What was Shaq saying about Dwight and...

[tsherkin]

Shot chart is foggy on ESPN, but he was 9/21............ 9FTs (9/17).

And this is the kicker; 21 is a TON of FGA for a big man. It's not easy at all to get that many shots, and even more difficult when you don't shoot very far from the rim. The notion that he could just "take it over" is a little naive, because the back court has to commit to that idea as much as Dwight himself, and Harden was in free-for-all chuck mode.

He ended up with an empty 27 points,

... He tied the leading scorer on his team and did it with 7 fewer shots in a game they lost by 2. The idea that this proves his points were empty very clearly outlines your illogical agenda against Dwight.

Again its not about the points, its about execution. Points are a by-product of playing smart, that was all Shaq was trying to say.

No, that's a daft point, which is probably why Shaq said it. What matters is that he was a productive player who scored well on the balance of the game. Shaq is making comments because he feels personally threatened by Dwight's play and there's little else to suggest otherwise.

Look, I think D12 is capable of playing better, but if he gets in foul trouble, and doesnt take it to a guy that is clearly not in his talent level, good luck Houston

You know, any player can get into foul trouble, especially with ticky-tack stuff from the refs. It's happened to Shaq before too, and in no way supports your point.

[Tave]

This isn't like a one time deal -- Shaq says this all of the time.

Paraphrasing him over the years:

"All I used to tell myself, just get seven points a quarter. Don't worry about it. Just go out there and get my seven points in each quarter, and by the end of the game, I got my points and we good. Just get seven points per quarter. If you big, you can get seven points per quarter. Just get seven points per quarter, then after four quarters, you have thirty points, or at lot of points or something, but you just have to get seven points a quarter."

Yeah, I've heard him reference this as well. He has used it to illustrate how to get your teammates going too. E.g.," Once I had my 5 or 7 points I knew it was time to get the other guys involved and create some easy buckets for my teammates."

[RaptorNews]

Shaq is a moron and an egomaniac

[PandaKidd]

Shot chart is foggy on ESPN, but he was 9/21............ 9FTs (9/17).

And this is the kicker; 21 is a TON of FGA for a big man. It's not easy at all to get that many shots, and even more difficult when you don't shoot very far from the rim. The notion that he could just "take it over" is a little naive, because the back court has to commit to that idea as much as Dwight himself, and Harden was in free-for-all chuck mode.

He ended up with an empty 27 points,

... He tied the leading scorer on his team and did it with 7 fewer shots in a game they lost by 2. The idea that this proves his points were empty very clearly outlines your illogical agenda against Dwight.

Again its not about the points, its about execution. Points are a by-product of playing smart, that was all Shaq was trying to say.

No, that's a daft point, which is probably why Shaq said it. What matters is that he was a productive player who scored well on the balance of the game. Shaq is making comments because he feels personally threatened by Dwight's play and there's little else to suggest otherwise.

Look, I think D12 is capable of playing better, but if he gets in foul trouble, and doesnt take it to a guy that is clearly not in his talent level, good luck Houston

You know, any player can get into foul trouble, especially with ticky-tack stuff from the refs. It's happened to Shaq before too, and in no way supports your point.

agree to disagree.

On a night when Harden was off, I would have expected a Vet like D12 to understand not getting in foul trouble, not getting a stupid technical, and being a bit more efficient on the offensive end. he attempted a ton of shots, and he didnt really convert, go watch the game over. He had some TERRIBLE post moves. Atrocious.

I just think D12 is a weak player, and hes easily intimidated. hes got enough talent that he can get his points, but he cant dominate a game and take it over.

Where was he on the game tieing tip in ?

I just dont see all the Hype around howard, and during the first half of this game, i agred 100% with haq

[tsherkin]

agree to disagree.

On a night when Harden was off, I would have expected a Vet like D12 to understand not getting in foul trouble,

And yet, that doesn't work that way. Foul trouble is a reality of the game for bigs and when the refs decide to get chippy, there isn't anything you can do about it, so that's really a non-starter.

not getting a stupid technical, and being a bit more efficient on the offensive end.

And lo and behold, he was considerably better in the second half than in the first. He had a rough first quarter, but it happens. Keep in mind, your point is essentially null and void when you consider any other star player, since they've all had stinkers before as well. Do you remember Game 2 of the 96 Finals?

Jordan shot 9/22 from the field and was 10/16 from the foul line. That's about 41% FG and a brutal 62.5% at the line. Even the GOAT had rough nights, so the entire premise of your argument is founded upon a sort of fictitious ideal to which no player adheres.

he attempted a ton of shots, and he didnt really convert, go watch the game over. He had some TERRIBLE post moves. Atrocious.

Aesthetics are meaningless, and at the rates at which he typically converts, no one is complaining. But those are sub-50% shots regardless, so the odds will go against you betimes. It happens, you need to understand this. It's just like an open jumper; sometimes they don't fall. People forget that the shooting percentages on such shots is a LOT different than right at the rim.

I just think D12 is a weak player, and hes easily intimidated. hes got enough talent that he can get his points, but he cant dominate a game and take it over.

Another empty comment, particularly since you're still tap-dancing around the part where, since he's a conventional big, he requires the backcourt to give him the ball. Harden wasn't giving anyone anything in that game.

Shaq's criticism was foolish; it was fair to say that Howard didn't come through, but it's entirely nonsensical to say that Howard's approach was off. He was missing shots, it happens. Even Diesel had rough nights in the playoffs.

[Q00]

basically break the game down into quarters and set a production goal for yourself.

If you score 7 pts/quarter that's 28/game.

which actually sounds completely reasonable

not sure what everyone elses problem with Shaq is but there is nothing wrong with him saying this

I was thinking the same thing reading through this thread. All Shaq said was if Dwight was as great as the hype he gets, he should be able to score 7 pts a quarter. He's right.

[FlashFlare]

Shaq brings nothing to the table other than:

-BIRDMAN BIRDMAN
-mumble mumble mumble, dominate...7 pts a quarter, get 28/15...mumble mumble mumble
-the "others" need to step up
-it don't matter Chuck, I got more rings than you

[PandaKidd]

blah

I respect your opinion, but the D12 i saw last night, is the D12 Ive come to expect the last 2-3 years. No hustle, no heart, unimpressive on the offensive side of the ball, defense that has no heart and gets worse as the years go on, lack of taking over a game.

I blame Mchale about 30%, and D12 for 70%. Mainly because hes just not a leader. Because he has some of the worst post moves ive ever seen at this stage in his career.

I mean BLAKE GRIFFIN looks better now than D12 when it comes to footwork, which is kind of funny if you think about it.

Agree to disagree. He shot 9/21, that is TERRIBLY inefficient for a guy that literally shoots 6 feet from the basket. You can argue all you want, but that stat is undeniable.

[PandaKidd]

Jordan shot 9/22 from the field and was 10/16 from the foul line. That's about 41% FG and a brutal 62.5% at the line. Even the GOAT had rough nights, so the entire premise of your argument is founded upon a sort of fictitious ideal to which no player adheres.

We are comparing Jordan to D12 now? LOL

This isnt a 1 time rough time for D12, this is characteristic of him. He might be the LEAST impact big man in the game

[ComboGuardCity]

Al Jefferson begs to differ that you cannot take over a game as a post player.

[MMyhre]

Why even compare Jordans off games to Dwights? Jordan would go off the next games and play with fire, Dwight not so much. If Dwight was dominating and scoring a lot regularly I would agree, however he is not. Cousins will be the clear cut best center next year imo, unless Dwight actually, you know, really IMPROVES next year. He probably just ain't got what it takes. Weak mentally, soft and low ingame IQ. Great athlete at least.

Sent from my GT-I8190N using RealGM Forums mobile app

[Illmatic12]

if shaq wasn't so petty and insecure he'd realize he can just laugh at dwight at this point. no point in calling him out.

I think it bothers Shaq that D12 was annointed the next big man of the NBA and he literally has not evolved and hes not 1/5th the player Shaq was.

I can understand him being bothered 4-5 years ago. The thing is, at this point pretty much everyone knows the book on Dwight. He's widely seen as a career underachiever who doesn't get much respect from NBA fans. The guy even lost his starting ASG spot this year to an unathletic white dude

Nobody in their right minds would compare Dwight to Shaq at this point, so why is he still so insecure about it? Just let it go

[frozt]

It actually blows my mind that the Lakers were unable to Run PnR with Dwight + Nash/Pau/Kobe I thought D'Antoni to blame, but really I think it's because they tried to make Dwight the second focal point of the offense.

[PandaKidd]

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-bas ... go-to-work

Dwight Howard was supposed to dominate the Portland Trail Blazers inside for the Houston Rockets. And while Howard had 27 points and 15 rebounds in Game 1, it came on 9-of-21 shooting. Howard finished minus-5 for the game while his counterpart Robin Lopez made Howard work the entire game and finished plus-15. It was less than an inspiring performance.

According to Synergy Sports, the Rockets ran 13 post-up plays for Howard. He scored just 10 points in those sets and drew no fouls. Conversely, the Rockets managed to get no touches for Howard in the pick and roll.

Dwight Howard does not need more touches in the post. It's not that Howard doesn't have a post game. It's not that playing inside out isn't a good strategy. But how they play inside out is important. Howard's been on this kick for two years. But if they keep going to Howard and if he doesn't make a major improvement in very little time, this could get bad

[jwpark23]

People who bash Shaq don't seem to know how to differentiate between joking and seriousness. When he's determined, he's actually pretty good at analyzing players and games.

[jg77]

People who bash Shaq don't seem to know how to differentiate between joking and seriousness. When he's determined, he's actually pretty good at analyzing players and games.

Before him and Chuck started going at it, he made a lot of sense. He brought some of the plays and was explaining what Howard needed to do.

[Side beard]

So Dwight missed everything and Robin Lopez/Blazers had nothing to do with it?

[markdeez33]

It's the formula that Shaq thinks Dwight needs to adhere to, to win championships and be dominant

[MaceCase]

So Dwight missed everything and Robin Lopez/Blazers had nothing to do with it?

It's an odd thing that even Kenny and Charles called Shaq out on in that he sees Robin Lopez the same way that a prime Shaq sees Lopez. Shaq rarely had any trouble against any defensive big man throughout his career because he really was just that physically dominant. Where he ran into some trouble is when faced with guys who made him work on the other end of the floor which Lopez clearly can't against Dwight so all in all Shaq therefore thinks he is inconsequential as a player.

Now of course Shaq refuses to accept just how much more of a physical specimen he was than Dwight is and it shows in him constantly exaggerating Dwight to be 7'1" when his listed height of 6'11" is already an embellishment and then claiming him to be the fastest bigman or possess a 50" vertical. You think he's trying to be an impartial big man expert (given that he discounts Charles and Kenny's opinions because they were G/Fs) but when asked about Hibbert today who goes 1/6 and has generally played awful as of late he gives him praise with "he showed good effort". Really now? Dwight doing anything less than 28 and 15 is head shaking worthy but Hibbert, a guy who is actually 7'2", going 1/6 against Pero Antic, whom Shaq claims is 6'6" btw, is "good effort"?

No, there's more than enough past and present evidence to not accept this as just another agenda filled rant.

[JSmooth93]

I think it's the opposite, Shaq is always trying to light a fire under Dwight.

He wants Dwight to reach his potential.
Shaq's career is over and sees now if he was a lot more motivated for his playing years, be might've been considered the GOAT bigman by most people.

He wants Dwight to succeed, that's why he talks about him all the time and what he needs to improve.
You guys just don't like Shaq for really arbitrary reasons.