Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?

[te887848]

Damn 22 pages.... the real question is where does he rank with another 3 peat which I think is likely. Two 3 peats put him in the top 5 imo

[An Unbiased Fan]

Damn 22 pages.... the real question is where does he rank with another 3 peat which I think is likely. Two 3 peats put him in the top 5 imo

2 3-Peats put him Top 3 frankly. That would be 6 titles, 3 Finals MVPs in a row, 8 Finals, possibly 10 All-NBA 1st teams, #2 HCA efficiency behind MJ.

[kobethegoat]

Damn 22 pages.... the real question is where does he rank with another 3 peat which I think is likely. Two 3 peats put him in the top 5 imo

two 3-peats in the modern era will make Kobe GOAT status, on par with Jordan.

I cant see how anyone can argue this. Kobe hasn't played on teams that were stacked like the 80s Lakers(like Magic was on), the first 3 peat was Shaq, Kobe and 10 role players. The 2nd(potential) 3peat is Kobe, Gasol, Odom and role players. I give rings won in the modern era far higher than those won in the 80s and earlier, because back in those days the title either was LA's or Bostons by default.

[hasslinghoff]

the only way to save this thread...

[pancakes3]

same number of rings, lesser stats in a hand-check free world, and played with shaq for 3 of his rings puts him lower than MJ.

what major difference do you think there is between the "modern era" and the 80s? zone defenses and hand checks are NOT as drastic changes as realgm has made it out to be.

6 rings puts him clearly ahead of magic and bird in my book and certainly challenging Wilt and KAJ depending on the stats he puts up next season in getting his 6th.

[NYK 455]

How would 2 rings as a first option pass 4 from Duncan? And no, Kobe wasn't on the same level as Duncan and Shaq.

[bl2k]

How would 2 rings as a first option pass 4 from Duncan? And no, Kobe wasn't on the same level as Duncan and Shaq.

Kobe won as 1B not a Pippen role,, and put up first option numbers. Any stars game was gonna have to fall back if they played with Shaq. You just want to discredit Kobe's rings and his importance to LA 3 peating Kobe will definately be compared with Shaq and Duncan if he wins this year, hell he already is. get over it

[An Unbiased Fan]

How would 2 rings as a first option pass 4 from Duncan? And no, Kobe wasn't on the same level as Duncan and Shaq.

5 rings as a Top 5 player is impressive, no mattter which way you spin it. If Lebron and Wade team up, will only one get credit?

Should we divide the Russell/Cousy rings up? What about the Wilt/West one? Oscar or KAJ, who get's that ring? KAJ was the MVP in 80', does that leave Magic with 4 or 3 if you take off 82'? Does KAJ lose 85', 87', and 88'???? What about Shaq in 06'??

Please tell us, which rings count, and which ones don't.

[NYK 455]

How would 2 rings as a first option pass 4 from Duncan? And no, Kobe wasn't on the same level as Duncan and Shaq.

5 rings as a Top 5 player is impressive, no mattter which way you spin it. If Lebron and Wade team up, will only one get credit?

Should we divide the Russell/Cousy rings up? What about the Wilt/West one? Oscar or KAJ, who get's that ring? KAJ was the MVP in 80', does that leave Magic with 4 or 3 if you take off 82'? Does KAJ lose 85', 87', and 88'???? What about Shaq in 06'??

Please tell us, which rings count, and which ones don't.

When talking about the best players of all time, rings as a best player mean the most. In a Wade/LeBron situation, bothplayers would get significant credit for the rings, seeing as how they are very close in terms of talent and impact. Shaq/Kobe was not the same situation. Although Kobe played a big role, Shaq was easily the best player on the team. Stop trying to rewrite history.

As far as Russell/Cousy, Russell gets most of the credit, because he was there best player that made the most impact on the team. No one talks about Cousy for GOAT.

[KING JAMES1978]

How would 2 rings as a first option pass 4 from Duncan? And no, Kobe wasn't on the same level as Duncan and Shaq.

5 rings as a Top 5 player is impressive, no mattter which way you spin it. If Lebron and Wade team up, will only one get credit?

Should we divide the Russell/Cousy rings up? What about the Wilt/West one? Oscar or KAJ, who get's that ring? KAJ was the MVP in 80', does that leave Magic with 4 or 3 if you take off 82'? Does KAJ lose 85', 87', and 88'???? What about Shaq in 06'??

Please tell us, which rings count, and which ones don't.

It's different for a player to be the 1st option,the leader when he win Rings.
Shaq has 4 rings,3 as the leader-as the 1st option
Kobe has 4 Rings,1 as the leader-as the 1st option..There is no 1a and 1b..These are b......
Is the 1st option and the 2nd option..Shaq was the 1st option..Shaq was also the MVP 2000 and the MVP candidate 2001 and 2002.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/awa ... 0.html#mvp
http://www.basketball-reference.com/awa ... 1.html#mvp
http://www.basketball-reference.com/awa ... 2.html#mvp

So simple.

[An Unbiased Fan]

How would 2 rings as a first option pass 4 from Duncan? And no, Kobe wasn't on the same level as Duncan and Shaq.

5 rings as a Top 5 player is impressive, no mattter which way you spin it. If Lebron and Wade team up, will only one get credit?

Should we divide the Russell/Cousy rings up? What about the Wilt/West one? Oscar or KAJ, who get's that ring? KAJ was the MVP in 80', does that leave Magic with 4 or 3 if you take off 82'? Does KAJ lose 85', 87', and 88'???? What about Shaq in 06'??

Please tell us, which rings count, and which ones don't.

When talking about the best players of all time, rings as a best player mean the most. In a Wade/LeBron situation, bothplayers would get significant credit for the rings, seeing as how they are very close in terms of talent and impact. Shaq/Kobe was not the same situation. Although Kobe played a big role, Shaq was easily the best player on the team. Stop trying to rewrite history.

As far as Russell/Cousy, Russell gets most of the credit, because he was there best player that made the most impact on the team. No one talks about Cousy for GOAT.

Kobe was a Top 5 player for those 3 rings, how in the World is that not comparable to Lebron/Wade, KAJ/Magic, or Oscar/KAJ?

The Top 5 in the NBA right now are arguably, Kobe,Lebron,Dwight,Wade,Dirk. If any of these 2 were on the same team, then that team would have 2 Top 5 players like the 3-peat Lakers did. Both of those players would deserve credit.

If Shaq went to Chicago in 96' to team up with MJ, would both get credit????? Of course they would.

[Minge]

It's different for a player to be the 1st option, the leader when he win rings.

Ask Shaq: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y_I6pMo10jE

Regarding 1st options. The 80's Lakers had 4 guys 20-ppg. Worthy, Kareem, and Scott were all 1st options at a given point. So why can't the same hold true between O'Neal and Bryant? It has been too rare a case where a team would have 2 borderline 30ppg scorers. Just because teams were focusing one guy over another doesn't mean that the assignment was always a 1st option. O'Neal didn't really have competition talentwise, so teams had to focus on him. Bryant had the better competition. Still doubled on the perimeter. Still zoned on the perimeter. Still equally as dominant. As a 1st option O'Neal was never a guy counted on in the 4th quarter, it was Bryant.

[design786]

Kobe "THE RAPIST" Bryant will still rank below Michael Jordan and Lebron James, in the end.

Kobe just isn't that good, even when mimicking Michael Jordan.

[Wile E. Coyote]

No, the hypocrisy is as follows:

A. You want to count rings

Yes, when you have players with similar abilities and skills.

which leads to

B. People citing Pippen

He's nowhere near the top ten in terms of overall ability. End of bringing up Pippen.

which leads to

C. You saying you have to look at the context of the titles

That's right. If Kobe wins it this year, he will have been the best or second best player with five rings. Scottie Pippen was the second best player with six rings. In that context, and in terms of ability, he's nowhere near Kobe.

which leads to

D. People saying "YES! That's what we're talking about!"

which leads to

E. You missing the point

No. It leads to you missing the point, like you've been doing since this discussion started.

[microfib4thewin]

Yeah, there are four quarters in a game. What was his FT% in the other three?

If a team is fully committed to fouling as a way to slow down Shaq they would have at least two guys fouled out already by halftime. Eventually Shaq will get his because the amount of fouls they can use is limited.

But Kareem gets credit for the 87-88 titles when he was scoring 15-20 ppg, and Kobe gets no credit when he's scoring 21-30 ppg? That's BS.

Kareem was freaking 41 when he won his last title in 88. Age, Forty, One. If Kobe can still win a title as a 20/5/5 player when that time comes then I'll be impressed. People credit Kareem's 1988 title as a symbol of his longevity anyhow, peak play did not have anything to do with it.

I am still waiting for a response on how Kobe getting a 5th ring will trump Shaq or Duncan. All I have heard so far is that Kobe should be ahead because he has more rings, but in order to do that you would need to not take any context into account, in which case Hondo and Pippen will be ahead of Kobe. If you use context like the Pippen-Kobe example, then it only makes sense that Kobe is behind Duncan and Shaq because they contributed more for their 4 titles. 2006 Shaq and 2007 Duncan > 2000 Kobe. 2000-2002 Shaq and 1999/2003/2005 Duncan > 2001-02/09 Kobe.

[Wile E. Coyote]

Kareem was freaking 41 when he won his last title in 88. Age, Forty, One. If Kobe can still win a title as a 20/5/5 player when that time comes then I'll be impressed. People credit Kareem's 1988 title as a symbol of his longevity anyhow, peak play did not have anything to do with it.

Jabbar and Russell are the only players to win titles 10+ years apart averaging 35 minutes a game. Kobe will join them if he wins it this year. That's not impressive longevity and productivity?

I am still waiting for a response on how Kobe getting a 5th ring will trump Shaq or Duncan. All I have heard so far is that Kobe should be ahead because he has more rings, but in order to do that you would need to not take any context into account, in which case Hondo and Pippen will be ahead of Kobe. If you use context like the Pippen-Kobe example, then it only makes sense that Kobe is behind Duncan and Shaq because they contributed more for their 4 titles. 2006 Shaq and 2007 Duncan > 2000 Kobe. 2000-2002 Shaq and 1999/2003/2005 Duncan > 2001-02/09 Kobe.

I think this potential ring and Kobe's accomplishments this year will vault him over Bird and Shaq, but not Duncan.

[An Unbiased Fan]

I am still waiting for a response on how Kobe getting a 5th ring will trump Shaq or Duncan. All I have heard so far is that Kobe should be ahead because he has more rings, but in order to do that you would need to not take any context into account, in which case Hondo and Pippen will be ahead of Kobe. If you use context like the Pippen-Kobe example, then it only makes sense that Kobe is behind Duncan and Shaq because they contributed more for their 4 titles. 2006 Shaq and 2007 Duncan > 2000 Kobe. 2000-2002 Shaq and 1999/2003/2005 Duncan > 2001-02/09 Kobe.

Kobe was a Top 5 (elite)player in the NBA when he won all of his rings. That would be 2 more than Shaq, and 1 more than TD. Hondo & Pippen weren't Top 5 during most of their title runs.

Kobe is also an 8 time All-NBA/All-D 1st teamer, and would have been part of 2 seperate back2back teams. He would also join Shaq and a couple others as the only players in history with back2back Finals MVPs.

His legacy indivdually & teamwise, would be very rare and only matched by a few.

[NYK 455]

Well, Kobe wasn't top 5 for the 2000 ring, and wasn't unanimously regarded as top 5 for the other 2 either. Although he was certainly in the discussion.

And Shaq/Jordan would be a lot closer to 1A/1B than Shaq/Kobe was

[thegreatblaze]

All I'm gonna say is it's hilarious how two weeks ago Kobe wasn't even a top 10 player in the league anymore, now he's the impending GOAT again.

[bl2k]

All I'm gonna say is it's hilarious how two weeks ago Kobe wasn't even a top 10 player in the league anymore, now he's the impending GOAT again.

only a complete dumb ass would say Kobe wasn't top 10 in the L and nobody is saying he's GOAT either, he's anywhere from 7-9 with a repeat, maybe even pushing 6