good attitude and low salary.

Barron is suddenly a wild card. He played really well last night against Duncan. For a team with a bunch of injury issues in the frontcourt (Nene, Okafor, Seraphin, Booker), he could provide valuable depth. Also, for a team not loaded with size he would be the team's only 7 footer. Also I assume he got the starting opp last night based on playing good in practice, and he delivered. Call me crazy, but to me that performance was enough to beat out Cook for a spot at the end of our bench.

The Mack vs Pargo choice is tough. I think they have played pretty evenly. Mack IMO may get the edge due to more upside/youth (this being his 1st training camp), and has shown excellent work ethic and attitude since coming here. Pargo could get the spot though with management's fondness for adding vets, as well as his outside shooting. I keep expecting Mack to shoot better than he does, I seemed to think of him as a good shooter in college and in fact more of a SG than PG, so I do think he still has the potential to improve in that regard. Personally, of the two I would keep Mack.

So that's what I've got... them going to a full roster of 15 with Martin, Barron, and Mack. We'll soon see what they actually do.
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Post#378 Re: Our Projected Depth Chart
Sat Oct 27, 2012 9:18 pm by Nivek

I agree with your definites, although Crawford SHOULD be on the cut list. I don't see the cuts as difficult, though.

Mack over Pargo.

Cook over Barron.

Martin makes the team despite poor preseason play because of what he's done the past couple years and his guaranteed contract.

Barron and Pargo have both been bad in the preseason. Mack and Cook have been at least okay. Easy choices, in my view.

That said, I'd be perfectly willing to cut Barron, Cook, Pargo and Crawford and go shopping for other minimum salary bench filler. I think the Wiz could find street free agents who would do a better job than anyone in that group.
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Post#379 Re: Our Projected Depth Chart
Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:11 pm by hands11

loot wrote:I was wondering, with Serpahin playing really well late last year and Okafor being quite limited, wouldn't it be smarter to play Serpahin with the starters? I'd assume he's the future at C and you want to 'evolve' him as a player rather than Giving Okafor most of the minutes? Okafor has got one year left so whether he plays or not: he'll be very interesting as a expiring contract next year. Plus, wouldn't the combination of Nene and Serpahin provide more front court scoring?


If we have that problem, then everyone is healthy.

Those ideas has been posted plenty of times in the past. But again, who starts isn't going to be all that important since Randy will play 10 men deep and they will all be getting 20-25 minutes.

Nene, Okafor with Booker, Kevin
Nene, Kevin with Booker, Okafor

There will be Ves combinations as well.

They should all work. One good things is that both Nene and Booker are good passers. That's going to help. Hell, Kevin and Ves are good passers as well. The interior passing should be fun to watch this year.
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Post#380 Re: Our Projected Depth Chart
Sun Oct 28, 2012 3:48 am by loot

Thanks for the insights Hands. I've been hoping for major minutes for Kevin since he was drafted, like him a lot as a starter!
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Post#381 Re: Our Projected Depth Chart
Sun Oct 28, 2012 9:31 am by payitforward

Nivek wrote:Webster isn't just playing like a legit starter -- his overall production in the preseason rates about the same as what Lebron James did last season. Much of it on outlandishly good efficiency (138 ortg). Hard to imagine him keeping up anything close to that.

On a small sample of 173 minutes, I have Webster w/ a WP48 of .326. That's stellar -- LeBron-like, as you say.

But it's not the only interesting result:

Price was a big surprise. He played 163 minutes and was quite good, posting a .174 WP48 -- better, for example, than any comparable stretch by John Wall (or is there a 163 minute stretch to be found in wch Wall played this well?). Now... he went 13-25 on 3 pt shots, a pace that he obviously won't maintain.

Booker played about the way he played last year -- a little behind that pace, actually, because in this very small sample of 81 minutes he rebounded substantially below his usual pace. Mack played to about the same level as last year.

Chris Singleton was a big, and very positive, surprise. Again, a small sample, but in 111 minutes he played to a .267 WP48. That's all star production; even if he doesn't maintain that level, wch would be expecting too much, it's still a great sign of development.

On the other hand, Beal was not good overall: e.g. he shot 38% (28% from 3-point range).

Vesely was awful. Cook was ok. Barron was just awful despite Hands' comments -- shot 40%, turned it over, etc. Not an NBA player.

Whether you place much confidence in WP48 or not, these are still interesting results: esp. for Webster, Price and Singleton. A team that started guys who produced at that level would win a lot of games.
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Post#382 Re: Our Projected Depth Chart
Sun Oct 28, 2012 11:50 am by hands11

loot wrote:Thanks for the insights Hands. I've been hoping for major minutes for Kevin since he was drafted, like him a lot as a starter!


In a lot of way, Kevin is the man to watch this year. There are a lot to watch actually. Booker as well. Could Webster stick ? But back to Kevin.

He finished last year very strong and he grow his game a ton last year. Now we need to know two things. First, can he repeat what he started. And two, can he extend on it. If he can do the later, that begs the question, is he the third piece to the Wall/Beal long term core. The kid is still very young and just getting started.

Clearly this team is not built at the level of a Miami, LA, SA or OKC type teams. That would take several players that are already here becoming top all stars with at least one MVP type. That would be incredibly lucky. We are talking about teams that have Howard, Koke, Paul G, and Nash on the same team. Or LeBron, Wade, Bosh and Ray Allen on the same team. That is a whole different level. Your talking team with several HOF players on them.

But the Wizards could have the pieces to become a solid 4-6th type team that would make a run if they can establish a top defensive team and other teams have injury problems. Wall, Beal, Webster, Kevin can all become very good players. Booker could be a true stud. Really looking forward to seeing what he can do this year. And shorter team Nene is already very good. If they can get him healthy, that would change a lot.
There is even a good chance for Singleton to still prove he is a legit player. He is looking a lot better this year in preseason. His is shooting a with confidence. He has a solid frame for the NBA.

The team has some legit talent. Should be an interesting year. Plenty of room to players to step it up and prove they can be CONSISTENT professional solid NBA players. This is a big year in the rebuild. They have a lot to evaluate regarding who stays and who gets bundled in a trade.

They are clearly not a LAL type model. More of a Bulls type team but not a carbon copy. One super star and a lot of solid players. Solid team D. Lots of players who can pass and play team ball. And plenty of touch guys.

Every team is always building at some level or another so this isn't over. Once they see what they have, they will see better what they need to add next. As of today, they clearly can upgrade by adding better SGs behind Beal. Imagine this team with just one more above average stud at SG. It would look pretty solid. That shouldn't be that hard to do.
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Post#383 Re: Our Projected Depth Chart
Sun Oct 28, 2012 12:10 pm by hands11

payitforward wrote:
Nivek wrote:Webster isn't just playing like a legit starter -- his overall production in the preseason rates about the same as what Lebron James did last season. Much of it on outlandishly good efficiency (138 ortg). Hard to imagine him keeping up anything close to that.

On a small sample of 173 minutes, I have Webster w/ a WP48 of .326. That's stellar -- LeBron-like, as you say.

But it's not the only interesting result:

Price was a big surprise. He played 163 minutes and was quite good, posting a .174 WP48 -- better, for example, than any comparable stretch by John Wall (or is there a 163 minute stretch to be found in wch Wall played this well?). Now... he went 13-25 on 3 pt shots, a pace that he obviously won't maintain.

Booker played about the way he played last year -- a little behind that pace, actually, because in this very small sample of 81 minutes he rebounded substantially below his usual pace. Mack played to about the same level as last year.

Chris Singleton was a big, and very positive, surprise. Again, a small sample, but in 111 minutes he played to a .267 WP48. That's all star production; even if he doesn't maintain that level, wch would be expecting too much, it's still a great sign of development.

On the other hand, Beal was not good overall: e.g. he shot 38% (28% from 3-point range).

Vesely was awful. Cook was ok. Barron was just awful despite Hands' comments -- shot 40%, turned it over, etc. Not an NBA player.

Whether you place much confidence in WP48 or not, these are still interesting results: esp. for Webster, Price and Singleton. A team that started guys who produced at that level would win a lot of games.


Lets not misrepresent my position on Barron. I only suggested keeping him in the context of the teams roster and injuries to start the year until they know how healthy Nene and Kevin are. Then he would get cut when they return. We have Booker with a hammy. Nene with a foot. Kevin with a calf. Oakfor returning from injury last year. I don't like the idea of going into games with Ves as the only healthy center and Singleton as the PF.

Now I doubt all of those injuries will be problems at the same time but we already know Nene and Kevin are questions. And we know Booker and Okafor can flair up at any time. So to start the year, given what they had in camp, I suggested keep both Barron and Cook to start the year. That's all. Just making the best of a uncertain start to the year.

Here are his numbers from 2 of the last 4 games played in the preseason of which he played in only 3 of them.

http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400400574

http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400400519

Just to start the year, they could use him as some form of insurance if Nene and Kevin are out.


Webster/Trevor A
Booker/Singleton
Okafor/Ves/Barron/Cook

Because if Booker pulls up lame ( already fighting a hammy), Ves or Okafor have to move to PF and things are looking depleted at center.
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Post#384 Re: Our Projected Depth Chart
Sun Oct 28, 2012 7:52 pm by hands11

http://www.bulletsforever.com/2012/10/2 ... s-released

Mack and Cook released.

Thats along the lines of what I expected/hoped. Would have been nice to keep Cook as well but Martin is owed 1M and they already chose him over Mason so they are going to ride it out.


Wall/Price/Pargo
Beal/Crawford/Martin
Webster/Singlton/Trevor A
Nene/Booker/Ves
Okafor/Kevin/Barron

So to start the season they have.

Price/Pargo
Beal/Crawford/Martin
Webster/Trevor A
Booker/Singleton
Okafor/Ves/Barron

Maybe Randy is thinking more..

Price/Crawford/Pargo
Beal/Webster/Martin
Singleton/Trevor A
Booker/Ves
Okafor/Barron

I expect Crawford will play some PG sets even if Pargo is in there with him just because he is a better ball handler/assists and Pargo is more of a shooter anyway. Plus if Crawford is more focused on PG duties, maybe he won't chuck as much.

Singleton will continue to get some burn at PF until Nene or Kevin return.
Ves will get minute at PF and Center

Good move letting Mack go. He wasn't sticking around longer term anyway. Just not quick enough and not a good enough shooter to make up for it.

And Cook will probably still be there available if and when they want to cut Barron and add his stretch big range.

Good moves.
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Post#385 Re: Our Projected Depth Chart
Sun Oct 28, 2012 8:05 pm by Chocolate City Jordanaire

Nivek wrote:I agree with your definites, although Crawford SHOULD be on the cut list. I don't see the cuts as difficult, though.

Mack over Pargo.

Cook over Barron.


Martin makes the team despite poor preseason play because of what he's done the past couple years and his guaranteed contract.

Barron and Pargo have both been bad in the preseason. Mack and Cook have been at least okay. Easy choices, in my view.

That said, I'd be perfectly willing to cut Barron, Cook, Pargo and Crawford and go shopping for other minimum salary bench filler. I think the Wiz could find street free agents who would do a better job than anyone in that group.


At least the Wizards consistently get it wrong, Nivek.
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Post#386 Re: Our Projected Depth Chart
Sun Oct 28, 2012 8:53 pm by TheBigThree

Having Pargo and Crawford on the same team is not a recipe for success.
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Post#387 Re: Our Projected Depth Chart
Sun Oct 28, 2012 8:57 pm by payitforward

Chocolate City Jordanaire wrote:
Nivek wrote:I agree with your definites, although Crawford SHOULD be on the cut list. I don't see the cuts as difficult, though.

Mack over Pargo.

Cook over Barron.


Martin makes the team despite poor preseason play because of what he's done the past couple years and his guaranteed contract.

Barron and Pargo have both been bad in the preseason. Mack and Cook have been at least okay. Easy choices, in my view.

That said, I'd be perfectly willing to cut Barron, Cook, Pargo and Crawford and go shopping for other minimum salary bench filler. I think the Wiz could find street free agents who would do a better job than anyone in that group.


At least the Wizards consistently get it wrong, Nivek.

Yup. What a couple of terrible decisions.
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Post#388 Re: Our Projected Depth Chart
Sun Oct 28, 2012 10:29 pm by Chocolate City Jordanaire

Nivek wrote:
<snipped>

That said, I'd be perfectly willing to cut Barron, Cook, Pargo and Crawford and go shopping for other minimum salary bench filler. I think the Wiz could find street free agents who would do a better job than anyone in that group.


Joshua Akognon, Damion James, Sundiata Gaines, Ike Diogu, Andrew Goudelock to name a few.
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Post#389 Re: Our Projected Depth Chart
Mon Oct 29, 2012 11:22 am by Dat2U

So the rotation is this?

G A.J. Price / Jannero Pargo
G Jordan Crawford / Bradley Beal
F Martell Webster / Trevor Ariza / Cartier Martin
F Trevor Booker / Chris Singleton / Jan Vesely
C Emeka Okafor / Kevin Seraphin / Earl Barron

Honestly I would be shocked if we average 90 ppg a game. In fact 90 might be a season high.
hands11 wrote:Of course Dray was an idiot. So were the fans for endlessly booing him. Had they not done that, they could have actually keep him around and traded him when his value wasn't rock bottom.
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Post#390 Re: Our Projected Depth Chart
Mon Oct 29, 2012 11:57 am by hands11

payitforward wrote:
Chocolate City Jordanaire wrote:
Nivek wrote:I agree with your definites, although Crawford SHOULD be on the cut list. I don't see the cuts as difficult, though.

Mack over Pargo.

Cook over Barron.


Martin makes the team despite poor preseason play because of what he's done the past couple years and his guaranteed contract.

Barron and Pargo have both been bad in the preseason. Mack and Cook have been at least okay. Easy choices, in my view.

That said, I'd be perfectly willing to cut Barron, Cook, Pargo and Crawford and go shopping for other minimum salary bench filler. I think the Wiz could find street free agents who would do a better job than anyone in that group.


At least the Wizards consistently get it wrong, Nivek.

Yup. What a couple of terrible decisions.


Come on

Pargo over Mack and
Barron over Cook

Hardly qualify as terrible. These are two decisions of preference on the margin for two players that wouldn't even be active once everyone is healthy. Mack lost out to Price. Your crying Wolf. Save your disgust for something worthy of it. Specially since both Mack and Cook will likely be sitting home if they want to call them back. Maybe some team takes a flyer on Cook as a stretch PF/C. Maybe. But most rosters are full right now. Its going to take a few weeks for injuries to happen that would open a slot for him.

As for Mack. I double there is a line of teams looking to add him anytime soon. Same deal. Rosters are full. When injuries happen, maybe he finds a home as a back up.
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Post#391 Re: Our Projected Depth Chart
Mon Oct 29, 2012 12:55 pm by payitforward

hands11 wrote:Come on

Pargo over Mack and
Barron over Cook

Hardly qualify as terrible.

By which you mean that the delta between the better two and the worse two who were kept isn't meaningful over the small number of minutes you think they'll play. Ok, I understand what you mean.

Only, if you can't make the easy decisions, how you going to make the hard ones? Of course, you're still loving the Okafor/Ariza acquisition.

Once again, 16 players picked after Mack in '11 are on nba teams. Pretty much all of them better teams than the Wizards.

Once again, Mack clearly outplayed Pargo in pre-season, and Barron played in a way that shouldn't get him onto any NBA roster, while Cook wasn't bad.

Tell me, what would it take for you to actually think that Ernie Grunfield made a mistake as a GM? Would he have to trade for someone who actually was dead? How about if he picked a guy in the draft who actually plays in the paralympics?

Would either of those be enough?
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Post#392 Re: Our Projected Depth Chart
Mon Oct 29, 2012 1:13 pm by montestewart

payitforward wrote:Tell me, what would it take for you to actually think that Ernie Grunfield made a mistake as a GM? Would he have to trade for someone who actually was dead? How about if he picked a guy in the draft who actually plays in the paralympics?

OK, so he's dead, but really, it was a 2nd round pick. Worth a shot, right? Even if it turns out he'd been shot. He was going to be riding pine anyway, so what does it matter if that pine has a lid on it? Really people, you're making a big deal over nothing.
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Post#393 Re: Our Projected Depth Chart
Mon Oct 29, 2012 4:34 pm by hands11

payitforward wrote:
hands11 wrote:Come on

Pargo over Mack and
Barron over Cook

Hardly qualify as terrible.

By which you mean that the delta between the better two and the worse two who were kept isn't meaningful over the small number of minutes you think they'll play. Ok, I understand what you mean.

Only, if you can't make the easy decisions, how you going to make the hard ones? Of course, you're still loving the Okafor/Ariza acquisition.

Once again, 16 players picked after Mack in '11 are on nba teams. Pretty much all of them better teams than the Wizards.

Once again, Mack clearly outplayed Pargo in pre-season, and Barron played in a way that shouldn't get him onto any NBA roster, while Cook wasn't bad.

Tell me, what would it take for you to actually think that Ernie Grunfield made a mistake as a GM? Would he have to trade for someone who actually was dead? How about if he picked a guy in the draft who actually plays in the paralympics?

Would either of those be enough?


I never said that.

But I did read between the lines and predict that Ted/EG would trade Lewis for one or more players. Why ? Ted said as much. They were going to amnesty Dray if they couldnt move him and Ted wasn't going to eat all the Lewis money on top of that. Is that what I would have done. No. But its not my money. But I can understand not waning to spend 20 + Mil on players you don't have. Specially after doing it on Gil and then Lewis.

As for who I wanted instead of Mack, I wanted them to take a chance on Jerome Tyler. I said that several times. I wanted them to keep Livingston. I wanted them to keep Mason. And everyone wanted James back. But no NBA team signed him for what he wanted.

I did want Beal ever since I saw him first interviewed back when he was ranked like 20th in the draft so I'm happy they landed him.

I did hate an Abe owned team. Or a EFJ coached team. So while everything hasn't gone as I would have done it, I like the Ted/EG/Randy front office better then anything since Nash/Lynam. I like that they did a hard reboot. I agree with them moving McGee, Nick and Dray when they did and I pulled for each and everyone of them when other didn't. So I'm net positive compared to what I have been rooting for in the past with hope for even better in the future. I see a young group with stop gap vets. I see what may be a very pleasant surprise find in Webster. I see a solid young SG in Beal and great finds in Booker and Kevin. Singleton may still even pane out. Wall could still end up a total stud and Ves still shows promise.

Look, there will always be players that front offices miss on every year. Look where Nash was taken. Look at Tony Parker, Carlos Boozer, Kyle Korver, etc.

But go year by year from 2000 till today. The vast majority of 2nd round picks don't make it. Actually the Wiz have done ok hitting on a few second round players who have stuck in the league with guys like Blatche, Steve Blake, and Dom Mac. Thing with these second rounders is, they rarely stay in one place or hit with their first team.
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Post#394 Re: Our Projected Depth Chart
Mon Oct 29, 2012 5:02 pm by montestewart

Hands, a lot of people wanted Beal. Regardless, going back to 11/26/2010, it looks like DraftExpress never had him ranked lower than 11th. When was it that he was ranked 20th, when you presciently bucked the experts and started Bealmania, charmed by an interview ?
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Post#395 Re: Our Projected Depth Chart
Sat Nov 3, 2012 8:46 pm by TheBigThree

Someone convince me this isn't the lineup we should be running with until Wall and Nene are back:

Crawford/Price/Pargo
Beal/Pargo/Cartier
Webster/(Ariza-Singleton)/Vesely
Booker/Vesely/Barron
Seraphin/Okafor/Barron

Crawford is, IMO, a better distributor than both our supposed PGs. He'll turn the ball over, but at least he takes chances and makes tough passes. Pargo is an extremely similar player and has played a combo guard roll is entire career, when Crawford needs a spell you put Price in there and let Pargo put up shots.

Could argue that Beal's bad play so far doesn't warrant keeping him in the starting lineup, but I think if you put him out there with a creative player like Crawford he'd start playing better.

Thoughts?
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