From a Legacy standpoint, how bad would it have looked for Lebron if Wade won the FMVP in 2011?

[Wolfy1983]

Call me a conspiracy nut but to this day I believed Lebron stopped playing in that series because Wade was the clear FMVP had Miami won that series. We all know that Lebron has a huge ego and have people say that he got carried to his first title would have been bad, especially when he is being considered to be the guy to dethrone Jordan as the G.O.A.T. What do you guys think?

P.S. Sorry for another Lebron thread.

[Splashin]

Pretty sure losing in the finals is worse for your legacy than not winning a FMVP

[OdomFan]

Nah they just lost because MVP Dirk and that Mavs team was good.

[Statlanta]

Only bad if you considered him to be the best player in the league at that point(or if your a person that champions him as the GOAT).

In a general career sense it should only add positive value if you were contributing in any way to a championship team.

I still don't like that he bulked up in Miami but that's personal preference.

[levon]

It might push the "Lebron was the best player in the league since 1776" narrative up a year.

[Wolfy1983]

Pretty sure losing in the finals is worse for your legacy than not winning a FMVP

Oh so the media constantly throwing it in his face that Wade was the FMVP in his first title win wouldn't be worse? Really? Skip would be bringing that up every day. Lebron has lost numerous finals but that ones that he has won, he was the FMVP for all 3. He wasn't carried to one.

[Harry Garris]

He didn't want to hurt his legacy so he... Played terribly in the 4th quarter of the last 3 finals games and arguably cost himself his first ring and gets the "choker" label for years, possibly the rest of his career? How is that not 100x worse than not winning Finals MVP? Sorry but this is one of the least believable theories I've seen on RGM and I've seen a lot of stuff man.

[Splashin]

Pretty sure losing in the finals is worse for your legacy than not winning a FMVP

Oh so the media constantly throwing it in his face that Wade was the FMVP in his first title win wouldn't be worse? Really? Skip would be bringing that up every day. Lebron has lost numerous finals but that ones that he has won, he was the FMVP for all 3. He wasn't carried to one.

I guess when people look back at curry's first two rings they wont consider him a great player because he didn't win the fmvp? Seems like petty reasoning to me.

[TheHartBreakKid]

Not bad at all assuming they still won the years after with Lebron as FMVP and 2016 still happens.





It would have been a **** show at the time though....some of it warranted and some unwarranted.

Edit: in my original post I said "not all that bad" but I meant to say "Not bad at all". 4>3

[TheHartBreakKid]

Pretty sure losing in the finals is worse for your legacy than not winning a FMVP

Definitely, so assuming that everything else goes the same way after that, it's hard to say Lebron's legacy would have been hurt. 4 rings from a legacy point is always better than 3, no matter who won the finals MVP. The haters (me probably included as one of them at the time) would talk a lot of crap and during that year Lebron things would have been super bittersweet for Lebron until he got the FMVP and chip the next year, but damn, the haters, me included, already talked a lot of crap during that year and things were definitely just bitter for Lebron at the time, without any sweet.

[Sofia]

4 rings 3 FMVP > 3 rings 3 FMVP

Pretty simple really. Everyone knew then and now that Lebron > Wade.

Wade having one hot series doesn’t hurt Lebron, unless you think Iggy hurt Curry’s legacy.

[Ainosterhaspie]

That series makes no sense. It is a complete anomaly given the rest of his career. Something was going on and it wasn't just LeBron being a choker who was afraid of the big lights. It could be several things and I'd love for him some day to be candid about it. I have several theories about it.

1. Along the lines of what you suggest, there was something about the LeBron/Wade relationship that wasn't right and caused LeBron not to play to his normal standard. Maybe as you suggest he didn't want Wade to get the glory. Maybe he wanted the "who is the alpha" question to be resolved and was willing to lose a series so that in future series it wouldn't continue to be a question. He in his passive aggressive way (as his detractors would have it) said essentially "let's see if Wade can win as the alpha". Wade didn't and the next year and throughout the rest of LeBron's tenure in Miami, he was the clear #1. LeBron's master plan worked, Miami settled in to a clear hierarchy and dominated until injury and age stopped them.

2. Injury/fatigue. He has shown wear in playoff series, most famously with the cramps against San Antonio. If he were to blame his performance on either of these things though he gets slammed for it. (Hard to see how it could be worse than now though). He doesn't want to make an excuse so some nagging injury that robbed him of explosiveness has never been reported even though it marred his performance dramatically. Keep this in mind as you go to the next one as they could mesh together.

3. Dallas was really good and flummoxed him. He isn't a Jordan/Kobe smash through a concrete wall no matter how thick kind of player. He probes looking for a weak point or a way around or over. He couldn't find it and rather than try to smash through it, stood there perplexed never putting into motion any kind of plan. Contributing to this problem was the fact that his team was atrocious outside the big three. Joel Anthony has to be the worst player that has ever started a finals, and rookie Mario Chalmers had to be relied on since the ancient Bibbi had one foot in the grave. Mike Miller was supposed to be a solid number four option, but struggled with injury all season and the cupboards were completely bare after him. They were almost playing three on five at times on offense and LeBron whose game heavily relies on getting others involved didn't know what to do there. His mid ranged and outside shot weren't that reliable and the Mavs covered the paint well so he had no good options with how to attack. Rather than take bad shots, he deferred to others far more than he should have. It's good to a point to do that, but at some point you may need to pull a Jordan /Kobe and just smash through that wall.

4. LeBron choked. This is a weak explanation. He was great in earlier series and through most of the first two games there really wasn't much to complain about with his play. Then with the Heat up big with about six minutes to go in game 2, and the Heat looking like they were about to take a commanding 2 game lead, it all fell apart. I just don't see that his inner "choker" suddenly manifesting there. Something else makes far more sense.

[TheHartBreakKid]

4 rings 3 FMVP > 3 rings 3 FMVP

Pretty simple really. Everyone knew then and now that Lebron > Wade.

Wade having one hot series doesn’t hurt Lebron, unless you think Iggy hurt Curry’s legacy.

Even if people didn't know Lebron >wade.....a ring is always better than not a ring. As a huge Kobe fan I can admit that in 2000, Kobe wasn't even necessarily a superstar yet, but that ring is still and obviously will always be a plus in his resume, just like Duncan's last ring as a role player is still obviously a plus in his resume...but yeah, you broke it down nicely, it's simple math really.

[tundraknight]

Iggy must of DESTROYED Curry’s legacy according to the OP.

[Jaw]

Doesn't make sense to me. So you aren't going to win Final's MVP so you intentionally play bad in the remainder of the finals? Now not only have you not won Final's MVP but people will say you choked in the Finals, they can still say DWade outplayed you and you don't have a ring (he had zero at this time). Legacy speaking Wade in his prime was as good as anybody and their is no shame in getting outplayed by him especially when on the same team (only 1 ball so give it to the guy who is hot and has better matchup).

I'm not sure what caused his poor performance in the finals but it is illogical to suggest he intentionally threw the series due to his ego and wanting to be the G.O.A.T.

[313 Professor]

Ehhh... LeBron can't be THAT calculated and... insecure essentially. This is one of the pettiest theories I've heard.

[Jables]

It would have been better. I don't think I've heard Kobe only having 2 FMVP's brought up that much, maybe a few times in MJ comparisons.
Let's be real, people were throwing anything in LeBron's face that year, no one held it against Bosh that he went to the Heat, it was always all about LeBron and people irrationally hating him, leaving a team so bad that Mo Williams got into the All Star game because he was the only other possible player when they were the top seed.

[jswede]

This is really a topic?