Is Jokic better than Kobe ever was? How long before he surpasses him all-time?

uncleduck13 · Post #1 » by **uncleduck13** » Sat Apr 27, 2024 2:27 am

I think he’s clearly peaked higher. Adding a 3rd MVP + another FMVP, would pretty much seal the deal for me.

Luke · Post #2 » by **Luke** » Sat Apr 27, 2024 2:30 am

Why are you obsessed with Kobe ? Kobe had a better peak than Lebron , so do the math...

Cubbies2120 · Post #3 » by **Cubbies2120** » Sat Apr 27, 2024 2:30 am

uncleduck13 wrote:I think he’s clearly peaked higher. Adding a 3rd MVP + another FMVP, would pretty much seal the deal for me.

Pick any of Jokic's last 4 seasons. Any of them. They're all better than Kobe's peak season so yeah, Jokic's peak is up there with the MJ/LeBron tier and while his career isn't as accomplished I have no doubt by the end of his career he'll have 3+ MVPs (he might get a 4th or 5th) and win 3-4 titles.

Post #4 » by **tsherkin** » Sat Apr 27, 2024 2:31 am

Yeah, Jokic's peak notably exceeds Kobe.

Due respect to Bryant, who was an excellent player, but yeah, Joker is better than Kobe ever was.

uncleduck13 · Post #5 » by **uncleduck13** » Sat Apr 27, 2024 2:34 am

Luke wrote:Why are you obsessed with Kobe ? Kobe had a better peak than Lebron , so do the math...

LOL you don’t believe this

uncleduck13 · Post #6 » by **uncleduck13** » Sat Apr 27, 2024 2:37 am

Cubbies2120 wrote:
uncleduck13 wrote:I think he’s clearly peaked higher. Adding a 3rd MVP + another FMVP, would pretty much seal the deal for me.

Pick any of Jokic's last 4 seasons. Any of them. They're all better than Kobe's peak season so yeah, Jokic's peak is up there with the MJ/LeBron tier and while his career isn't as accomplished I have no doubt by the end of his career he'll have 3+ MVPs (he might get a 4th or 5th) and win 3-4 titles.

Well said. I personally don’t put too much stock in the number of titles, considering the discrepancy in talent that Kobe played with over Joker. I feel like all he needs to do is tie him in FMVP and it’s a closed case.

Luke · Post #7 » by **Luke** » Sat Apr 27, 2024 2:41 am

uncleduck13 wrote:
Luke wrote:Why are you obsessed with Kobe ? Kobe had a better peak than Lebron , so do the math...

LOL you don’t believe this

I believe that Kobe had a better PEAK than Lebron , YES, in so many ways that are not fantasy basketball ( stats )

Obviously Lebron has not had that big injury, so his body od work and his longevity are better, but he is in the tier of Kareem, Karl Malone, because of his longevity, not his peak.

Heej · Post #8 » by **Heej** » Sat Apr 27, 2024 2:47 am

Jokic is so much better than Kobe at his peak that with his 3rd MVP and tying him in Finals MVPs that he's already going to pass Kobe and solidify the top 10 this year. Gonna take more years to grind the last leg out but I ultimately think he ends up certified top 5 next to Bron KAJ Russell and MJ before Wemby kicks him out and recreates the old Immortal 6 that used to be a meme on RealGM 10 years ago.

TheGOATRises007 · Post #9 » by **TheGOATRises007** » Sat Apr 27, 2024 2:52 am

Yes and pretty soon

FrobeBryant · Post #10 » by **FrobeBryant** » Sat Apr 27, 2024 2:56 am

No he’s not and he won’t unless he gets more rings. This board has serious Kobe Derangement Syndrome.

uncleduck13 · Post #11 » by **uncleduck13** » Sat Apr 27, 2024 3:01 am

FrobeBryant wrote:No he’s not and he won’t unless he gets more rings. This board has serious Kobe Derangement Syndrome.

Hakeem has 2 and he’s over Kobe lol

Manimal · Post #12 » by **Manimal** » Sat Apr 27, 2024 3:04 am

FrobeBryant wrote:No he’s not and he won’t unless he gets more rings. This board has serious Kobe Derangement Syndrome.

Rings matter to a degree, but also not really a great way of comparing players individually. Kobe won 3 of his rings playing second fiddle to a top 10 player of all time, while both were in their primes. If Jokic got to be the second best player on his team to someone like Magic or LeBron in their prime, he'd probably be going for his 5th straight title right now. Instead, he's never even played with an all-star and spent a couple of his prime years with Will Barton as his #2 scorer. Comparing rings in that scenario doesn't make much sense.

1993Playoffs · Post #13 » by **1993Playoffs** » Sat Apr 27, 2024 3:05 am

Jokic is just a better player than Kobe.

FrobeBryant · Post #14 » by **FrobeBryant** » Sat Apr 27, 2024 3:09 am

uncleduck13 wrote:
FrobeBryant wrote:No he’s not and he won’t unless he gets more rings. This board has serious Kobe Derangement Syndrome.

Hakeem has 2 and he’s over Kobe lol

No he’s not

FrobeBryant · Post #15 » by **FrobeBryant** » Sat Apr 27, 2024 3:15 am

Manimal wrote:
FrobeBryant wrote:No he’s not and he won’t unless he gets more rings. This board has serious Kobe Derangement Syndrome.

Rings matter to a degree, but also not really a great way of comparing players individually. Kobe won 3 of his rings playing second fiddle to a top 10 player of all time, while both were in their primes. If Jokic got to be the second best player on his team to someone like Magic or LeBron in their prime, he'd probably be going for his 5th straight title right now. Instead, he's never even played with an all-star and spent a couple of his prime years with Will Barton as his #2 scorer. Comparing rings in that scenario doesn't make much sense.

Kobe also won 2 as the best player on his team. If Kobe had the talent Jokic has had on his team the last couple years he most likely would have won more. Yes Jokic is great, not denying that..but he’s got an amazing supporting cast that complement each other very well.

uncleduck13 · Post #16 » by **uncleduck13** » Sat Apr 27, 2024 3:19 am

FrobeBryant wrote:
Manimal wrote:
FrobeBryant wrote:No he’s not and he won’t unless he gets more rings. This board has serious Kobe Derangement Syndrome.

Rings matter to a degree, but also not really a great way of comparing players individually. Kobe won 3 of his rings playing second fiddle to a top 10 player of all time, while both were in their primes. If Jokic got to be the second best player on his team to someone like Magic or LeBron in their prime, he'd probably be going for his 5th straight title right now. Instead, he's never even played with an all-star and spent a couple of his prime years with Will Barton as his #2 scorer. Comparing rings in that scenario doesn't make much sense.

Kobe also won 2 as the best player on his team. If Kobe had the talent Jokic has had on his team the last couple years he most likely would have won more. Yes Jokic is great, not denying that..but he’s got an amazing supporting cast that complement each other very well.

Kobe won those 2 alongside another Hall of famer , while Jokic has yet to play with an All-Star. No way are you comparing team talent.

Heej · Post #17 » by **Heej** » Sat Apr 27, 2024 3:25 am

FrobeBryant wrote:No he’s not and he won’t unless he gets more rings. This board has serious Kobe Derangement Syndrome.

Kobe only has 2 FMVPs and 1 MVP while also just straight up not peaking as high as a player in general. If rings is your only argument in the debate you're cooked.

Sofia · Post #18 » by **Sofia** » Sat Apr 27, 2024 3:28 am

Jokic > Kobe

lambchop · Post #19 » by **lambchop** » Sat Apr 27, 2024 3:34 am

Heej wrote:
FrobeBryant wrote:No he’s not and he won’t unless he gets more rings. This board has serious Kobe Derangement Syndrome.

Kobe only has 2 FMVPs and 1 MVP while also just straight up not peaking as high as a player in general. If rings is your only argument in the debate you're cooked.

Yea, it's not that difficult to surpass Kobe, relatively speaking. In terms of fame and popularity, however, Joker will never come close.

Heej · Post #20 » by **Heej** » Sat Apr 27, 2024 3:35 am

lambchop wrote:
Heej wrote:
FrobeBryant wrote:No he’s not and he won’t unless he gets more rings. This board has serious Kobe Derangement Syndrome.

Kobe only has 2 FMVPs and 1 MVP while also just straight up not peaking as high as a player in general. If rings is your only argument in the debate you're cooked.

Yea, it's not that difficult to surpass Kobe, relatively speaking. In terms of fame and popularity, however, Joker will never come close.

That's fair