2010 Lebron vs 2017 Lebron

[mischievous]

Which Lebron version was better? I still have 2010 comfortably, but I'm curious to what the consensus is.

[Im Your Father]

I agree with you on 2010. But I'll bet the consensus will easily be 2017.

[ppedro123]

2010 LeBron was a freak

But 2017 LeBron has GOAT level IQ/feel for the game

Im undecided

[mischievous]

But 2017 LeBron has GOAT level IQ/feel for the game

I've seen this repeated and i'm still not really sure what that's supposed to mean. I mean Lebron once he hit his prime pretty much always had excellent iq and a "feel for the game." He always knew when to score, when to get others involved or this that or the other thing. I don't feel like he was drastically better now just because he hit absurd scoring levels in these past playoffs. But i don't know, maybe I wasn't watching as close or missing something others were seeing.

[Im Your Father]

2010 LeBron was a freak

But 2017 LeBron has GOAT level IQ/feel for the game

Im undecided

I think an argument can be made for 17 Lebron, and I do think that "IQ/feel for the game type stuff" has to be part of it. On the other hand I feel like frequently terms like that are often the result of post hoc rationalization for why player's teams performed better.

I think late 2010 Lebron (he looked a little slower earlier in the season) was the last time he was consistently able to blow by smaller wings off the dribble. He has added to his game since then, and it's certainly plausible that he's more than made up for lost quickness by adding other aspects to his game (in fact, he's actually managed to gain a fair amount back recently) but I'm still taking athletic peak Lebron over any other version.

[Vayuputra]

Man LBJ's Prime years are so tough to compare. Defensively for sure I think Miami Lebron was a beast, he was still in his athletic prime and he had that hunger and desperation to win especially during those two years 2012-13, and those two factors bring out the best in any man. He was also playing against pretty tough defensive teams in the East, old Celtics, Pacers and OKC / Spurs in the finals during those two years and to my eye his defense actually made quite a big difference for that Miami team.

I think he has definitely regressed defensively since he joined the Cavs (which is probably why he has had to visit Miami a little too often during the season.....I'd leave it at that ). And his amazing offensive numbers I feel are due to him feasting on these average-below average Leastern teams over the past 3 playoffs. Also I don't think any of the Warrior teams over the past 3 finals have truly challenged him with defensive schemes, an elite post defender and an elite perimeter defender with size, like the 2013-14 Spurs did by switching between different schemes and having the Hound i.e. Kawhi Leonard shadow him with Tim Duncan parked in the post.

Of all the teams LBJ has faced in his career, the Spurs (with Duncan- Leonard and Duncan-Bowen before) alongwith Celtics (Garnett-Tony Allen) and the Pacers (Hibbert-PG), with their defensive personnel and discipline have always exposed the one chink in LBJ's armor: deny the drive and thereby minimize what LBJ wants to do more than anything else (be a playmaker) and turn him a jump shooter. There is a reason LBJ's numbers have skyrocketed in the last 3 playoffs. It is not that he has gotten better, it is just that he has faced better defensive teams and personnel before. Yes Warrior fans, Warriors do not have an elite post defender like a Duncan, Garnett or even Hibbert and a perimeter defender with speed and size the likes of Kawhi Leonard or Paul George to make him work. Isn't it strange that this older version of Lebron did whatever he wanted to offensively against your so-called All-world defenders in Green & Durant?

Miami Lebron (2012-14) would be my choice for Peak Lebron.

[NO-KG-AI]

I thought he was very heavy in Miami and it had a negative impact on his greatest quality, his ability to get to the rim almost no matter what. Trying to put Boris Diaw or old Shawn Marion on him in 1 on 1 coverage would be a death wish with either version of Cleveland LeBron.

[GSP]

2010 for me. He didn't control the game offensively the way he does now but he had that Goat level athleticism and 10 Lebron was far better defensively. 17 was prolly Lebrons 3rd worst defensive season behind 14 and 15 since he became a premier defender in the league

[Im Your Father]

I thought he was very heavy in Miami and it had a negative impact on his greatest quality, his ability to get to the rim almost no matter what. Trying to put Boris Diaw or old Shawn Marion on him in 1 on 1 coverage would be a death wish with either version of Cleveland LeBron.

My thoughts exactly.

I also think that for all the talk about Lebron's mental collapse in the 2011 finals, I think the biggest issue was that he couldn't blow by even Peja, and his jump shot wasn't falling to make up for it. 2011 was the slowest he'd ever looked, but fortunately his mid range jumper had been on fire all year up until that point.

[Gibson22]

I think that 2017 is by a decent margin the best lebron ever and the maximum level of basketball ever reached, so..

[Xherdan 23]

2017 for me.
Current LeBron is a better shooter and team defender (which I value very much) while still being an amzing athlete.
2010 LeBron is the better on-ball defender and an alien-like athlete, but he's slightly worse at picking his spots on offense and also not a great post up player.

I believe 2010's athleticism has diminishing returns over '17's, and '17 being a smarter and more complete player.

[1993Playoffs]

17 LeBron clearly better scorer and shooter. 2010 is better on D

[feyki]

2017 Version was much better on the defence as his experience to reading opponent offence and becoming an amazing help defender with that, puts him Kawhi/Pippen tier.

But 2010 Lebron had Westbrook/Jordan type of motor. Lebron has played in the Finals with an offensive level this year, it reminds me of his 2009/2010 production. But his motor was out of this world to he even could play with amazing defence along with that much effort on the offence.

It downs to his peak motor versus his experienced help defence. I'd take the energy.

[MisterHibachi]

2010 for me. He didn't control the game offensively the way he does now but he had that Goat level athleticism and 10 Lebron was far better defensively. 17 was prolly Lebrons 3rd worst defensive season behind 14 and 15 since he became a premier defender in the league

This view is surprising to me. Leading up to the finals, pretty much everyone agreed LeBron was having a better defensive year than 16. He put more effort into the RS, the conference run was better, it's just the finals where 16 was ATG and 17 not so much. But it's not like he wasn't capable of replicating 16, it was just different circumstances. The Warriors were just infinitely harder to guard this year than last, the reasons for which are obvious.

[1993Playoffs]

2009 > 2012 >2017 >2013 >2010> 2016

[ppedro123]

2010 for me. He didn't control the game offensively the way he does now but he had that Goat level athleticism and 10 Lebron was far better defensively. 17 was prolly Lebrons 3rd worst defensive season behind 14 and 15 since he became a premier defender in the league

This view is surprising to me. Leading up to the finals, pretty much everyone agreed LeBron was having a better defensive year than 16. He put more effort into the RS, the conference run was better, it's just the finals where 16 was ATG and 17 not so much. But it's not like he wasn't capable of replicating 16, it was just different circumstances. The Warriors were just infinitely harder to guard this year than last, the reasons for which are obvious.

Agreed. This whole "17 LeBron sucks on defense" is way too overblown.

[mischievous]

2010 for me. He didn't control the game offensively the way he does now but he had that Goat level athleticism and 10 Lebron was far better defensively. 17 was prolly Lebrons 3rd worst defensive season behind 14 and 15 since he became a premier defender in the league

This view is surprising to me. Leading up to the finals, pretty much everyone agreed LeBron was having a better defensive year than 16. He put more effort into the RS, the conference run was better, it's just the finals where 16 was ATG and 17 not so much. But it's not like he wasn't capable of replicating 16, it was just different circumstances. The Warriors were just infinitely harder to guard this year than last, the reasons for which are obvious.

Agreed. This whole "17 LeBron sucks on defense" is way too overblown.

Where did anyone say 2017 Lebron sucks on defense?

[ppedro123]

This view is surprising to me. Leading up to the finals, pretty much everyone agreed LeBron was having a better defensive year than 16. He put more effort into the RS, the conference run was better, it's just the finals where 16 was ATG and 17 not so much. But it's not like he wasn't capable of replicating 16, it was just different circumstances. The Warriors were just infinitely harder to guard this year than last, the reasons for which are obvious.

Agreed. This whole "17 LeBron sucks on defense" is way too overblown.

Where did anyone say 2017 Lebron sucks on defense?

Well, you got the meaning of what i said.

[RCM88x]

I think it's easier to win a title with 2017 LeBron as your best player than 2010. They are too close for me to really differentiate so that's the criteria I'm going to use.

[Heej]

Control of the game, shooting, and help defense help me push 17 Lebron a tiny bit over 10