Trae Young

[JustBuzzin]

If he gets traded to the Spurs "Lawd Have Mercy" on the rest of the league. A unicorn talent like Wemby just needs a legit sidekick and they are on their way to being a contender overnight.

[jayu70]

If he gets traded to the Spurs "Lawd Have Mercy" on the rest of the league. A unicorn talent like Wemby just needs a legit sidekick and they are on their way to being a contender overnight.

Ah yes....Hawks help SAS on their way to another Dynasty quicker while Hawks spend their lottery luck trying to get another playing to build their team around for the next 6 years, again......I'll pass thank you very much.

[JustBuzzin]

If he gets traded to the Spurs "Lawd Have Mercy" on the rest of the league. A unicorn talent like Wemby just needs a legit sidekick and they are on their way to being a contender overnight.

Ah yes....Hawks help SAS on their way to another Dynasty quicker while Hawks spend their lottery luck trying to get another playing to build their team around for the next 6 years, again......I'll pass thank you very much.

The Hawks have such a weird history. Despite being one of the better locations in the league they can't seem to get big time stars there. Why do you think the Hawks have trouble getting big time FA's?

[jayu70]

If he gets traded to the Spurs "Lawd Have Mercy" on the rest of the league. A unicorn talent like Wemby just needs a legit sidekick and they are on their way to being a contender overnight.

Ah yes....Hawks help SAS on their way to another Dynasty quicker while Hawks spend their lottery luck trying to get another playing to build their team around for the next 6 years, again......I'll pass thank you very much.

The Hawks have such a weird history. Despite being one of the better locations in the league they can't seem to get big time stars there. Why do you think the Hawks have trouble getting big time FA's?

Ownership - there's ALWAYS 'Something'

[mcfly1204]

If he gets traded to the Spurs "Lawd Have Mercy" on the rest of the league. A unicorn talent like Wemby just needs a legit sidekick and they are on their way to being a contender overnight.

Ah yes....Hawks help SAS on their way to another Dynasty quicker while Hawks spend their lottery luck trying to get another playing to build their team around for the next 6 years, again......I'll pass thank you very much.

The Hawks have such a weird history. Despite being one of the better locations in the league they can't seem to get big time stars there. Why do you think the Hawks have trouble getting big time FA's?

What do you mean by "one of the better locations"? They're at the bottom of the league in attendance, and I've never really heard of people clamoring to visit Atlanta.

[Johnny Tomala]

There shouldn't trade him and they won't. Definitely not this summer.

[Ball4life32]

Ah yes....Hawks help SAS on their way to another Dynasty quicker while Hawks spend their lottery luck trying to get another playing to build their team around for the next 6 years, again......I'll pass thank you very much.

The Hawks have such a weird history. Despite being one of the better locations in the league they can't seem to get big time stars there. Why do you think the Hawks have trouble getting big time FA's?

What do you mean by "one of the better locations"? They're at the bottom of the league in attendance, and I've never really heard of people clamoring to visit Atlanta.

Atlanta was at 104% capacity in 2023 which ranked #2 behind Dallas so they’ve been putting butts in the seats since they had Trae.

[HotelVitale]

Spurs should play a little hardball with Atlanta (Spurs have what Atlanta wants - return of picks)
Spurs offer Keldon Johnson, 25 FRP, 26 swap and any player with salary under Sochan for Murray and Jalen Johnson.
Atlanta gets their picks back (major reason for the trade), gets a SF.
Spurs get a jump with talent around Wemby.
If Atlanta balks, Spurs could through in Toronto 24 FRP (convey or not).

This idea that ATL will kill to get back their own picks back seems off, not sure why you think that's a massive leverage point for SAS. Also the fact that you included Jalen Johnson blows this up--Keldon '25 1st and '26 swap probably doens't even land you JJ on its own.

If we just take this as Murray for two of Keldon/25 1st/26 swap, ATL doesn't desperately want to throw everything away and tank right away so the 2025 pick and 26 swap doesn't have outsized value to them. It's just a regular mid-1st rounder, esp since with Trae and everyone else on board they're not going to be that bad no matter what. In the grand scheme of how to get better and build a winner, they probably either want to sell off everyone or else position themsleves for a meaningful upgrade. Trading off their 2nd and 3rd best players for a mid-1st and a worse player doesn't make sense.

Spurs can play hardball. They can make the low-ball offer and then move up to what is acceptable to them. Atlanta has no leverage. Spurs see their draft picks as lottery for the next 3 years regardless of how good the Spurs are.
No one wants to go to Atlanta as a free-agent. Yes they will go if the money is significantly better than the alternative, but that team is not going to be more than play-in until they get better players.
Atlanta needs their picks back OR they need to make smart trades that net better picks. The only pieces not named Young that can bring a decent FRP is Murray and Johnson. I would certainly not give Johnson up for cheap. He is good enough to be a solid role/semi-star on a good team.Atlanta is stuck in play-in limbo for the foreseeable future without a move to rebuild or luck.

You're skipping a lot of steps and telling a story that the pieces don't add up to. You're right that ATL's sort of stuck right now but that doesn't mean they're forced to immediately make bad-value trades because they 'need to get decent 1st rounders.' That's a fake/arbitrary goal, and they're not going to do it if it's not the best move with the options they have. If the choice is between trading Murray for their own first and Keldon Johnson or just running back the team they have now (and keeping Murray as a player or trade piece), the second choice seems easily better. The upside of trading Murray is pretty small--getting back a mid-1st (who has a pretty low chance of being good any time soon) while getting a little worse but still not bad--and the upside of keeping him is at least as good--the team is better and might gel better that next year, you still have Murray in his prime to trade, and you've also gotten through about half the picks you owe SA. As you've argued extensively, Murray doesn't have great trade value this offseason so this just seems like a bad time to pull the trigger on that trade. It seems like a lateral move that doesn't set up later ones, and that's not what the Hawks need to do now.

The Spurs would have leverage if Murray was expiring and no one else really wanted him, and/or if he was really angling to go to SA. None of those things are true so the Spurs don't have any more leverage than 'we want your player and you're not that good right now.' ATL of course has the leverage of having the player other teams want here, and not needing to trade him any time soon.

In short, ATL is stuck in treadmill land atm but they have many different moves they could make and many directions they can take. Trading Dejounte for one mid-1st rounder while keeping the rest of the team pretty much the same doesn't seem like it's a good move no matter what decision they aim for.

[Bornstellar]

If he gets traded to the Spurs "Lawd Have Mercy" on the rest of the league. A unicorn talent like Wemby just needs a legit sidekick and they are on their way to being a contender overnight.

Ah yes....Hawks help SAS on their way to another Dynasty quicker while Hawks spend their lottery luck trying to get another playing to build their team around for the next 6 years, again......I'll pass thank you very much.

Well, it's either that or trade Young to someone else which may still help the Spurs by making those 2025-2027 picks more lucrative, or hold on to him and not be able to control your draft until 2028. Hawks are in a tough position going forward

[JustBuzzin]

Ah yes....Hawks help SAS on their way to another Dynasty quicker while Hawks spend their lottery luck trying to get another playing to build their team around for the next 6 years, again......I'll pass thank you very much.

The Hawks have such a weird history. Despite being one of the better locations in the league they can't seem to get big time stars there. Why do you think the Hawks have trouble getting big time FA's?

What do you mean by "one of the better locations"? They're at the bottom of the league in attendance, and I've never really heard of people clamoring to visit Atlanta.

Atlanta is known for the best strip clubs out East. The city is known for their popular clubs and nightlife. It's the mecca of hip hop. For a millionaire with a no kids it's probably a dream. Outside of Miami it's probably the 2nd best location out East for NBA players.

Even Kawhi hits up Magic City when he's in town.

[jayu70]

If he gets traded to the Spurs "Lawd Have Mercy" on the rest of the league. A unicorn talent like Wemby just needs a legit sidekick and they are on their way to being a contender overnight.

Ah yes....Hawks help SAS on their way to another Dynasty quicker while Hawks spend their lottery luck trying to get another playing to build their team around for the next 6 years, again......I'll pass thank you very much.

Well, it's either that or trade Young to someone else which may still help the Spurs by making those 2025-2027 picks more lucrative, or hold on to him and not be able to control your draft until 2028. Hawks are in a tough position going forward

But those aren't the ONLY options. As hard/tough as it may seem now....things change quickly. Time for the from.offive to stop making these quick hit decisions and exercise some patience and do the hard work to build around Trae and Jalen.

[louc1970]

.[/quote]

You're skipping a lot of steps and telling a story that the pieces don't add up to. You're right that ATL's sort of stuck right now but that doesn't mean they're forced to immediately make bad-value trades because they 'need to get decent 1st rounders.' That's a fake/arbitrary goal, and they're not going to do it if it's not the best move with the options they have. If the choice is between trading Murray for their own first and Keldon Johnson or just running back the team they have now (and keeping Murray as a player or trade piece), the second choice seems easily better. The upside of trading Murray is pretty small--getting back a mid-1st (who has a pretty low chance of being good any time soon) while getting a little worse but still not bad--and the upside of keeping him is at least as good--the team is better and might gel better that next year, you still have Murray in his prime to trade, and you've also gotten through about half the picks you owe SA. As you've argued extensively, Murray doesn't have great trade value this offseason so this just seems like a bad time to pull the trigger on that trade.

The Spurs would have leverage if Murray was expiring and no one else really wanted him, and/or if he was really angling to go to SA. None of those things are true so the Spurs don't have any more leverage than 'we want your player and you're not that good right now.' ATL of course has the leverage of having the player other teams want here, and not needing to trade him any time soon.

In short, ATL is stuck in treadmill land atm but they have many different moves they could make and many directions they can take. Trading Dejounte for one mid-1st rounder while keeping the rest of the team pretty much the same doesn't seem like it's a good move no matter what decision they aim for.[/quote]
If Atlanta runs it back, they are the same - play-in top limit. If the goal is to win, moves need to be made.
As those picks get exhausted Young ages, the bloom comes off his rose, and teams see exactly what they are getting -an offensive savant with little to no defensive ability that will cost nearly a third of the cap.
Trade while you can, restart with new youth.
The result is the same either way -no playoffs for either an aging overpriced team or a young and growing team.
I go with hope vs known.

[Chuck Everett]

Atlanta actually has some interesting pieces. Jalen Johnson, DeAndre Hunter, Okongwu, Bufkin, Griffin and Bogdanovic. I mean, part of me feels like if you keep that group together you should be able to build a competitive team. I blame Trae and Dejounte for not making it work. If either guy replaced Jalen Brunson, the Knicks would be worse.

[HotelVitale]

Ah yes....Hawks help SAS on their way to another Dynasty quicker while Hawks spend their lottery luck trying to get another playing to build their team around for the next 6 years, again......I'll pass thank you very much.

Well, it's either that or trade Young to someone else which may still help the Spurs by making those 2025-2027 picks more lucrative, or hold on to him and not be able to control your draft until 2028. Hawks are in a tough position going forward

But those aren't the ONLY options. As hard/tough as it may seem now....things change quickly. Time for the from.offive to stop making these quick hit decisions and exercise some patience and do the hard work to build around Trae and Jalen.

Yeah no one cares about 'helping the Spurs' but the point is the Hawks aren't forced to punt on Trae (who's 25 and signed for 4 years) to do a full reset right now. I get why Spurs fans are salivating at that but you can just say 'that'd be awesome' without repeating the false urgency story about how the Hawks MUST do that or else end up f'd for years. If your team was facing the possibility of keeping Trae and shuffling around some things now, or entering into a full and complete blind rebuild without very good assets for it, the average owner is going to give the Trae thing at least a year or two more. Lots of options to try to shake things up, and more importantly you can't give up a golden goose right when it starts laying poorly.

Another way to think about this: if the Hawks roll with Trae the next two years, their draft obligations to the Spurs are almost done and they and their fans will know for sure the Trae option isn't going to work. Trae will still be 27 and not expiring and will still have immense trade value, and they can start shifting to a rebuild with most of their own picks on hand (plus whatever they can get for Trae and others). It's not insane to make a trade now and go right into the rebuild, but given NBA ownership mindset and general business strategy that would be the eccentric and super unexpected move. Spurs fans should treat it as reasonable/plausible but definitely a very unusual move, instead of the obvious and logical one the Hawks MUST do.

[HotelVitale]

.

You're skipping a lot of steps and telling a story that the pieces don't add up to. You're right that ATL's sort of stuck right now but that doesn't mean they're forced to immediately make bad-value trades because they 'need to get decent 1st rounders.' That's a fake/arbitrary goal, and they're not going to do it if it's not the best move with the options they have. If the choice is between trading Murray for their own first and Keldon Johnson or just running back the team they have now (and keeping Murray as a player or trade piece), the second choice seems easily better. The upside of trading Murray is pretty small--getting back a mid-1st (who has a pretty low chance of being good any time soon) while getting a little worse but still not bad--and the upside of keeping him is at least as good--the team is better and might gel better that next year, you still have Murray in his prime to trade, and you've also gotten through about half the picks you owe SA. As you've argued extensively, Murray doesn't have great trade value this offseason so this just seems like a bad time to pull the trigger on that trade.

The Spurs would have leverage if Murray was expiring and no one else really wanted him, and/or if he was really angling to go to SA. None of those things are true so the Spurs don't have any more leverage than 'we want your player and you're not that good right now.' ATL of course has the leverage of having the player other teams want here, and not needing to trade him any time soon.

In short, ATL is stuck in treadmill land atm but they have many different moves they could make and many directions they can take. Trading Dejounte for one mid-1st rounder while keeping the rest of the team pretty much the same doesn't seem like it's a good move no matter what decision they aim for.

If Atlanta runs it back, they are the same - play-in top limit. If the goal is to win, moves need to be made.
As those picks get exhausted Young ages, the bloom comes off his rose, and teams see exactly what they are getting -an offensive savant with little to no defensive ability that will cost nearly a third of the cap.
Trade while you can, restart with new youth.
The result is the same either way -no playoffs for either an aging overpriced team or a young and growing team.
I go with hope vs known.

Think you missed the couple points I made. Put a little differently here, if you're arguing that the Hawks absolutely need to rebuild now, then you're a) probably at least a year too early for that and b) missing that trading Dejounte for a mid-1st rounder and some decent pieces doesn't accomplish that goal at all.

For a) the Hawks made the CF a few years back with a roster that wasn't more talented than what they have now, even if we don't think that's happening any time soon it's also a bad premise that winning like 38 games is the absolute best they can do. The Knicks of this year aren't more talented than them, they just got the right mix of role players and vibe/culture and the Hawks' management is very unlikely to think they have no chance at doing the same. Not when Trae is still so young, not before trying a few more things. (As for your point about the bloom coming off Trae's rose--his team's just had two full disappointing seasons and everyone knows exactly who he is and his limiations now, you're not smarter than GMs or ahead of the curve. He's still really good and has very little chance of declining by age 27 so it's fake urgency to think they must trade him now rather than later).

For b) if the team chooses a big rebuild and 'hope' than yeah a mid-first rounder isn't giving much of that. If you're saying 'restart with new youth' then that means totally clearing the decks and not just flipping Murray for not much. And also see a) again.

[threethehardway]

Ah yes....Hawks help SAS on their way to another Dynasty quicker while Hawks spend their lottery luck trying to get another playing to build their team around for the next 6 years, again......I'll pass thank you very much.

The Hawks have such a weird history. Despite being one of the better locations in the league they can't seem to get big time stars there. Why do you think the Hawks have trouble getting big time FA's?

What do you mean by "one of the better locations"? They're at the bottom of the league in attendance, and I've never really heard of people clamoring to visit Atlanta.

Atlanta is a hub of Black American culture and has been for decades.

Most Black celebrities have a home and spend part of their time in Atlanta.

Atlanta isn't a touristy spot like LA or NY or a vacation spot like Miami, but if you know you know.

Lots of fun for young Black multi-millionaires.

It's like Houston in that sense.

[Chuck Everett]

The Hawks have such a weird history. Despite being one of the better locations in the league they can't seem to get big time stars there. Why do you think the Hawks have trouble getting big time FA's?

What do you mean by "one of the better locations"? They're at the bottom of the league in attendance, and I've never really heard of people clamoring to visit Atlanta.

Atlanta is a hub of Black American culture and has been for decades.

Most Black celebrities have a home and spend part of their time in Atlanta.

Atlanta isn't a touristy spot like LA or NY or a vacation spot like Miami, but if you know you know.

Lots of fun for young Black multi-millionaires.

It's like Houston in that sense.

None of this has ever helped the Hawks lure black NBA stars sadly. I honestly don't know what it would take, but even during their highlight factory days, the best they could do was Paul Millsap or Joe Johnson.

[threethehardway]

None of this has ever helped the Hawks lure black NBA stars sadly. I honestly don't know what it would take, but even during their highlight factory days, the best they could do was Paul Millsap or Joe Johnson.

I believe NBA players go to teams for the organizational culture and facilities over location.

I don't think they care too much about the location of the team.

They are not like regular workers, they make enough money to go wherever they want to go in the off season.

I think Atlanta is like Miami in the sense there's too much to do at night for them to care about sports.

Unless there is a Michael Vick or a Deion Sanders, ATL doesn't care.

[Lalouie]

I am dumbfounded as to why some pundits are saying the Atlanta Hawks should trade Trae Young. Some of the reason they give are:
Atlanta will never win with Trae Young as the lead player or his defense is poor (yada yada yada).
But the same pundits say trade him to the Lakers to be the star to pair with AD after Lebron is done playing. Or trade him to the Spurs to be a star player to pair with Victor Wemba.

Why would Atlanta do that? Trae just got the Hawks to the eastern conference finals in 2020, was he not the best player on his team then? So the Atlanta should trade their first super star than have had since 1994. That to me is dumb.

Why not Atlanta trade for a star player..... KAT would be the goal for me. What would it take to get KAT.

the pundits grovel at lebrob's feet and want to see him in the playoffs. he has a competitive team but everyone wants lal to load up and coast like when @cavs and @miami.
regardless,,,,,, talent is absolutely wasted on bad teams because bad teams have bad FO. it's the Peter principle on full display. they should ax the lottery-it doesn't help.

atl however is a special case. they have evolved and honed their disfunctionality to a sweet science for decades now.... yes, the nba should remove Trae from that team by right of eminent domain

[JustBuzzin]

The Hawks have such a weird history. Despite being one of the better locations in the league they can't seem to get big time stars there. Why do you think the Hawks have trouble getting big time FA's?

What do you mean by "one of the better locations"? They're at the bottom of the league in attendance, and I've never really heard of people clamoring to visit Atlanta.

Atlanta is a hub of Black American culture and has been for decades.

Most Black celebrities have a home and spend part of their time in Atlanta.

Atlanta isn't a touristy spot like LA or NY or a vacation spot like Miami, but if you know you know.

Lots of fun for young Black multi-millionaires.

It's like Houston in that sense.

Which is why I'm surprised they can't get major stars to Atlanta.

Is it just a bad ownership thing?