Denver's backcourt struggles could cost them as the playoffs continue

[Cubbies2120]

DeAndre is better than your favorite backup center

I've had DeAndre Jordan on my favorite team before and I currently have Dereck Lively as my backup center, so I can confidently say that is an absolutely laughable assumption if you're talking about my favorite team.

But Murray finding playoff mode again like he has in previous seasons is more important to Denver

Does it matter? They have Jokic. Who about 5 threads this week have claimed is better than prime Lebron/Shaq/MJ. Their backup center is irrelevant. It's time for him to show it. I don't care what his numbers are, he's been outplayed by AD in this series. Many of his assists seem to come off standstill/1 dribble handoffs at the top of the key. He will face harder teams in the next 3 rounds than any team Denver played last year, when/if they beat LA. With comparisons and claims like that, it's on him to figure it out! I haven't seen a guy who looks like the best player I've ever seen to this point.

Yeah of course you don't because they don't back up your opinion.


Jokic: .380 WS/48, 16.9 BPM, 0.8 VORP
Davis: .263 WS/48, 8.2 BPM, 0.4 VORP

Jokic: 29/15/10
Davis: 30/16/4

I'm halfway tempted to report you for trolling/baiting with the bolded comment. It's clear you're not watching the games if you think that's how he's getting his assists because reality is that his teammates, a sub par rag-tag bunch of journeymen and castaways, isn't able to generate any offense for themselves and is relying on him to spoon feed them. I think last night alone he had 3 SportsCenter highlight reel worthy passes.

But yes, that was just an idiotic take. The problem is that Jokic doesn't have a Maxey-level all-star teammate to take any pressure off him so he's essentially having to rely on MPJ being a consistent #3 option to beat the Lakers.

[LaLover11]

I've had DeAndre Jordan on my favorite team before and I currently have Dereck Lively as my backup center, so I can confidently say that is an absolutely laughable assumption if you're talking about my favorite team.

But Murray finding playoff mode again like he has in previous seasons is more important to Denver

Does it matter? They have Jokic. Who about 5 threads this week have claimed is better than prime Lebron/Shaq/MJ. Their backup center is irrelevant. It's time for him to show it. I don't care what his numbers are, he's been outplayed by AD in this series. Many of his assists seem to come off standstill/1 dribble handoffs at the top of the key. He will face harder teams in the next 3 rounds than any team Denver played last year, when/if they beat LA. With comparisons and claims like that, it's on him to figure it out! I haven't seen a guy who looks like the best player I've ever seen to this point.

Yeah of course you don't because they don't back up your opinion.


Jokic: .380 WS/48, 16.9 BPM, 0.8 VORP
Davis: .263 WS/48, 8.2 BPM, 0.4 VORP

Jokic: 29/15/10
Davis: 30/16/4

I'm halfway tempted to report you for trolling/baiting with the bolded comment. It's clear you're not watching the games if you think that's how he's getting his assists because reality is that his teammates, a sub par rag-tag bunch of journeymen and castaways, isn't able to generate any offense for themselves and is relying on him to spoon feed them. I think last night alone he had 3 SportsCenter highlight reel worthy passes.

But yes, that was just an idiotic take. The problem is that Jokic doesn't have a Maxey-level all-star teammate to take any pressure off him so he's essentially having to rely on MPJ being a consistent #3 option to beat the Lakers.

Porter is the #2 option for the Nuggets and Murray is #3
Funny enough those two players would be amazing with this current Lakers Roster and LeBron assist feeding them all game. Realistically AD and Jokic would be the greatest Front Court Duo of all time... Unless you can come up with a better combo I can't think of right now

These two teams match up great and just would've been great seeing this battle with a 29yr old LeBron instead of 39yrs old smh

[hardenASG13]

I've had DeAndre Jordan on my favorite team before and I currently have Dereck Lively as my backup center, so I can confidently say that is an absolutely laughable assumption if you're talking about my favorite team.

But Murray finding playoff mode again like he has in previous seasons is more important to Denver

Does it matter? They have Jokic. Who about 5 threads this week have claimed is better than prime Lebron/Shaq/MJ. Their backup center is irrelevant. It's time for him to show it. I don't care what his numbers are, he's been outplayed by AD in this series. Many of his assists seem to come off standstill/1 dribble handoffs at the top of the key. He will face harder teams in the next 3 rounds than any team Denver played last year, when/if they beat LA. With comparisons and claims like that, it's on him to figure it out! I haven't seen a guy who looks like the best player I've ever seen to this point.

He did last year. You remember when you said he and Nuggets couldn’t. Btw how does it feel cheering for a player that always let you down in the playoffs? It seems like you are jealous of the attention Jokic has received the last couple of years. It is interesting to say the least.

Well, he lucked out last year with one of if not the easiest paths I've ever seen. Like I said in the quoted post, the next 3 rounds will be harder matchups than any he faced last year, when/if they beat LA. I've said all along that I need to see him/Denver beat better teams to even think about considering him as an all time great. Which is what makes sense (rather than prematurely annointing him which many here are dying to do)because that's what guys who are all time greats do. Let's see what happens. I'm an eye test guy, and I see a slow defender who lacks killer scoring instinct to be considered "better than peak Lebron." If his supporting cast is struggling to put up points (they aren't, they had 4 20 point scorers in game 3), he better come through with some big scoring games as the "GOAT".

Also, who am I cheering for lol? You think Embiid? I merely stick up for him on this board because he is ridiculously crapped on by people who refuse to acknowledge how injured he's been in the playoffs. Guy is a monster. I'm cheering for the teams/series I bet on in a given game or series.

[Cubbies2120]

Does it matter? They have Jokic. Who about 5 threads this week have claimed is better than prime Lebron/Shaq/MJ. Their backup center is irrelevant. It's time for him to show it. I don't care what his numbers are, he's been outplayed by AD in this series. Many of his assists seem to come off standstill/1 dribble handoffs at the top of the key. He will face harder teams in the next 3 rounds than any team Denver played last year, when/if they beat LA. With comparisons and claims like that, it's on him to figure it out! I haven't seen a guy who looks like the best player I've ever seen to this point.

He did last year. You remember when you said he and Nuggets couldn’t. Btw how does it feel cheering for a player that always let you down in the playoffs? It seems like you are jealous of the attention Jokic has received the last couple of years. It is interesting to say the least.

Well, he lucked out last year with one of if not the easiest paths I've ever seen. Like I said in the quoted post, the next 3 rounds will be harder matchups than any he faced last year, when/if they beat LA. I've said all along that I need to see him/Denver beat better teams to even think about considering him as an all time great. Which is what makes sense (rather than prematurely annointing him which many here are dying to do)because that's what guys who are all time greats do. Let's see what happens. I'm an eye test guy, and I see a slow defender who lacks killer scoring instinct to be considered "better than peak Lebron." If his supporting cast is struggling to put up points (they aren't, they had 4 20 point scorers in game 3), he better come through with some big scoring games as the "GOAT".

Also, who am I cheering for lol? You think Embiid? I merely stick up for him on this board because he is ridiculously crapped on by people who refuse to acknowledge how injured he's been in the playoffs. Guy is a monster. I'm cheering for the teams/series I bet on in a given game or series.

Your "eye test" is trash if you think the guy who dropped 53 points in a playoff game last year and averaged 30/14/10 through 20 playoff games hasn't had big scoring games.
Jokic playoff career: 28/12/7 through 72 games
"GOAT" scoring big man Embiid playoff career: 25/11/3 through 56 games

Everyone's injuried in the playoffs as Jokic said. He won the title with a lingering wrist injury going on 3 years now and is dealing with back issues all season, but he doesn't run PR campaigns when he struggles to let the world known and create 'narratives' to excuse crappy play. With Embiid, we know about every nick, twist and tweak year round.

[hardenASG13]

I've had DeAndre Jordan on my favorite team before and I currently have Dereck Lively as my backup center, so I can confidently say that is an absolutely laughable assumption if you're talking about my favorite team.

But Murray finding playoff mode again like he has in previous seasons is more important to Denver

Does it matter? They have Jokic. Who about 5 threads this week have claimed is better than prime Lebron/Shaq/MJ. Their backup center is irrelevant. It's time for him to show it. I don't care what his numbers are, he's been outplayed by AD in this series. Many of his assists seem to come off standstill/1 dribble handoffs at the top of the key. He will face harder teams in the next 3 rounds than any team Denver played last year, when/if they beat LA. With comparisons and claims like that, it's on him to figure it out! I haven't seen a guy who looks like the best player I've ever seen to this point.

Yeah of course you don't because they don't back up your opinion.


Jokic: .380 WS/48, 16.9 BPM, 0.8 VORP
Davis: .263 WS/48, 8.2 BPM, 0.4 VORP

Jokic: 29/15/10
Davis: 30/16/4

I'm halfway tempted to report you for trolling/baiting with the bolded comment. It's clear you're not watching the games if you think that's how he's getting his assists because reality is that his teammates, a sub par rag-tag bunch of journeymen and castaways, isn't able to generate any offense for themselves and is relying on him to spoon feed them. I think last night alone he had 3 SportsCenter highlight reel worthy passes.

But yes, that was just an idiotic take. The problem is that Jokic doesn't have a Maxey-level all-star teammate to take any pressure off him so he's essentially having to rely on MPJ being a consistent #3 option to beat the Lakers.

Their starting 5 was the best in the league last year, and is either 1 or 2 this year. Report me haha (a guy pointed out an aspect of Jokics assist numbers that I don't like, wahhhhh). When claims are thrown out that a guy is better than peak Lebron, nitpicking his game comes with the territory. Believe it or not, its OK to scrutinize superstar players in the NBA playoffs. Superstars before him have been criticized too. You seem to take it VERY personally though.

Of course he gets nice assists. He also gets alot of then through standstill or 1 dribble dribble handoffs. Of course his team relies on him to set them up......as do any teams with a superstar player haha.

[AleksandarN]

Does it matter? They have Jokic. Who about 5 threads this week have claimed is better than prime Lebron/Shaq/MJ. Their backup center is irrelevant. It's time for him to show it. I don't care what his numbers are, he's been outplayed by AD in this series. Many of his assists seem to come off standstill/1 dribble handoffs at the top of the key. He will face harder teams in the next 3 rounds than any team Denver played last year, when/if they beat LA. With comparisons and claims like that, it's on him to figure it out! I haven't seen a guy who looks like the best player I've ever seen to this point.

He did last year. You remember when you said he and Nuggets couldn’t. Btw how does it feel cheering for a player that always let you down in the playoffs? It seems like you are jealous of the attention Jokic has received the last couple of years. It is interesting to say the least.

Well, he lucked out last year with one of if not the easiest paths I've ever seen. Like I said in the quoted post, the next 3 rounds will be harder matchups than any he faced last year, when/if they beat LA. I've said all along that I need to see him/Denver beat better teams to even think about considering him as an all time great. Which is what makes sense (rather than prematurely annointing him which many here are dying to do)because that's what guys who are all time greats do. Let's see what happens. I'm an eye test guy, and I see a slow defender who lacks killer scoring instinct to be considered "better than peak Lebron." If his supporting cast is struggling to put up points (they aren't, they had 4 20 point scorers in game 3), he better come through with some big scoring games as the "GOAT".

Also, who am I cheering for lol? You think Embiid? I merely stick up for him on this board because he is ridiculously crapped on by people who refuse to acknowledge how injured he's been in the playoffs. Guy is a monster. I'm cheering for the teams/series I bet on in a given game or series.

Wrong playoff performer I am talking about Harden. Who cares about Embiid. The only reason why you even cheered for Embiid because he was teammates with Harden.

Easiest championship run ever right? So easy he averages a triple double first person ever to lead in triple doubles, lead in the playoffs in pts rebs and assists. No one ever has accomplished that feat. He also faced AD, Golbert Bam on his way. How many defensive player of the years did they win. But hey easy man. Anyone can do it

[hardenASG13]

He did last year. You remember when you said he and Nuggets couldn’t. Btw how does it feel cheering for a player that always let you down in the playoffs? It seems like you are jealous of the attention Jokic has received the last couple of years. It is interesting to say the least.

Well, he lucked out last year with one of if not the easiest paths I've ever seen. Like I said in the quoted post, the next 3 rounds will be harder matchups than any he faced last year, when/if they beat LA. I've said all along that I need to see him/Denver beat better teams to even think about considering him as an all time great. Which is what makes sense (rather than prematurely annointing him which many here are dying to do)because that's what guys who are all time greats do. Let's see what happens. I'm an eye test guy, and I see a slow defender who lacks killer scoring instinct to be considered "better than peak Lebron." If his supporting cast is struggling to put up points (they aren't, they had 4 20 point scorers in game 3), he better come through with some big scoring games as the "GOAT".

Also, who am I cheering for lol? You think Embiid? I merely stick up for him on this board because he is ridiculously crapped on by people who refuse to acknowledge how injured he's been in the playoffs. Guy is a monster. I'm cheering for the teams/series I bet on in a given game or series.

Your "eye test" is trash if you think the guy who dropped 53 points in a playoff game last year and averaged 30/14/10 through 20 playoff games hasn't had big scoring games.
Jokic playoff career: 28/12/7 through 72 games
"GOAT" scoring big man Embiid playoff career: 25/11/3 through 56 games

Everyone's injuried in the playoffs as Jokic said. He won the title with a lingering wrist injury going on 3 years now and is dealing with back issues all season, but he doesn't run PR campaigns when he struggles to let the world known and create 'narratives' to excuse crappy play. With Embiid, we know about every nick, twist and tweak year round.

I don't think he hasn't had big scoring games. He obviously has. I need to see him do it when it's needed (competitive greatness) Against teams who actually have the personnel to beat them (didn't face any last year, will in the next 3 rounds when/if they beat LA).

[hardenASG13]

He did last year. You remember when you said he and Nuggets couldn’t. Btw how does it feel cheering for a player that always let you down in the playoffs? It seems like you are jealous of the attention Jokic has received the last couple of years. It is interesting to say the least.

Well, he lucked out last year with one of if not the easiest paths I've ever seen. Like I said in the quoted post, the next 3 rounds will be harder matchups than any he faced last year, when/if they beat LA. I've said all along that I need to see him/Denver beat better teams to even think about considering him as an all time great. Which is what makes sense (rather than prematurely annointing him which many here are dying to do)because that's what guys who are all time greats do. Let's see what happens. I'm an eye test guy, and I see a slow defender who lacks killer scoring instinct to be considered "better than peak Lebron." If his supporting cast is struggling to put up points (they aren't, they had 4 20 point scorers in game 3), he better come through with some big scoring games as the "GOAT".

Also, who am I cheering for lol? You think Embiid? I merely stick up for him on this board because he is ridiculously crapped on by people who refuse to acknowledge how injured he's been in the playoffs. Guy is a monster. I'm cheering for the teams/series I bet on in a given game or series.

Wrong playoff performer I am talking about Harden. Who cares about Embiid. The only reason why you even cheered for Embiid because he was teammates with Harden.

Easiest championship run ever right? So easy he averages a triple double first person ever to lead in triple doubles, lead in the playoffs in pts rebs and assists. No one ever has accomplished that feat.

Wrong assumption. I was an OKC/Durant fan and made my screen name in 2012, before OKC traded Harden, predicting he'd be an all star in 2013 (he was). But OKC traded him and I stopped following him. I don't care enough to change my screen name. Search my posts in the OKC forum if you don't believe me. I was the one everyone there disagreed with because I said Perkins stunk, playing Roberson was a joke in a shooting league and that Jerami Grant should be playing more. It was fun times. Also take a look for any posts from me anywhere being a Harden fanboy. You won't find them, because he's not a player I've ever really followed. He was extremely good in his prime though, disappeared in some playoff moments.

That was a nice accomplishment. He's really good. Triple doubles aren't what they once were though, I think you'd agree with that? I still stand by my post, and look forward to seeing if he can take his game, particularly his scoring, to the needed levels vs. some harder competition this year. I can't wait to see it! If he's as good as prime Lebron/MJ/Shaq, with a top 2 starting 5 in these playoffs, the expectation should be title again and if he gets through Minny/OKC(or Dallas) and then Boston, I'll happily begin to acknowledge what many here are, in my opinion, prematurely trying to jam down my throat with threads about him being an all time great popping up every day.

[ConSarnit]

KCP was better in Game 4 against LA but they got nothing from Braun or Jackson and Murray took 23 shots to get 22 points and had a 5/4 assist to turnover ratio.

This team is not as good as last year's team, at least not so far in the postseason.

They are missing Brown badly and Murray has to pick it up.

Murray isn't an All Star because trying hard for 1/4 quarters isn't enough.

This was clear to anyone who doesn't have an agenda of trying to prop up Jokic's teammates in order to deflate Jokic's greatness.

Last year was a title won in fashion similar to the 03 Spurs, 11 Mavs, and 95 Rockets. It was a one man show who shouldered the burden of overcoming legend after legend.

What he can't do is win with teammates that play like absolute bums. None of them are great players, but they're at least average at their position. When they play way below average (i.e. Murray) we get results like tonight's game where a 33/14/14 effort is wasted due to boneheaded plays by the supposed "second star".

Jamal Murray averaged 26/7/6 on 59% TS in last years playoffs. Those are better numbers than most teams #1 playoff option.

So no, it wasn’t the same as the ‘03 Spurs. Lol.

[AleksandarN]

Well, he lucked out last year with one of if not the easiest paths I've ever seen. Like I said in the quoted post, the next 3 rounds will be harder matchups than any he faced last year, when/if they beat LA. I've said all along that I need to see him/Denver beat better teams to even think about considering him as an all time great. Which is what makes sense (rather than prematurely annointing him which many here are dying to do)because that's what guys who are all time greats do. Let's see what happens. I'm an eye test guy, and I see a slow defender who lacks killer scoring instinct to be considered "better than peak Lebron." If his supporting cast is struggling to put up points (they aren't, they had 4 20 point scorers in game 3), he better come through with some big scoring games as the "GOAT".

Also, who am I cheering for lol? You think Embiid? I merely stick up for him on this board because he is ridiculously crapped on by people who refuse to acknowledge how injured he's been in the playoffs. Guy is a monster. I'm cheering for the teams/series I bet on in a given game or series.

Wrong playoff performer I am talking about Harden. Who cares about Embiid. The only reason why you even cheered for Embiid because he was teammates with Harden.

Easiest championship run ever right? So easy he averages a triple double first person ever to lead in triple doubles, lead in the playoffs in pts rebs and assists. No one ever has accomplished that feat.

Wrong assumption. I was an OKC/Durant fan and made my screen name in 2012, before OKC traded Harden, predicting he'd be an all star in 2013 (he was). But OKC traded him and I stopped following him. I don't care enough to change my screen name. Search my posts in the OKC forum if you don't believe me. I was the one everyone there disagreed with because I said Perkins stunk, playing Roberson was a joke in a shooting league and that Jerami Grant should be playing more. It was fun times. Also take a look for any posts from me anywhere being a Harden fanboy. You won't find them, because he's not a player I've ever really followed. He was extremely good in his prime though, disappeared in some playoff moments.

That was a nice accomplishment. He's really good. Triple doubles aren't what they once were though, I think you'd agree with that? I still stand by my post, and look forward to seeing if he can take his game, particularly his scoring, to the needed levels vs. some harder competition this year. I can't wait to see it! If he's as good as prime Lebron/MJ/Shaq, with a top 2 starting 5 in these playoffs, the expectation should be title again and if he gets through Minny/OKC(or Dallas) and then Boston, I'll happily begin to acknowledge what many here are, in my opinion, prematurely trying to jam down my throat with threads about him being an all time great popping up every day.

Scoring?? Jokic is 8th all time in ppg in the playoffs. 8th all time. We are not talking about a small sample size. And again last year he faced centers who accounted for a combination of 14 defensive player of the year and all nba defense team awards. Btw it is not on realgn either that are calling him an all time great. Past legends have called him an all time great. But hey you know more than HOF legends of the game right?

[bledredwine]

Jamal Murray is an enigma to me.
He decides to be the GOAT intermittently. It makes no sense and I don’t think that I’ll ever understand his ability to catch fire and disappear.

[AleksandarN]

The one thing Murray needs is consistency. Once that happens all stars will be coming. Jamal has the talent. I believe in him.

[guynumber45]

Does it matter? They have Jokic. Who about 5 threads this week have claimed is better than prime Lebron/Shaq/MJ. Their backup center is irrelevant. It's time for him to show it. I don't care what his numbers are, he's been outplayed by AD in this series. Many of his assists seem to come off standstill/1 dribble handoffs at the top of the key. He will face harder teams in the next 3 rounds than any team Denver played last year, when/if they beat LA. With comparisons and claims like that, it's on him to figure it out! I haven't seen a guy who looks like the best player I've ever seen to this point.

Yeah of course you don't because they don't back up your opinion.


Jokic: .380 WS/48, 16.9 BPM, 0.8 VORP
Davis: .263 WS/48, 8.2 BPM, 0.4 VORP

Jokic: 29/15/10
Davis: 30/16/4

I'm halfway tempted to report you for trolling/baiting with the bolded comment. It's clear you're not watching the games if you think that's how he's getting his assists because reality is that his teammates, a sub par rag-tag bunch of journeymen and castaways, isn't able to generate any offense for themselves and is relying on him to spoon feed them. I think last night alone he had 3 SportsCenter highlight reel worthy passes.

But yes, that was just an idiotic take. The problem is that Jokic doesn't have a Maxey-level all-star teammate to take any pressure off him so he's essentially having to rely on MPJ being a consistent #3 option to beat the Lakers.

Porter is the #2 option for the Nuggets and Murray is #3
Funny enough those two players would be amazing with this current Lakers Roster and LeBron assist feeding them all game. Realistically AD and Jokic would be the greatest Front Court Duo of all time... Unless you can come up with a better combo I can't think of right now

These two teams match up great and just would've been great seeing this battle with a 29yr old LeBron instead of 39yrs old smh

29 year old Lebron and current AD would be 2 of the top 10 players in the NBA. When you add in all the shot creators the Lakers have, that'd just be unfair. We need to give Jokic more help in that scenario

[Saints14]

Jamal Murray is an enigma to me.
He decides to be the GOAT intermittently. It makes no sense and I don’t think that I’ll ever understand his ability to catch fire and disappear.

I don't think it's much deeper than he's just a fairly streaky player

[hardenASG13]

Wrong playoff performer I am talking about Harden. Who cares about Embiid. The only reason why you even cheered for Embiid because he was teammates with Harden.

Easiest championship run ever right? So easy he averages a triple double first person ever to lead in triple doubles, lead in the playoffs in pts rebs and assists. No one ever has accomplished that feat.

Wrong assumption. I was an OKC/Durant fan and made my screen name in 2012, before OKC traded Harden, predicting he'd be an all star in 2013 (he was). But OKC traded him and I stopped following him. I don't care enough to change my screen name. Search my posts in the OKC forum if you don't believe me. I was the one everyone there disagreed with because I said Perkins stunk, playing Roberson was a joke in a shooting league and that Jerami Grant should be playing more. It was fun times. Also take a look for any posts from me anywhere being a Harden fanboy. You won't find them, because he's not a player I've ever really followed. He was extremely good in his prime though, disappeared in some playoff moments.

That was a nice accomplishment. He's really good. Triple doubles aren't what they once were though, I think you'd agree with that? I still stand by my post, and look forward to seeing if he can take his game, particularly his scoring, to the needed levels vs. some harder competition this year. I can't wait to see it! If he's as good as prime Lebron/MJ/Shaq, with a top 2 starting 5 in these playoffs, the expectation should be title again and if he gets through Minny/OKC(or Dallas) and then Boston, I'll happily begin to acknowledge what many here are, in my opinion, prematurely trying to jam down my throat with threads about him being an all time great popping up every day.

Scoring?? Jokic is 8th all time in ppg in the playoffs. 8th all time. We are not talking about a small sample size. And again last year he faced centers who accounted for a combination of 14 defensive player of the year and all nba defense team awards. Btw it is not on realgn either that are calling him an all time great. Past legends have called him an all time great. But hey you know more than HOF legends of the game right?

Nah. Scoring numbers are off the charts these days. I'm not talking rankings, I'm talking against legit competition, will he be able to go off for big scoring nights when his team needs it (like Lebron vs Detroit, or Lebron @Boston game 6 for example). Theres no doubt he's on a great run, I just have to see his competitive greatness and leadership vs some teams who have a chance to realistically beat Denver, which they'll face the next 3 rounds if they get by LA (and that they didn't face last year.....not a single one). Until then, I think putting him in prime Lebron/MJ/Shaq territory as this board is doing all day/everyday is premature.

[naabzor]

Murray played like crap and they still up 3 - 1. But they need him to repeat.

[cjx]

Don't worry, fam

Nuggets Country, Let's Ride to Victory Again !!

Nuggets will eliminate the Lakers in game 5 by 17 pts, Maestro Murray will drop 29 pts, King Joker will also drop a triple-double, book it!

Nuggets in 5 !

[Up-And-Coming]

I just don't see it. They are a very talented, well coached and well rounded team. Yes, Murray and KCP have struggled some but we can't ignore Michael Porter Jr has picked up the slack and has been playing like an All-Star averaging 22 and 10 on good efficiency and Gordon has been more than solid. They have missed having Bruce Brown Jr as added depth but their starting 5 is still the best imo (yes even better than Boston's).

Where does Denver's 2 through 5 rank among teams?

I'd say a slightly above average 2-5 for the regular season and probably a top 5 2-5 in the playoffs. I don't particularly like making specific 2-5 comparisons that often because I think there's a lot of subjectivity to it in terms of fit, skillsets, adaptability to playoff intensity, etc.

Listen, I think Jokic is clearly the best player in the game today but I also think a lot of people just brush off his supporting cast to try and boost Jokic's legacy even more when it's not necessary and sells the others short. Jokic's elite play speaks for itself. His supporting cast is also a talented and well-rounded bunch that fits perfectly with his elite playmaking, finishing ability and physical toughness.

[Special_Puppy]

No point in talking about Brown. There was zero way they could resign him.

Denver has the best and most cohesive and experienced starting five in the NBA. It costs money to keep them together. They had no money left over to sign veterans for the bench. That's the downside of having such a great starting lineup. Drafting Braun and Watson in the 20's was a godsend. Unfortunately they did not get much out of their three draft picks last year. Would have been nice to get a Trayce Jackson-Davis with one of those picks but whatever.

I expect continued development from Braun and especially Watson, who hardly played in college and his rookie year. It's almost like he took two years off and had to be rebuilt from scratch. He's going to be big time next year. If Strawther can become a consistent knock down shooter they'll be fine. I'm not worried.

Boston has a very expensive starting 5 and has one of the best benches in the league. Denver having a bottom 10 bench is just a sign of not having a particularly great front office

[Woodsanity]

Jamal has been really really bad. Think he is hurt