With The Warriors and The Spurs being this good, doesn't that mean the league is very weak?

[Protoss]

This year the East has a better WIN LOSS record vs the West than vice versa.

West vs East - 204:190

WIN/LOSS columns are not accurate because West have much better top 4 teams and 2 of the GOAT teams, so more games vs them for 5-15 seed in the West than all in the East.

why did you choose top 4 instead of top 2 3 or 5? what do the stats look like when you change the numbers?

if you go by that type of data, im curious what the east v west records are for top 3 teams 2009 - 2012. cavs bulls celtics orlando and miami all were competitive teams.

[mtron929]

I don't know about the Spurs but the Warriors are having a good year largely because of Curry's incredible year. And I don't think anyone would attribute Curry's greatness to the overall league quality being down. So I would say the Warriors being this good is due to the historical season that Curry is having. Hell, if Curry was playing at last year's level (which was a MVP year), everyone would be talking about how the Spurs are the best team this year.

[ILOVEIT]

I believe the talent pool is a little watered down. I'd love to see the league retract to about 25 teams.

It also doesn't help that GSW gets to feast on their very weak division (SAC, PHO, LAL)

I don't believe there are many legit super stars in the league. And if you don't have one of those you are doomed to be an average team.

Warriors and Spurs are the best offensive AND defensive teams...both historically so. But I do think the amount of legit super stars is lower than the past. Many teams use to have one or two...Stockton and Malone, Pippen and Jordan, Kobe and Shaq, Duncan and Parker.....

[King Ken]

The EC is about the same.
The WC is a bit weaker than normal in the middle.
But overall the league is similar to previous eras.

In 2001, the WC 8th seed had 47 wins.
This year Dallas or Houston is on track to win 41-42.

In 2001, the EC 8th seed had 41 wins.
This year the Bulls are on track to win 41. Bulls have been decimated by injuries so they might finish a bit higher.

On the low end, in 01 there were 3 teams below 20 wins. We'll probably have the same this year, Suns Lakers Sixers. Or possibly just two, Phoenix only has to win 2 more to hit 20.

The East is much better than it was last year

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[SacKingZZZ]

I hate to say it, but the answer is YES. I'm a Kings fan so I know bad basketball, and I've seen many games this year where the Kings weren't the only bad team on the floor at the time and many of those were playoff contenders.

I said it before, the NBA wanted NFL style parity and they got the worst part of it this year. You have 3-4 unstoppable/really good teams and another 20+ mediocre to just plain bad teams.

[SacKingZZZ]

I don't know about the Spurs but the Warriors are having a good year largely because of Curry's incredible year. And I don't think anyone would attribute Curry's greatness to the overall league quality being down. So I would say the Warriors being this good is due to the historical season that Curry is having. Hell, if Curry was playing at last year's level (which was a MVP year), everyone would be talking about how the Spurs are the best team this year.

In a lot of ways they are using the rules to their advantage. The Spurs as well. You can't blame them either. I'm just a little annoyed at the league right now in regards to pick and roll and screens. With such a lack of physicality allowed on the wing it's like every screen in a given game is a wide open shot for a guard. The only teams that seem to be surviving defensively are the ones that can switch.

[NiqtheAntiq]

Partially indicative yes. The league went through expansion in the Jordan era as well which watered down talent.

95-96 was an expansion year for Grizz and Raps. Raps did beat the 72 Bulls somehow through pure heart but overall expansion watered down the mid talent pool and made some teams less deep causing the Bulls to be on cruise control. Knicks and Magic were the main competition for the Bulls and they looked lost when the playoffs came.

[mihail_petkov]

This year the East has a better WIN LOSS record vs the West than vice versa.

West vs East - 204:190

WIN/LOSS columns are not accurate because West have much better top 4 teams and 2 of the GOAT teams, so more games vs them for 5-15 seed in the West than all in the East.

why did you choose top 4 instead of top 2 3 or 5? what do the stats look like when you change the numbers?

if you go by that type of data, im curious what the east v west records are for top 3 teams 2009 - 2012. cavs bulls celtics orlando and miami all were competitive teams.

I didn't choose anything. This season there are 396 games East team vs West team, West have already 206 wins vs 190 for East.

My point was that it's not accurate to check the 8th seed in West and 8th seed in East. East have 9 50% teams and West have 8 but this doesn't mean anything because all teams in the Western Conference play 3/4 times vs Warriors/Spurs/Thunder/Clippers and Eastern conference play only twice vs them. That's why it's more difficult for them to have a better record.

[atlantabbq99]

The Warriors best player was a 7th overall pick. The Spurs have an aging super star, but the rest of the roster is filled with mid to low first round picks and second round picks. The Orlando magic have a roster full of lottery picks.

The weakness comes from bad management and bad coaching.

Their is no reason why a good team can't be built around Anthony Davis or Derrick Favors, but its happening because organizations and coaches are to blame.

[NBAfan3024]

No just means there are two all time great teams.

[DreDay]

I believe the talent pool is a little watered down. I'd love to see the league retract to about 25 teams.

It also doesn't help that GSW gets to feast on their very weak division (SAC, PHO, LAL)

Yeah, they only have a 47-5 record outside their division. They're lucky they're even in the playoffs tbh.

[New_Hawks_Era]

Big inequality gap.

If you take out the 2 top (GSW/SAS) and 2 bottom (PHI/LAL) teams, the rest of the league is quite competitive. On the contrary, the league is quite strong.

Stats aside the bottom 7 teams in the west are complete garbage along with the east. Then you have teams with overrated talent like Memphis, Houston, Atlanta, Chicago, etc.

There IS a huge inequality gap. San Antonio has a ridiculous amount of talent / depth along with golden state. LMA, Dwest, Duncan, Kawai then you have Curry, Thompson, Green, Igodala (who could start on any other team) and other solid depth. No teams in the league come close to that talent except Cleveland and LA who both lack depth in comparison to those two.

Lets see how overrated we look tonight

[Promezclan]

Bill Russell won every year does that mean the league was garbage back then?

Definitely. There were like 8 teams of semi-professional white guys. .

[zimpy27]

Yeah the league is very weak at the moment. I thought that was common knowledge. I don't think I've ever seen so many teams rebuilding at once. The big 3 in Boston superteam kind of gave a license for the best player to come together which has sped up the compete process, causing many teams to rebuild. Not to mention how many top player have been injured over the past season an a half.

[Arp590]

Yeah the league is very weak at the moment. I thought that was common knowledge.

Except that's not true, there is more talent in the league right now than there has ever been at any time.

[zimpy27]

Yeah the league is very weak at the moment. I thought that was common knowledge.

Except that's not true, there is more talent in the league right now than there has ever been at any time.

Young talent yes, not mature talent. The youth and potential blinds people to the reality of the game at this point. In 2 or 3 seasons the talent will be immense and the competition will be strong, the top team in the league will struggle to win 60.

[UDRIH14]

stars leaving for built superteams in the last few years have contracted the quality of teams in the league

those teams who lose superstars then rebuild through the draft/fa, those players havnt panned out yet and still in rebuild mode

[Teen Girl Squad]

Yeah the league is very weak at the moment. I thought that was common knowledge.

Except that's not true, there is more talent in the league right now than there has ever been at any time.

Young talent yes, not mature talent. The youth and potential blinds people to the reality of the game at this point. In 2 or 3 seasons the talent will be immense and the competition will be strong, the top team in the league will struggle to win 60.

The average skill level of players today, even young ones, is higher than its been in the past. Its just harder to see because we've become too sophisticated to just go by PPG anymore and you can't just watch a player and see how well he can beat his man to get an open shot (ISO ball/man defense). I'm not going to say this is the most talented/best year ever but its not some historically bad run (honestly its above average at least IMO).

This topic is almost a Rorschach test to see if you like GS/San Antonio or dislike them (historic good teams or overrated teams feasting on bad teams).

[JeepCSC]

The West is down and the Warriors/Spurs are this great. It is what it is.

[zimpy27]

Except that's not true, there is more talent in the league right now than there has ever been at any time.

Young talent yes, not mature talent. The youth and potential blinds people to the reality of the game at this point. In 2 or 3 seasons the talent will be immense and the competition will be strong, the top team in the league will struggle to win 60.

The average skill level of players today, even young ones, is higher than its been in the past. Its just harder to see because we've become too sophisticated to just go by PPG anymore and you can't just watch a player and see how well he can beat his man to get an open shot (ISO ball/man defense). I'm not going to say this is the most talented/best year ever but its not some historically bad run (honestly its above average at least IMO).

This topic is almost a Rorschach test to see if you like GS/San Antonio or dislike them (historic good teams or overrated teams feasting on bad teams).

Well then, I almost thought you has an unbiased opinion until that last comment.

Hardly anyone looks at PPG anymore, especially not on these forums. You can see it's worse because of how immature the talent and the team chemistry is. It's a younger league and the coaches and players switch like crazy. GMs take a gamble now because it's better for their franchise to blow up and excite with new talent if they aren't in the top 8 of the league.

Look at how many teams from the West 8 have tumbled out due to roster changes or injuries. Rockets, Clips, Grizz, Blazers, Mavs,
Pelicans all dropped in form from last year. Only OKC has improved. Jazz have been without a PG and have missed Gobert and Favors and yet they have the 5th best SRS in the west.

In the East the Hawks, Bulls, Wizards and Bucks have all dropped. Cavs have actually improved even though Kyrie was out for so long and they changed coaches. Hornets and Raps have improved.