The Trade Thread

[MasterIchiro]

Cousins is the most promising young center in the league. Where he was drafted once upon a time is no longer relevant to his current value. I'd be shocked if the Kings demanded any less than a package of good prospects and high picks. No center in this current draft even approaches Cousins value so it's not like you can just pick up a Cousins any old draft let alone any draft position.

[MasterIchiro]

Raptors are shopping Bargnani. In his best year he averaged 21 PPG. It would be nice for Kemba to have an option down low. And perhaps Bismack would be more valuable if he was strictly a rebounder/defender at PF and center. It's one way to optimize the role of Bismack who seems to be busting.

[HornetJail]

Raptors are shopping Bargnani. In his best year he averaged 21 PPG. It would be nice for Kemba to have an option down low. And perhaps Bismack would be more valuable if he was strictly a rebounder/defender at PF and center. It's one way to optimize the role of Bismack who seems to be busting.

Stop it. When healthy Mullens can give us about 80% of what Bargnani can bring, while rebounding much better and not being a complete dumbass on the defensive end. Not to mention Mullens is 23, and makes a fraction as much as Bargnani does.

Also giving up MKG and several good pieces for Cousins is a terrible deal for us because it's simply an incredible overpay. I'm willing to overpay for Cousins, I really am, but as long as we still have Kemba and we still have MKG. I don't care what we trade after that. Trade our 1st, trade Detroit's 1st, trade Henderson, Sessions, Biz, whatever, but we're not trading MKG and we're not trading Kemba so get over it.

[SWedd523]

It would be nice for Kemba to have an option down low.

Then why trade for Bargnani?

[MasterIchiro]

1) Kemba is the only player I'd keep.

2) MKG plays like this next year and the bust talk will begin.

[Kembastockton]

2) MKG plays like this next year and the bust talk will begin.

Why? You guys gave me grief about calling DWill a bust and MKG is already putting up better numbers. When training camp starts next season MKG will only be 20 years and about 3 weeks old. DWill turns 22 before this current season ends.

[Snidely FC]

Hendo + Gordon for Al Jefferson

Hendo + Biz for Kanter


Would UTA do either of these trades? Would you?

[BobsBuddy]

Hendo and Biz for Kanter would be great but will not happen. Gordon for Humphries/Brooks from Brooklyn is better.

[BigSlam]

I'm really worried that Cho is going to something stupid like trade Tyrus and JT for Bargs.

[dmutombo321]

Hendo + Gordon for Al Jefferson

Hendo + Biz for Kanter


Would UTA do either of these trades? Would you?

I dont think Utah does either of those. Hendo's a slightly above avg wing but Jefferson is an All-star PF. Gordon's expiring is meaningless in that deal because Jefferson is an expiring himself who would be coming off their books if they choose to let him walk.

They would turn down trade #2 as it is insufficient value for Kanter.

I've been a big proponent of inquiring on Kanter for a long time. He's the type of young, legit center that we need going forward. Making inquiries on him should be a priority. It amazes me that people are talking about throwing huge $ at Pekovic when Kanter is easily capable of similar production and is 6 years younger and still on a rookie deal.

Quite honestly, save for Kemba, Charlotte's assets might be a stretch to get Kanter. But they should at least try. Everyone loves MKG but there is no reason to be opposed to swapping him for another equally young and equally potential-laden talent, especially considering the 2014 draft will have 3 offensively gifted SF's who are almost certainly going to be far better players than Gilchrist. Same story with Biz. If there is good value to be had, he needs to be expendable.

I'd float MKG + Biz or MKG + Portland pick for Kanter. Utah might still pass but they'd have to look hard at such an offer. An athletic lock down wing defender who could eventually be a gerald wallace type would be great next to a shooter like Hayward.

I'd pontificated on the same topic a couple days ago in another thread:

Dont under-rate Kanter and dont let his numbers fool you. He's buried behind jefferson, millsap and Favors so he gets very few minutes. When he does see the court, he produces. As Masterlchiro points out, its entirely possible MKG alone wouldnt even be enough to entice Utah. Both young players have high potential but Kanter has demonstrated more likelihood of fulfilling his than MKG. With 36 mins per night on a team like Charlotte, Kanter would be a double-double machine.

As for Monroe in summer of 2014 - He would be a stretch. Only way we'd probably be able to lure him would be over paying with a Max deal. A cheaper alternative may be to examine Hickson this summer.

A couple videos of Kanter displaying his physical defense, rebounding and advanced low post offense. Talk about pivots, drop steps and counter moves… He's like a cross between Rony Seikaly and Karl Malone.

Kanter in Pre-season
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elwOvRdY0SU[/youtube]

Holding his own last year vs. Andrew Bynum.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQ0wMlRaJRg[/youtube]

I dont dispute that MKG will be a quality player in this league. He's such a great run and jump athlete and could eventually be a lockdown wing defender in the league. I expect he'll eventually develop into a more consistent contributor on offense as well. But his offensive contributions, as we've seen in the 2-3 breakout games he has had, will always predominately consist of hustle points (fast breaks, put backs, backdoor cuts). He's never going to be a great threat to create his own offense. His line drives to the basket that were so effective against inferior athletes in college, while still effective on the break, are no longer effective vs. bigger NBA players in set half court defenses.

His jumper is of great concern to me. As various people of pointed out, theres several players with ugly looking but effective shots (i.e. shawn marion, kevin martin). But those players shots, despite looking unorthodox due to the low release points, are still fluid motions. MKG's shot is anything but and reminds me of Charles Barkley's golf swing. Until he completely re-tools his mechanics, that jumper in its present form will never be effective.

What's puzzling is that the mechanics havent changed already. We read so much in the offseason about Gilchrist working with trainers to remove the hitch/hesitation in the shot but its still there every time he launches. I would be far more encouraged if he was shooting as poorly as he is but doing so with the proper form.

If he can correct that shot and become an outside threat in a couple years, watch out. But he's got a looong way to go. Even if he doesnt, he's still a quality player on the defensive side of the ball, a fast break terror and an amazing complementary piece for any team who has a shooting two guard and post scorer to pair with him. To his credit, he's smart enough to know his limitations so he doesnt jack alot of outside shots.

Kanter has his share of limitations too. He's a below the rim center, closer to 6'10 than 6'11 IMO, is a good but not great shot blocker and could still stand to improve his FT accuracy a little more. But the man is a Bull.

Apart from Pekovic and maybe Dwight Howard, he establishes post position on offense and maintains his post ground on defense better than anyone in the league. I guarantee everyone, once Kanter is getting 36 mins per night, be it at Utah or somewhere else, you can count on a 14-17 point and 9-11 rebound guy. Utah isnt blind to this, they just happen to be in the enviable position of having two other allstar bigs and another top 3 pick big in front of him.

If we can pry him away for anyone on the roster apart from Kemba, Charlotte would be foolish to not at least make an inquiry as he could anchor the center spot for the next decade. Hell, I'd even throw in our later first rounder if necessary.[/quote]

[BlackOutBuzz]

Hendo + Gordon for Al Jefferson

Hendo + Biz for Kanter


Would UTA do either of these trades? Would you?

I'd probably do both. Definitely the first, the second one would hurt but I think it makes sense for us as well. However, I'm not sure Utah would go for either of these...

They do have some cap space though (I'm not sure if they've hit the salary floor yet), so maybe an expiring vet like Gordon would work for them, but the assumption in trading for Hendo would be that they would try to re-sign him. I fear Hendo may command 7-8 million on the market, so that's 20 million in cap space tied up in 2 SGs.

The second one is tougher to gauge, obviously they'd prefer Kanter to Biz but hey, maybe they like Hendo? We'd probably have to take back a contract or send a pick or something as well, but barring something huge I don't think they budge on Kanter.

[BlackOutBuzz]

It amazes me that people are talking about throwing huge $ at Pekovic when Kanter is easily capable of similar production and is 6 years younger and still on a rookie deal.

I think most of us would prefer Kanter to Pek, it's just not very realistic. Both guys are highly valued by their respective franchises, the main difference is that Pek is a FA this offseason, whereas Kanter is still under his rookie contract for the next 2.5 seasons. Yeah you could try to trade for him, but Utah has made it quite clear that they're determined to build through "accumulating lottery picks" (link below); so guys like Hayward, Kanter, and Favors are basically untouchable.

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/22 ... ck_Players

While the Wolves will definitely do their best to keep Pekovic, they're gonna be right up against the cap, and the going rate for quality bigs is 8 figures. I could definitely see someone swiping him away from Minnesota before someone convinces Utah to trade Kanter.

[Snidely FC]

Hendo for Mozgov & Quincy Miller

Mullens for Koufos

Does DEN do either of these? Would you?

[dmutombo321]

^ Yeah, I saw the article too Blackout. Indeed, Utah is being very smart about how they build. I dont necessarily think Hayward, Kanter and Favors are untouchable but Utah is going to be very demanding with respect to any deal that ships out any of those guys - and rightfully so.

You're right about Utah being unlikely to trade Kanter. Thats because they know he's a damn good pivot and most of the hypothetical deals tossed around wouldnt give them adequate compensation. Utah isnt giving the time of day to a Kanter deal with Hendo as the principal. They could sign him outright in FA if they want him at a figure Charlotte would be unlikely to match.

Charlotte lacks the assets to acquire Kanter without parting with Kemba or MKG. I wouldnt do Kemba but I'd certainly consider MKG.

Put MKG into the discussion who, like Kanter, a top 3 pick that is even slightly younger and Utah may at least listen. Utah is likely to retain at least one of the Jefferson, Millsap combo. Even if they trade Kanter and let Jefferson walk, they've got Favors there to slide to center. Throw in Biz to the deal, they get additional 4/5 depth.

If we grab a PF like Plumblee with that second first, we could easily replace Biz' production.

I know MKG is beloved and alot of people have visions of sugar plumbs when they think about his potential. But you cant acquire quality without giving up quality.

If this teams stays the course and doesnt overspend this offseason to become mediocre, the top franchise caliber SFs in next years draft which we should have a shot at will relegate MKG to the bench.

[Kembastockton]

I'm really worried that Cho is going to something stupid like trade Tyrus and JT for Bargs.

Well, actually as bad as Bargs is he would actually be an upgrade over JT and Tyrus. JT's potential is limited, and Tyrus is just terrible. I feel dirty for even saying that.

[Bassman]

I know MKG is beloved and alot of people have visions of sugar plumbs when they think about his potential. But you cant acquire quality without giving up quality.

If this teams stays the course and doesnt overspend this offseason to become mediocre, the top franchise caliber SFs in next years draft which we should have a shot at will relegate MKG to the bench.

Completely agree. Paint me with tar, feathers and ride me outta here on a rail in 5 years if I'm wrong, but I think MKG is fools gold. He will be a good addition to do the grimy things down the road, but that's not what you pick someone at #2 to become. Great description of his shot from an earlier post ("..as bad as Barkley's golf swing"). People expect that to just "get fixed", but it's too far gone.

I'd deal MKG & Biz for Kanter & filler, which allows us to keep and use our picks while going after a quality free agent.

[James Gatz]

It's amazing how many people are turning their backs on MKG after barely playing half a season. This after everyone loved him during our initial winning streak.

[SWedd523]

It's amazing how many people are turning their backs on MKG after barely playing half a season. This after everyone loved him during our initial winning streak.

You forget how many "experts" there are around these parts

[Liver_Pooty]

It's amazing how many people are turning their backs on MKG after barely playing half a season. This after everyone loved him during our initial winning streak.

I try to ignore such talk. Seeing trade ideas like MKG and Biyombo for Kanter just makes me giggle if anything.

Reminds me of people despising Walker last year and now they worship everything he does.

[countryboi]

I know MKG is beloved and alot of people have visions of sugar plumbs when they think about his potential. But you cant acquire quality without giving up quality.

If this teams stays the course and doesnt overspend this offseason to become mediocre, the top franchise caliber SFs in next years draft which we should have a shot at will relegate MKG to the bench.

Completely agree. Paint me with tar, feathers and ride me outta here on a rail in 5 years if I'm wrong, but I think MKG is fools gold. He will be a good addition to do the grimy things down the road, but that's not what you pick someone at #2 to become. Great description of his shot from an earlier post ("..as bad as Barkley's golf swing"). People expect that to just "get fixed", but it's too far gone.

I'd deal MKG & Biz for Kanter & filler, which allows us to keep and use our picks while going after a quality free agent.

how in the world can you give up on the two youngest players in the draft two years in a row just because they are not progress the way you think they should be and then trade them for a guy that is statistically worse than both of them... the bobcats made this bed they are going to lie in and continue to develop these players. i think kemba has every one thinking it always going to happen that fast these things take time.