2024 NBA Playoffs: West Semifinals: #2 Denver Nuggets vs #3 Minnesota Timberwolves (MIN WINS 4-3)

[Shaka_Zulu]

The league is not gonna step in and alter the outcome of a second round series unless they HAVE to. It'd be mental if they ever did and in this specific case would have major backlash. The integrity of the league is already being called out big time this year as betting got legalized in the states. They don't need any more bad press in the playoffs. A fine and move on. So let's move on ffs

I personally think he deserved more then 100k (money sign gesture plus two items thrown in, topped it off with zero remorse in interviews), would say most did since was strong reaction to the fine. But wether anything more is suspension or even heavier fines, the guy got off easy.


But one thing I can agree on we going on 4th game now and that happend on 2nd game, so it's time to move on. It doesn't matter anymore so no point to keep rehashing it.

[shrink]

We don’t know that the Nuggets would have lost Game 3. People didn’t expect the Wolves to win Game 2 without Gobert.

Fortunately we can go into Game Four tonight without either team pointing at NBA interfering. I heard though that Scott Foster is reffing this one, so who knows?

[BelgradeNugget]

This is what happened in last year playoffs, Nuggets-Suns second round

https://videorulebook.nba.com/archive/technical-foul-bench-player-throws-towel-on-court/

They are talking about DA but Josh Okogie was the one that throw towel on the court.
No suspension.

So, I would like for someone to find precendents to Murray's action. He should have been ejected from that game if refs saw him. But they didn't see him so I guess Minnesota should be awarded with 2 wins, score should be 4-0 swep, Minnesota in WCF and Murray baned for life. Satisfied?

[JM00n69]

The league is not gonna step in and alter the outcome of a second round series unless they HAVE to. It'd be mental if they ever did and in this specific case would have major backlash. The integrity of the league is already being called out big time this year as betting got legalized in the states. They don't need any more bad press in the playoffs. A fine and move on. So let's move on ffs

I personally think he deserved more then 100k (money sign gesture plus two items thrown in, topped it off with zero remorse in interviews), would say most did since was strong reaction to the fine. But wether anything more is suspension or even heavier fines, the guy got off easy.


But one thing I can agree on we going on 4th game now and that happend on 2nd game, so it's time to move on. It doesn't matter anymore so no point to keep rehashing it.

He did deserve more, this coming from a Nuggets fan btw. Regular season he would've been suspended no doubt. Context matter here though.

And about the media interview after the practice he gave, before the punishment was given out, you really think he'll come out and say he really messed up and should be suspended? This was after one of the worst beatdowns I've seen a team take. What the team says to the media needs to convey that they've bounced back mentally and are gonna be on it for the next game. Show that winning mentality instead of crying about it. Which is what he and Malone both did. They wont be opening up to how they really feel to the media, it's not a personal therapy session.

[chudak]

Maybe you’re right, and I’ll drop it. I thought every NBA fan would have supported a suspension for Murray, but I should have realized after watching Sixers fans defend Embiid’s dangerous behavior, that I expect too much. Coach Finch is contractually required to say things to support the league, or face punishments - we are not. I’m disappointed, not so much in the loss, but how quickly some fans will support even the worst behavior, as long as the guy doing it plays for their favorite team.

Dont get me wrong - I dont like what Murray did

I find it strange that there was no technical foul (if I am right, didnt watch the game live, it was at 4 am here) and I see more grounds to throw him out of the game than suspend him afterwards

I am also not a fan of players getting suspended in general

He got fined a $100k which imho is fine, without even a tech I would find a suspension unexpected. He definitely got punished

I didnt lobby for an Embiid suspension either but the Embiid thing is worse to me as he made multiple plays thag could injurse someone and he did injure someone

As far as the Beverly comparison goes I guess it was because a fan was involved and there is prior history.. I dont think he would get 4 games without that

If Murray repeated something similar I am pretty sure he would get suspended at least for a game too

As an NBA fan I would always prefer both teams play at full strength but if someone does something suspension worthy ( to me that is mostly trying to injure another person ) than I would be like “it sucks they had to suspend him but I understand why they need to do it”.

I also consider the Spurs one of my favourite teams and would still suspend Bruce Bowen for every third game for most of the **** he pulled but for something like this a tech and a fine are more than enough

[AleksandarN]

We don’t know that the Nuggets would have lost Game 3. People didn’t expect the Wolves to win Game 2 without Gobert.

Fortunately we can go into Game Four tonight without either team pointing at NBA interfering. I heard though that Scott Foster is reffing this one, so who knows?

Oh **** we are both screwed. I expect a lot of the players in foul trouble

[lessthanjake]

The bottom line is this:

The NBA is not going to suspend a star player on a contending playoff team in a series that that team is behind in, unless there’s clear precedent dictating that they clearly must do so or there were actually tangible negative consequences to the player’s actions or perhaps if the player has a significant past history of bad behavior or clear intent to harm someone. Here, Jamal Murray’s team was behind in the series and there’s really no precedent for punishment for this sort of thing either way, nor were there any tangible negative consequences to his actions, and he does not have a past history of bad behavior (nor did he appear to have intent to harm anyone here). So a suspension would’ve been quite surprising.

Of course, the weakness to that approach is that, without a suspension, it might not adequately disincentivize the behavior for others who might do it in the future. And that’s important, because it genuinely is potentially dangerous behavior. But that’s why they issued a $100k fine—that’s a lot of money, even to NBA players, and is a serious disincentive, especially for behavior that has no actual expected benefit to a player’s team (your teammate is really just as likely to get affected by it as the opposing team is).

So I don’t really think the NBA’s past method of dealing with things suggests that this was something that would get a suspension, nor do I think the way they dealt with it has left some sort of lack of disincentive.

As with many things with NBA punishment, there is a potential criticism that the penalty was dictated in part by how good the player is and what the situation in the series was. As in, maybe if Jamal Murray were a random role player and/or the Nuggets were ahead in the series, we could’ve seen a suspension. I think that’s a valid point, but we all understand that this is how it works to some degree. Fans care more about seeing star players play than role players, and the league is never keen to do something that will tend to lower the length of a series. But I’m not particularly moved by that criticism here, to be honest, since it’s not something where the lack of a suspension is inconsistent with things done in the past. This was an issue of first impression, with a player without a past history, that did not actually hurt anyone (and did not appear to have intended to hurt anyone), and it’s behavior that a large fine almost certainly can adequately disincentivize. It’s not really even clear to me that Murray would’ve been suspended for this if he were a role player and/or the Nuggets were ahead.

All that said, if Murray *had* gotten suspended, I don’t think it would’ve been outrageous either. The behavior was potentially dangerous, so a suspension would’ve been justified. But it would’ve been surprising and I think the lack of a suspension is totally reasonable too. Anyways, what I think is telling about this is that the people most upset about the lack of a suspension aren’t even really Timberwolves fans. It’s mostly just Jokic haters, who wanted Jokic to have even less of a chance of coming back in the series.

[shrink]

Known as "The Extender" to NBA fans, teams with the lead in a series typically lose when Foster is officiating. At one point in 2022, teams trailing in a series had a 19-2 record when Foster was in the building and Foster carries other interesting stats such as Chris Paul's 3-17 playoff record when Foster was officiating.

Paul isn't on the Timberwolves roster but Foster has plenty of recent history with Minnesota. Foster issued a technical foul after Rudy Gobert gave him a money gesture for a foul in the final minute of regulation during a 113-104 overtime loss to the Cleveland Cavaliers on Mar. 8 and Gobert was fined $100,000 (the same amount Nuggets guard Jamal Murray was fined for throwing a heat pack on the floor in Game 2) a few days later.

Foster was the crew chief for Game 4 of the Timberwolves playoff series with the Phoenix Suns and the two teams combined for 53 fouls after averaging 45.6 fouls in the first three games of the series. The Wolves were called for 27 fouls after averaging 23.3 fouls per game in the first three games, but came away with a 122-116 victory that completed a four-game sweep over Phoenix.

https://www.si.com/nba/timberwolves/minnesota-timberwolves-news/timberwolves-draw-referee-scott-foster-for-game-4-against-nuggets-01hxpsk61080

[JM00n69]

The bottom line is this:

The NBA is not going to suspend a star player on a contending playoff team in a series that that team is behind in, unless there’s clear precedent dictating that they clearly must do so or there were actually tangible negative consequences to the player’s actions or perhaps if the player has a significant past history of bad behavior or clear intent to harm someone. Here, Jamal Murray’s team was behind in the series and there’s really no precedent for punishment for this sort of thing either way, nor were there any tangible negative consequences to his actions, and he does not have a past history of bad behavior (nor did he appear to have intent to harm anyone here). So a suspension would’ve been quite surprising.

Of course, the weakness to that approach is that, without a suspension, it might not adequately disincentivize the behavior for others who might do it in the future. And that’s important, because it genuinely is potentially dangerous behavior. But that’s why they issued a $100k fine—that’s a lot of money, even to NBA players, and is a serious disincentive, especially for behavior that has no actual expected benefit to a player’s team (your teammate is really just as likely to get affected by it as the opposing team is).

So I don’t really think the NBA’s past method of dealing with things suggests that this was something that would get a suspension, nor do I think the way they dealt with it has left some sort of lack of disincentive.

As with many things with NBA punishment, there is a potential criticism that the penalty was dictated in part by how good the player is and what the situation in the series was. As in, maybe if Jamal Murray were a random role player and/or the Nuggets were ahead in the series, we could’ve seen a suspension. I think that’s a valid point, but we all understand that this is how it works to some degree. Fans care more about seeing star players play than role players, and the league is never keen to do something that will tend to lower the length of a series. But I’m not particularly moved by that criticism here, to be honest, since it’s not something where the lack of a suspension is inconsistent with things done in the past. This was an issue of first impression, with a player without a past history, that did not actually hurt anyone (and did not appear to be intended to hurt anyone), and it’s behavior that a large fine almost certainly can adequately disincentivize. It’s not really even clear to me that the Murray would’ve been suspended for this if he were a role player and/or the Nuggets were ahead.

This right here! Can we end it now and move on to G4.

[Shaka_Zulu]

I heard though that Scott Foster is reffing this one, so who knows?

Ffs. I like to go into crucial games without thinking of the theatrics and showy imcompetence of someone who should be minor to the outcome game as the ref. Can we just retire Foster and Brothers by now? They make games about themselves and inconsistently whistle on everything like they want to make statement.


Especially Foster who is way worse then Brothers (latter chooses more moments in game then entire of it, comes off as ego thing then pure incompetence).

Both last Wolves games vs Cavs in regular season and game 4 in Suns series. Foster went waaaaay out of his way to show he is in charge be deliberately choosing one player to give whistles all game, and generally just calling every touch as foul both ways.


We grown used to it in regular season. But its extra egregious thing to see for Playoffs when the other refs in the series do normal jobs of just calling it playoff style most games that the league decreed (they make mistakes too, but more like just missing things then clearly attention seekint behaviours of the veteran two).

Then comes Foster who wants us to stop watch free throws all game. And litterally has personal vendetta and beef with players within games instead of be impartial.

[stoo]

this shrink guy is a typical cancel culture moral superiority syndrome person

No. He’s a well reasoned and thoughtful poster for 20 years. His opinion is not yours. It’s okay to disagree.

Yeah Shrink, who I may not agree with at times, is a solid guy.

yeah, i don't really follow people. i said what i said cuz of some his coment that remainded me of that 'believe it or not, straigh to jail' guy meme

[Shaka_Zulu]

We don’t know that the Nuggets would have lost Game 3. People didn’t expect the Wolves to win Game 2 without Gobert.

Fortunately we can go into Game Four tonight without either team pointing at NBA interfering. I heard though that Scott Foster is reffing this one, so who knows?

Oh **** we are both screwed. I expect a lot of the players in foul trouble

This is exactly what I mean. We all know what's waiting for us. Unfair or inconsistent ref calls that makes everyone scratch their heads. Make game about second guessing what the ref will do now instead of just play our game.


This mental midget should be nudged to retire this off season.

[AleksandarN]

We don’t know that the Nuggets would have lost Game 3. People didn’t expect the Wolves to win Game 2 without Gobert.

Fortunately we can go into Game Four tonight without either team pointing at NBA interfering. I heard though that Scott Foster is reffing this one, so who knows?

Oh **** we are both screwed. I expect a lot of the players in foul trouble

This is exactly what I mean. We all know what's waiting for us. Unfair or inconsistent ref calls that makes everyone scratch their heads. Make game about second guessing what the ref will do now instead of just play our game.


This mental midget should be nudged to retire this off season.

Hate Scott Foster though. He always tries to make it about himself. That guy and his sense of importance and ego though

[KGDirkTD_Fan]

We don’t know that the Nuggets would have lost Game 3. People didn’t expect the Wolves to win Game 2 without Gobert.

Fortunately we can go into Game Four tonight without either team pointing at NBA interfering. I heard though that Scott Foster is reffing this one, so who knows?

Oh **** we are both screwed. I expect a lot of the players in foul trouble

Tony Brothers one game and now Scott Foster? The dream team of whistles.

**** me man, just want a good game tonight.

[AleksandarN]

We don’t know that the Nuggets would have lost Game 3. People didn’t expect the Wolves to win Game 2 without Gobert.

Fortunately we can go into Game Four tonight without either team pointing at NBA interfering. I heard though that Scott Foster is reffing this one, so who knows?

Oh **** we are both screwed. I expect a lot of the players in foul trouble

Tony Brothers one game and now Scott Foster? The dream team of whistles.

**** me man, just want a good game tonight.

Better than game 2. That was just as bad.

[_NoMas]

The refs were awful tonight (just getting it in early)

[GeorgeSears]

Game 4 should be for the series. A loss would really shake Minny’s confidence and at the same time, will give the defending champs the ammo to believe they are back at this.

It's a must-win game for the Nuggets. Not so much for the TWolves.

TWolves are good enough too steal one back at Denver in game 5 at 2-2. The Nuggets can't afford to go down 3-1.

Of course it’s a must-win for the Nuggets but it feels like the same for the Wolves. No way they are winning in Game 5 in Denver off back to back losses and at this point, Nuggets would have learned already not to lose HC advantage again like they did in the first two games.

Pressure is on Minnesota for G4. But i think they respond well tonight unlike in G3 when they got frustrated early and let the game get away from them.

If the series is tied 2-2 going back to Denver, I can absolutely envision the TWolves winning game 5. They're that good defensively.

This game means way more to the Nuggets.

[GeorgeSears]

I haven't complained about officiating in any of the Nuggets games this postseason. That includes Tony Brothers and Scott Foster reffed games. It has been blown out of proportion. Overall, the officiating has been good.

[shrink]

The refs were awful tonight (just getting it in early)

.. and the NBA has a conspiracy against <insert my team>!

[durden_tyler]

Wolves -3 and 204.5 O/U are the lines for Game 4.

i have my leans already but want to know what Wolves and Nuggets (and the neutrals) fans think before i lock in my bets. Crowdsourcing for profit basically (or loss LOL)


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