Michael Jordan UNDERRATED?

Godzilla039 · Post #41 » by **Godzilla039** » Sat May 28, 2011 1:32 am

Gongxi wrote:I'm talking about whatever draft #1 pick, the poster, went first in. Down year for sure.

lmao

smh@ #1 pick's unsuccessful and hysterically embarrassing attempt to throw rocks at the throne. What a disaster. Sit this one out, kid.

#1 pick · Post #42 » by **#1 pick** » Sat May 28, 2011 1:38 am

Gongxi wrote:I'm talking about whatever draft #1 pick, the poster, went first in. Down year for sure.

Nothing I said was dumb. Those were the SG's in 86' who started. I left McCray and a couple others. I wasn't looking for 20 ppg scorers at the time. MJ stanleys, smh.

reapaman · Post #43 » by **reapaman** » Sat May 28, 2011 1:38 am

TDKRises wrote:I think it's getting to the point where Jordan IS getting underrated. With all the ticky tacky fouls today..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SGLaKfEyRL4&feature=player_embedded

They still called way more fouls back then than they do today period, the cryers just wanna complain. Just look it up, everything from scoring to personal fouls are down from the 80's and early 90's due to vastly improved defenses and style of play.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/stats.html

Gongxi · Post #44 » by **Gongxi** » Sat May 28, 2011 1:42 am

organix85 wrote:
Gongxi wrote:I'm talking about whatever draft #1 pick, the poster, went first in. Down year for sure.

Oooo... lol. I read this like 5 times and was very confused. Then I was thinking, "I'm pretty sure there wasn't a lottery back then." Attention fail on my part...

It's okay, I wasn't that clear.

#1 pick wrote:
Gongxi wrote:I'm talking about whatever draft #1 pick, the poster, went first in. Down year for sure.

Nothing I said was dumb. Those were the SG's in 86' who started. I left McCray and a couple others. I wasn't looking for 20 ppg scorers at the time. MJ stanleys, smh.

He specifically asked for examples of players like Korver that could average 20+ ppg. You gave him a list of SGs. It was a bad post. Now you're down to Dale Ellis and Dell Curry: I'm sorry, Kyle Korver isn't close to either of them.

HeyJoe · Post #45 » by **HeyJoe** » Sat May 28, 2011 1:43 am

ubiquitous GOAT is underrated?

GreenHat · Post #46 » by **GreenHat** » Sat May 28, 2011 1:43 am

glowsticks wrote:YEAR TEAM G MPG FG% 3P% FT% OFF DEF RPG APG SPG BPG TO PF PPG
86-87 CHI 82 40.0 .482 .182 .857 2.00 3.20 5.20 4.6 2.88 1.52 3.32 2.90 37.1

3rd season.

It was at a faster pace and 20 years ago defensive schemes were much more primitive. Jordan would be the best player in the league today but the gap wouldn't be as wide as you think. No way he would average 37+ points now without a shot (.182 3pt% is worse than some posters on here would shoot).

shawngoat23 wrote:Probably overrated by fans who started watching only in the 90s.

Underrated by most fans who started watching in the 60s and those who only recently started watching. Especially since July 10.

Rated about right by most the fans who started watching in the 80s.

Let me guess, you started watching basketball around then so you have the absolute perfect perspective and everyone else is wrong? See my sig please.

doctorfunk wrote:
ADoaN17 wrote::eek1:

really? underrated....

+1

really his impact is often overrated, by those homers stuck in 1998. With ideas like "mj would win ring with a bunch of D-leaguers because he would will his team to win"

This is exactly how I feel. For some reason overrated has come to mean bad for people with poor comprehension. In reality things that are overrated are usually very good, and a lot of times the best in their comparison class. I don't know why people can't understand that.

Overrated does not mean bad. It almost always means that you are very good otherwise you wouldn't be rated so highly in the first place.

Shkodran_Plako · Post #47 » by **Shkodran_Plako** » Sat May 28, 2011 1:43 am

how can the GOAT be underrated?

Sabzi · Post #48 » by **Sabzi** » Sat May 28, 2011 1:43 am

So all the 80's players have to be overrated then right? Bird, Magic, Isiah, etc.... ROFL.

Sedale Threatt · Post #49 » by **Sedale Threatt** » Sat May 28, 2011 1:47 am

SolidSnake008 wrote:No offense taken....just never been a stat guy....never really seen Jordan play in the era being that i was still very young in his final years...There was just never any question in my mind that he was the greatest...My mother used to tape his games and growing up i watched those and just from those tapes i understood his greatness....But as far as stats go i never really look at stuff like that...or i did or maybe forgot...My memory sucks anyway lol

The thing that always impresses me is that he recorded the highest scoring average in NBA history, without being a low-pctg chucker, and actually managed to improve by 10 percent in the playoffs, against the best teams, with no drop in efficiency.

This is one of his most underrated achievements, and pretty much sums up to me what type of player he was. Spectacular under normal circumstances, and even better when the stakes rose.

#1 pick · Post #50 » by **#1 pick** » Sat May 28, 2011 1:48 am

Gongxi wrote:
organix85 wrote:
Gongxi wrote:I'm talking about whatever draft #1 pick, the poster, went first in. Down year for sure.

Oooo... lol. I read this like 5 times and was very confused. Then I was thinking, "I'm pretty sure there wasn't a lottery back then." Attention fail on my part...

It's okay, I wasn't that clear.

#1 pick wrote:
Gongxi wrote:I'm talking about whatever draft #1 pick, the poster, went first in. Down year for sure.

Nothing I said was dumb. Those were the SG's in 86' who started. I left McCray and a couple others. I wasn't looking for 20 ppg scorers at the time. MJ stanleys, smh.

He specifically asked for examples of players like Korver that could average 20+ ppg. You gave him a list of SGs. It was a bad post. Now you're down to Dale Ellis and Dell Curry: I'm sorry, Kyle Korver isn't close to either of them.

I was just posting the SG's in the 80's as I read his post wrong. I thought his reference was to the SG's in the 80's, not 20ppg scorers. I did post later who the 20 ppg shooters were. Kyle Korver averaged 14.4 for Philly on 11.4 SGM. Ellis avg 23.5 on 18.4 SGM in an era where perimeter defense talent was a joke at best. Korver could have averaged that and wouldn't have been a liability on defense in the 80's in the regular season like he is today.

Gongxi · Post #51 » by **Gongxi** » Sat May 28, 2011 1:52 am

Because Korver's efficiency would increase with more shots? That's...rare.

#1 pick · Post #52 » by **#1 pick** » Sat May 28, 2011 1:52 am

Sabzi wrote:So all the 80's players have to be overrated then right? Bird, Magic, Isiah, etc.... ROFL.

Elite players are elite in any ERA. They are special talents. The very good players like would be very good in any era as well. But the average player is who improved or the game style changed you can say. The shooters in the 80's were better but they wouldn't get open in today's game with the length, size, and talent of today's defenders. The length and athleticism is far better in today's NBA than in the 80's. The skill of the players are on par for the most part, just the fundamentals are worst today.

#1 pick · Post #53 » by **#1 pick** » Sat May 28, 2011 1:54 am

Gongxi wrote:Because Korver's efficiency would increase with more shots? That's...rare.

The style of play and the defenders of that era would be conducive to Korver play. In today's game, Korver is more of a specialist. In the 80's, he has a key role as a starter. It's harder to expose him in the 80's than it is today.

Sabzi · Post #54 » by **Sabzi** » Sat May 28, 2011 1:56 am

#1 pick wrote:
Sabzi wrote:So all the 80's players have to be overrated then right? Bird, Magic, Isiah, etc.... ROFL.

Elite players are elite in any ERA. They are special talents. The very good players like would be very good in any era as well. But the average player is who improved or the game style changed you can say. The shooters in the 80's were better but they wouldn't get open in today's game with the length, size, and talent of today's defenders. The length and athleticism is far better in today's NBA than in the 80's. The skill of the players are on par for the most part, just the fundamentals are worst today.

Where are you going with this non-sense? MJ is overrated but all elite players are special... blah blah blah Korver could have been an All-Star... HAHAHAHAHAHA.

Ayt · Post #55 » by **Ayt** » Sat May 28, 2011 1:57 am

How would it have been conducive? Korver would have gotten roughed up.

Gongxi · Post #56 » by **Gongxi** » Sat May 28, 2011 2:00 am

So Korver as the #3 option when he averaged 14 didn't have a key role? He wasn't just a 'specialist', he was the teams source of offense after Iverson and Iguodala. That doesn't mean he's a 20+ ppg guy- that he's Dale Ellis or Dell Curry- if he's in the 80s. That's just silly.

Eric Murdock averaged 13 ppg on on 10.9 shots in 94-95. If he got 18 shots, he'd average 21. See what I did there?

#1 pick · Post #57 » by **#1 pick** » Sat May 28, 2011 2:05 am

Gongxi wrote:So Korver as the #3 option when he averaged 14 didn't have a key role? He wasn't just a 'specialist', he was the teams source of offense after Iverson and Iguodala. That doesn't mean he's a 20+ ppg guy- that he's Dale Ellis or Dell Curry- if he's in the 80s. That's just silly.

Eric Murdock averaged 13 ppg on on 10.9 shots in 94-95. If he got 18 shots, he'd average 21. See what I did there?

I am talking about in terms of talent. He's a very good shooter who is good off the ball with decent height and length. Look at Jeff Hornacek in the 80's. He's J.J. Redick talent wise.

SolidSnake008 · Post #58 » by **SolidSnake008** » Sat May 28, 2011 2:06 am

Sedale Threatt wrote:
SolidSnake008 wrote:No offense taken....just never been a stat guy....never really seen Jordan play in the era being that i was still very young in his final years...There was just never any question in my mind that he was the greatest...My mother used to tape his games and growing up i watched those and just from those tapes i understood his greatness....But as far as stats go i never really look at stuff like that...or i did or maybe forgot...My memory sucks anyway lol

The thing that always impresses me is that he recorded the highest scoring average in NBA history, without being a low-pctg chucker, and actually managed to improve by 10 percent in the playoffs, against the best teams, with no drop in efficiency.

This is one of his most underrated achievements, and pretty much sums up to me what type of player he was. Spectacular under normal circumstances, and even better when the stakes rose.

Truly amazing i must say....In my mind he's the GOAT always was and always will be....For me GOAT doesn't just mean Stats and Achievements it's also what he did for the game of Basketball as a whole....No one else can really stand next to him in that regard...Lebron Talent-Wise may be able to be considered the Greatest someday if everything goes right but when it comes to Impact to the basketball culture....I don't think so...Jordan is taking College classes in Middle school if we're taking about that

Gongxi · Post #59 » by **Gongxi** » Sat May 28, 2011 2:09 am

#1 pick wrote:
Gongxi wrote:So Korver as the #3 option when he averaged 14 didn't have a key role? He wasn't just a 'specialist', he was the teams source of offense after Iverson and Iguodala. That doesn't mean he's a 20+ ppg guy- that he's Dale Ellis or Dell Curry- if he's in the 80s. That's just silly.

Eric Murdock averaged 13 ppg on on 10.9 shots in 94-95. If he got 18 shots, he'd average 21. See what I did there?

I am talking about in terms of talent. He's a very good shooter who is good off the ball with decent height and length. Look at Jeff Hornacek in the 80's. He's J.J. Redick talent wise.

Lots of player were great shooters back then. Less athletic, but better shooters. Korver's not going to stand out back then. He's going to be another shooter. Great.

Sedale Threatt · Post #60 » by **Sedale Threatt** » Sat May 28, 2011 2:10 am

He was literally the total package. And it wasn't just marketing and 80s defense.