Why does Curry get a pass and Lebron doesn't?

[jeffjtk1234]

Lebron has had way more so called failures in the playoffs than Steph.

All them losing shows is that It's incredibly difficult to repeat as champs.


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[dautjazz]

Because lebron keeps telling us he's the greatest ever, better than kobe, MJ etc. Everyone knows the truth though.

When did ever say he was greater player ever, and better than Kobe/Jordan? He would certainly be right about Kobe, but I'm sure he's never been crazy enough to consider himself better than MJ.

[LivingLegend]

one of them doesnt call himself the King or the Chosen One

The Media dubbed him that. He ran with it. I guess thats what happens when ESPN is covering you at 16 years old and proclaiming you the next big thing. Curry got popular when he was 26 years old. Much different.

Has anybody heard the song "We made you" by Eminem? YOU made LeBron, the media made LeBron.

[MartinToVaught]

Okay, let me elaborate here.

In the Boston series, LeBron had 1 game where he looked utterly lost and lifeless out there, and that was what people focused on more than anything else for good reason. It was however something only happened after it became clear that Boston was just too good for Cleveland, and LeBron came back the next game and left everything on the court. Bottom line: His "walkabout" game didn't really matter, and was pretty understandable given that he was about to make a huge decision.

In the Dallas series, LeBron was passive the entire series. Early on we could chalk that up to Wade being on fire, but eventually it became clear that Miami wouldn't win the series unless LeBron stepped up, and he seemed genuinely psychologically unprepared to do that. THAT is a major issue, and something worth talking about.

If you disagree with that assessment, that's fine, but you should be able to understand why people thought like that, and why people were so dismayed by the thought. It's not about WHEN is occurred, it's about WHAT actually occurred and WHY.

To be clear, I'm not someone who calls LeBron a choker. I think in general sports fans are pretty stupid in calling these guys "chokers", but something happened in the Dallas series that it will never make sense to chalk up to "Dallas was tough and it was the finals".

I don't deny that LeBron wasn't himself and was overly passive against Dallas. I just don't think it's as big a deal as people made it out to be, because of all the times he's dominated in the playoffs before and after that series. It was a blip in an otherwise amazing career, not the norm.

Also, I actually don't think Dallas gets enough credit for the defense they played. They spent that whole postseason making the NBA's biggest names look mortal. Kobe and Pau got swept unceremoniously by the Mavs and lost the closeout game by 36 points. Westbrook was terrible against them, to the point where he got benched for Eric Maynor in the fourth quarter of Game 2 and OKC won without him. Durant and Harden bricked three after three down the stretch of Game 5.

Hell, remember when LeBron and Wade celebrated too early in Game 2 of the Finals, only to watch the Mavs come back and win? Durant did the same exact thing in Game 4 of the WCF - he did the Aaron Rodgers championship belt celebration in front of the Thunder bench after a big three, and then promptly blew a 15-point lead at home and lost in OT. He also turned it over nine times that game.

Did LeBron suck against the Mavs? Obviously - but he had plenty of company that year.

[dautjazz]

When the "LeBron = Choker" meme was really gaining traction it happened because year after year LeBron wasn't winning titles despite being seen as the best in the game, and then it peaked in that Dallas series which was absolutely embarrassing on a far greater level than anything we're seeing from Curry right now.

(And I say that as someone who always defends similar criticism when people bring up his series against Boston. His Boston issue was greatly overstated, his Dallas issue was not.)

Let's be real now: LeBron had a bad series against Dallas, but at least it was in the Finals, not the conference finals. And it was with the rough draft of a team that went on to repeat as champions - a team that hadn't quite gelled or learned how to play together yet. Plus, that Mavs team had just embarrassed Kobe, Durant and Westbrook too.

Furthermore, the "LeBron = Choker" meme was stupid even then. He was clutch as hell against the Bulls in the ECF that year. Meanwhile, Derrick Rose was bricking free throws down the stretch as if he was back at Memphis in the national title game.

Curry is failing with a team that won 73 games and was billed as the greatest ever. If that was LeBron, his legacy would be tarnished forever. He would never hear the end of it.

There's no way that 2011 is more embarrassing than the Warriors failing to win a title this year.

Okay, let me elaborate here.

In the Boston series, LeBron had 1 game where he looked utterly lost and lifeless out there, and that was what people focused on more than anything else for good reason. It was however something only happened after it became clear that Boston was just too good for Cleveland, and LeBron came back the next game and left everything on the court. Bottom line: His "walkabout" game didn't really matter, and was pretty understandable given that he was about to make a huge decision.

In the Dallas series, LeBron was passive the entire series. Early on we could chalk that up to Wade being on fire, but eventually it became clear that Miami wouldn't win the series unless LeBron stepped up, and he seemed genuinely psychologically unprepared to do that. THAT is a major issue, and something worth talking about.

If you disagree with that assessment, that's fine, but you should be able to understand why people thought like that, and why people were so dismayed by the thought. It's not about WHEN is occurred, it's about WHAT actually occurred and WHY.

To be clear, I'm not someone who calls LeBron a choker. I think in general sports fans are pretty stupid in calling these guys "chokers", but something happened in the Dallas series that it will never make sense to chalk up to "Dallas was tough and it was the finals".

To me the best explanation I can come up with is that Lebron couldn't handle pressure of the media. He was under the microscope like no other NBA player in history, and still is. I mean MJ and I'm sure others were to an extent, but the internet and social media makes it infinitely bigger than what MJ would of experienced with the attention he got during his struggles in the 80's with only the newspaper and tv press, not to mention that in the 80's you didn't even have a lot of sports channels, maybe ESPN and a local channel, and that was about it.

[Max Rockafeller]

It's really expectations. When Curry won a title, it was a surprise because nobody at the time expected Curry to get this good and win a title.

LeBron has had the expectation to win multiple titles since he first came into the league. The next MJ, Magic, etc, etc,.

If anyone is out there who got a pass more than he should, I think it's Durant. He was heavily hyped coming into the league, and has lucked out on having another probable future HOF as his mate for the better part of the last 6 years. If he wins a title this year, it should be, as LeBron once said, "About damn time."

I completely agree with your Durant analogy, except he has taken some heat over the past year. Ive heard broadcasters and reporters call him out this year, especially with looming free agency for the team.

[Max Rockafeller]

one of them doesnt call himself the King or the Chosen One

The Media dubbed him that. He ran with it. I guess thats what happens when ESPN is covering you at 16 years old and proclaiming you the next big thing. Curry got popular when he was 26 years old. Much different.

Has anybody heard the song "We made you" by Eminem? YOU made LeBron, the media made LeBron.

I think its incredible that when he was 14 YEARS OLD, the basketball world claimed him as the Next Great One, and he actually lived up to that expectation. It speaks to his Greatness, when you can dub a child to be the next best player on this planet, and he does exactly that. Think about that.

[LivingLegend]

one of them doesnt call himself the King or the Chosen One

The Media dubbed him that. He ran with it. I guess thats what happens when ESPN is covering you at 16 years old and proclaiming you the next big thing. Curry got popular when he was 26 years old. Much different.

Has anybody heard the song "We made you" by Eminem? YOU made LeBron, the media made LeBron.

I think its incredible that when he was 14 YEARS OLD, the basketball world claimed him as the Next Great One, and he actually lived up to that expectation. It speaks to his Greatness, when you can dub a child to be the next best player on this planet, and he does exactly that. Think about that.

Hey man Im telling you. If you got a few mins watch the intro to this video with him in highschool, do it. It gives you a sense of how big he was coming out of HS. Its incredible. The pressure, the expectations, the national attention....at that age.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iuNskCaOKvI[/youtube]

[MaliBrah]

I think people have selective memory if they think that the criticism of LeBron only began with the decision.

Dude got criticize for losing to the damn Spurs with that garbage team he took to the finals

he was killed for not shaking hands with the magic in 09 LOL

[Arman_tanzarian]

Lebron has had way more so called failures in the playoffs than Steph.

All them losing shows is that It's incredibly difficult to repeat as champs.


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Which ones?

In Losses Lebron lost to +7.02 SRS teams while carrying +4.35 SRS teams. Curry is about to lose as a +10.4 SRS team.

[Arman_tanzarian]

Because lebron keeps telling us he's the greatest ever, better than kobe, MJ etc. Everyone knows the truth though.

When did ever say he was greater player ever, and better than Kobe/Jordan? He would certainly be right about Kobe, but I'm sure he's never been crazy enough to consider himself better than MJ.

Yeah he's been better than Kobe for awhile now. You think Dallas was bad? Heck 04 Kobe was worse against the Pistons. Let's not forget missing the playoffs and then getting bounced out of the first round twice at his peak. One with a 3-1 series lead where he refused to shoot in the 2nd half of game 7.

I don't think Lebron's ever called himself the greatest ever. Guys like Pippen and Bird has called him that though at times.

[Arman_tanzarian]

I think people have selective memory if they think that the criticism of LeBron only began with the decision.

Dude got criticize for losing to the damn Spurs with that garbage team he took to the finals

he was killed for not shaking hands with the magic in 09 LOL

In a series against the number 1 defence he averaged:

39 ppg, 8 apg, 8 rpg , 1 spg, 1 bpg, 49% shooting

The Cavs had a 112.9 O rating when he was on the court. That is a +11.0 offense relative to Orlando’s regular season D rating. That would be a historic offensive playoff performance.

In 2 of Cleveland’s losses, LeBron’s on court plus/minus was positive. That means the Cavs outscored the Magic in those games, but the Cavs bench gave up the lead when LeBron was sitting.

Averaged 35-9-7, .618 TS%. His 37.4 PER and .399 WS/48 are both the best in playoff history. He had a 128 O rating and 100 D rating in the playoffs. Michael Jordan has never beaten either of those numbers in a single playoff. On paper that was the most dominant a player ever was through 3 rounds.

[ILOVEIT]

Who is giving him a pass? I know for a fact me and many others that truly know basketball have been calling curry a fraud for two years

Over hyped and gased up. Klay is the only one with the mentality for these situations. Rest of them are fakes and system players.

After they're elimated hopefully the casual crowd will open their eyes and realize the same.

I love this method of attack. It allows you to conveniently disregard all available evidence & statistics to tear down player(s) you don't like. You can make the assertion that player X is a "system player" and if they've only seen success under one method of play, or have only played under one system, there is no evidence available to refute your claim.

This was famously ascribed to Steve Nash, who was only successful because of Mike D'Antoni's system. How many MVP point guards has Pringles produced since Nash?

Thank you. And BTW, Klay, as far as Warrior fans are concerned, is more of a system player benefiting from ALLLLLL the attention Curry get's defensively.

Even when you are trying to hate on Curry you get it wrong

You are welcome to answer this one question: If Curry is not as good as many say he is, why does EVERY team in the NBA automatically double and sometimes triple team him?

[ILOVEIT]

Oh...and Curry won't get a pass on this series UNLESS he has knee surgery shortly after the last game he plays this year.

[dautjazz]

Because lebron keeps telling us he's the greatest ever, better than kobe, MJ etc. Everyone knows the truth though.

When did ever say he was greater player ever, and better than Kobe/Jordan? He would certainly be right about Kobe, but I'm sure he's never been crazy enough to consider himself better than MJ.

Yeah he's been better than Kobe for awhile now. You think Dallas was bad? Heck 04 Kobe was worse against the Pistons. Let's not forget missing the playoffs and then getting bounced out of the first round twice at his peak. One with a 3-1 series lead where he refused to shoot in the 2nd half of game 7.

I don't think Lebron's ever called himself the greatest ever. Guys like Pippen and Bird has called him that though at times.

Pippen is nuts, I think Bird has called Lebron the best SF, which I don't think is far fetched anymore, I think most people on here are on board with that. Lately it seems people are squeezing him into the top 5, and it doesn't seem ridiculous, and he's got a lot left in the tank still. I think Lebron will be a top 5 player for atleast another 3 seasons, top 10 for atleast 5 more. Yeah Kobe got his breaks, he had Shaq for 3 titles, where Kobe was 2nd fiddle, he was a disaster in 2004, and in one of the Finals with Gasol I remember him being quite bad, I know was against Boston and Artest and some of his other teammates saved him when they were a minute away from losing to the Celtics in game 7. So every star player their bad moments, and Kobe had way more than Lebron. The whole stupid finals record thing on Lebron is ridiulous considering that one time his team sucked (first Cleveland final), he did choke though vs Dallas, and IMO they were heavily favored, IMO in 2014 he didn't have a lot of help since Bosh and Wade were injured (far more than Curry is currently), and last year I don't think anybody blames him for loosing.

[Knicks_Fan2]

They are both great. In 20-30 years, the guys that are trashing them now will be lauding their greatness to the younger generations and telling them how they don't make players like LeBron and Steph anymore. It's the natural order of things.

[crazy_me_87]

Lebron has had way more so called failures in the playoffs than Steph.

All them losing shows is that It's incredibly difficult to repeat as champs.


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Which ones?

In Losses Lebron lost to +7.02 SRS teams while carrying +4.35 SRS teams. Curry is about to lose as a +10.4 SRS team.

Now go figure everbody... what is worse?
Lebron regularly has dragged much Weaker Teams to the Second Round, Conference Finals and Finals..Teams that without him would not have won 20 Games...(I'm looking at you Cavs 2006-2010)
Curry is at Risk of losing while beeing on whats dubbed the Best Team of all Time..

[BigtimeNBAfan]

Lebron has had way more so called failures in the playoffs than Steph.

All them losing shows is that It's incredibly difficult to repeat as champs.


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And Lebron has also had far more playoff success than Curry. Curry's first 5 years in the league only produced 1 playoff series win. Lebron has had countless great performances in the playoffs. The fact that Lebron's brilliance is ignored while his bad moments are never forgotten are proof of this thread. Lebron has had more signature playoff games than any player post MJ.

[JDizzel3000]

I think people have selective memory if they think that the criticism of LeBron only began with the decision.

Dude got criticize for losing to the damn Spurs with that garbage team he took to the finals

he was killed for not shaking hands with the magic in 09 LOL

They said he literally quit on his team in 2010 after dropping a triple double

[Arman_tanzarian]

Random question. Maybe the people that hate him can answer this. Would it be better if Lebron loses now but not the finals as opposed to losing in the finals against OKC or GSW?

I've always wondered if he'd have a better career if:

DET took care of him in 07.
Indy took care of him in 14.
Bulls or ATL took care of his non Kyrie/Love team last year.

His finals record would then be better.