Luka Doncic ('24 NBA Scoring Leader) & Kyrie Irving - 23-24 NBA Thread

[TroubleS0me]

They didnt make the playoffs last season
The fit between the two is still questionable
How far can they go?

[tsherkin]

They played what, 20 games together? And not even 20 games, given individual games missed? Now they've had an actual training camp and might have a full season together. Should be a little better for evaluating fit.

What Dallas needs, though, is defense. They were trash-garbage last year on that end of the floor, so despite posting the 6th-best O in the league, they floundered. And if they weren't the worst offensive rebounding team in the league, that would also help. But yeah, Luka and Kyrie should produce some pretty good offensive results.

[CobraCommander]

Conf finals if all breaks their way-

Why not- a top 75 player in Kyrie and a young gun in Luka.

If this team was Lebron and Kyrie when Lebron was Luka’s age or even KD- we would expect a lot. If Luka that Guy- why not expect this from him and Kyrie.?

[Pelly24]

Conf finals if all breaks their way-

Why not- a top 75 player in Kyrie and a young gun in Luka.

If this team was Lebron and Kyrie when Lebron was Luka’s age or even KD- we would expect a lot. If Luka that Guy- why not expect this from him and Kyrie.?

Those Cavs teams seem much better constructed than this Maps team TBH. Kevin Love, even though he seemed obsolete in some ways, was a third option that could get 17/10/3 on +1 or + 2 TS% while spacing the floor. Clearly he'd be better than literally everyone else on the current Mavs by a wide margin. The Mavs don't have a legit third option scorer, and I'm not even sure they have a good fourth option scorer unless Josh Green or Hardy take a big leap. Then even with Grant Williams, Idk about their defense. LeBron was an elite defender/gap filler in a way that Luka can never be, and they still had decent wing defenders and size outside of him (that's why in 2015 they could convert to being a great defensive team).

The Mavs need to make more moves, as is I see them winning no more than 44 games.

[CobraCommander]

Conf finals if all breaks their way-

Why not- a top 75 player in Kyrie and a young gun in Luka.

If this team was Lebron and Kyrie when Lebron was Luka’s age or even KD- we would expect a lot. If Luka that Guy- why not expect this from him and Kyrie.?

Those Cavs teams seem much better constructed than this Maps team TBH. Kevin Love, even though he seemed obsolete in some ways, was a third option that could get 17/10/3 on +1 or + 2 TS% while spacing the floor. Clearly he'd be better than literally everyone else on the current Mavs by a wide margin. The Mavs don't have a legit third option scorer, and I'm not even sure they have a good fourth option scorer unless Josh Green or Hardy take a big leap. Then even with Grant Williams, Idk about their defense. LeBron was an elite defender/gap filler in a way that Luka can never be, and they still had decent wing defenders and size outside of him (that's why in 2015 they could convert to being a great defensive team).

The Mavs need to make more moves, as is I see them winning no more than 44 games.

No man- those cavs had Lebron - Lebron made the pieces work. I expect Luka to do the same. Even Kyrie and KD minus Harden or Ben expected to make noise.

This will be year 6.

It’s about time for Luka (and honestly more than Luka- the Mavs)to go from “potential” to “threat”

This is that year- or Luka needs to get out.

I say that because at some point the team is making progress or it isn’t. I see them making big noise this year -

But if they don’t - why waste much more time with the Mavs when you see teams like the Bucks, Suns and Boston improving upon better teams than the Mavs.

The lakers got better this offseason - did the Mavs or are they running it back with better continuity?

[Pelly24]

Conf finals if all breaks their way-

Why not- a top 75 player in Kyrie and a young gun in Luka.

If this team was Lebron and Kyrie when Lebron was Luka’s age or even KD- we would expect a lot. If Luka that Guy- why not expect this from him and Kyrie.?

Those Cavs teams seem much better constructed than this Maps team TBH. Kevin Love, even though he seemed obsolete in some ways, was a third option that could get 17/10/3 on +1 or + 2 TS% while spacing the floor. Clearly he'd be better than literally everyone else on the current Mavs by a wide margin. The Mavs don't have a legit third option scorer, and I'm not even sure they have a good fourth option scorer unless Josh Green or Hardy take a big leap. Then even with Grant Williams, Idk about their defense. LeBron was an elite defender/gap filler in a way that Luka can never be, and they still had decent wing defenders and size outside of him (that's why in 2015 they could convert to being a great defensive team).

The Mavs need to make more moves, as is I see them winning no more than 44 games.

No man- those cavs had Lebron - Lebron made the pieces work. I expect Luka to do the same. Even Kyrie and KD minus Harden or Ben expected to make noise.

This will be year 6.

It’s about time for Luka (and honestly more than Luka- the Mavs)to go from “potential” to “threat”

This is that year- or Luka needs to get out.

I say that because at some point the team is making progress or it isn’t. I see them making big noise this year -

But if they don’t - why waste much more time with the Mavs when you see teams like the Bucks, Suns and Boston improving upon better teams than the Mavs.

The lakers got better this offseason - did the Mavs or are they running it back with better continuity?

We'll see. I think it would've been great if they could've gotten Jrue Holiday. I think they need some physical, above the rim guys.

But if Luka has a career season and Kyrie does what he did last year, they could beat a lot of teams and surprise people. the west is brutal though

[Homer38]

I think it will work on offense but their defense are going always be their issues.Their offensive rebounding was also brutal last season

[eminence]

I'm a little bit with Cobra here. If Luka wants to be an all-timer, this isn't a squad that can miss the playoffs again. I don't think they need to contend for a title or anything with this cast, but it needs to be a playoff team. Luka just hasn't shown as much growth through his first 5 seasons as I'd hoped when he entered the league.

[MyUniBroDavis]

Their offense is unstoppable too bad their defense can’t get stops lol

[CobraCommander]

Those Cavs teams seem much better constructed than this Maps team TBH. Kevin Love, even though he seemed obsolete in some ways, was a third option that could get 17/10/3 on +1 or + 2 TS% while spacing the floor. Clearly he'd be better than literally everyone else on the current Mavs by a wide margin. The Mavs don't have a legit third option scorer, and I'm not even sure they have a good fourth option scorer unless Josh Green or Hardy take a big leap. Then even with Grant Williams, Idk about their defense. LeBron was an elite defender/gap filler in a way that Luka can never be, and they still had decent wing defenders and size outside of him (that's why in 2015 they could convert to being a great defensive team).

The Mavs need to make more moves, as is I see them winning no more than 44 games.

No man- those cavs had Lebron - Lebron made the pieces work. I expect Luka to do the same. Even Kyrie and KD minus Harden or Ben expected to make noise.

This will be year 6.

It’s about time for Luka (and honestly more than Luka- the Mavs)to go from “potential” to “threat”

This is that year- or Luka needs to get out.

I say that because at some point the team is making progress or it isn’t. I see them making big noise this year -

But if they don’t - why waste much more time with the Mavs when you see teams like the Bucks, Suns and Boston improving upon better teams than the Mavs.

The lakers got better this offseason - did the Mavs or are they running it back with better continuity?

We'll see. I think it would've been great if they could've gotten Jrue Holiday. I think they need some physical, above the rim guys.

But if Luka has a career season and Kyrie does what he did last year, they could beat a lot of teams and surprise people. the west is brutal though

When you THAT guy, your conf tough cause YOU there.

It’s year 6 it’s time for Luka to start actually being the best player on earth - with that comes dominating the west -

We say AI and Harden truly dominate but never learn how to lead a team to real wins - I think Luka can be different - let’s go- honestly I lost money on Dallas and Luka last year and F- IT, im betting in Luka again while the odds stacked against him

[MyUniBroDavis]

No man- those cavs had Lebron - Lebron made the pieces work. I expect Luka to do the same. Even Kyrie and KD minus Harden or Ben expected to make noise.

This will be year 6.

It’s about time for Luka (and honestly more than Luka- the Mavs)to go from “potential” to “threat”

This is that year- or Luka needs to get out.

I say that because at some point the team is making progress or it isn’t. I see them making big noise this year -

But if they don’t - why waste much more time with the Mavs when you see teams like the Bucks, Suns and Boston improving upon better teams than the Mavs.

The lakers got better this offseason - did the Mavs or are they running it back with better continuity?

We'll see. I think it would've been great if they could've gotten Jrue Holiday. I think they need some physical, above the rim guys.

But if Luka has a career season and Kyrie does what he did last year, they could beat a lot of teams and surprise people. the west is brutal though

When you THAT guy, your conf tough cause YOU there.

It’s year 6 it’s time for Luka to start actually being the best player on earth - with that comes dominating the west -

We say AI and Harden truly dominate but never learn how to lead a team to real wins - I think Luka can be different - let’s go- honestly I lost money on Dallas and Luka last year and F- IT, im betting in Luka again while the odds stacked against him

They aren’t doing anything with that defense lol

[SNPA]

It’s all about the over under on Kyrie doing Kyrie things. He could have a great year and the Mavs be solid, he could take 3 months off to run as RFK Jr’s VP. We just don’t know. Neither does he.

[Pelly24]

I'll say this — if Luka is truly better than let's say, 2005-2007 LeBron, this Mavs team should win 50 games.

[Texas Chuck]

Luka just hasn't shown as much growth through his first 5 seasons as I'd hoped when he entered the league.

yeah he came into the league way better than I think even us biggest optimists thought he would. Then he took an absolutely massive jump in year 2. The Lebron comparisons were silly, but you could at least understand because he was so good so fast so young. But since? Not a ton of further growth.

He's been a playoff monster, but its time to take better care of the body, its time to stop ref-baiting, its time to start taking defense seriously more regularly, etc.... Kyrie's presence should ease the absurd load allowing for some growth but ultimately its on him. He says the right things, but then nothing really changes.

[itsxtray]

That year 6 age 24 season is When Lebron & Giannis became legit Mvp caliber players from an impact perspective. Hopefully Luka follows suit even if he doesn't win the award. He either needs to get more efficient on offense. (3's, ftrs,) cut the turnovers even more, or become a much better defender. Preferably all of them.

[Special_Puppy]

I imagine they are roughly the 6th seed this year. Kyrie is becoming kinda underrated because of all the off the court drama but it’s a legit top 20 player in the league when he plays

[Special_Puppy]

That year 6 age 24 season is When Lebron & Giannis became legit Mvp caliber players from an impact perspective. Hopefully Luka follows suit even if he doesn't win the award. He either needs to get more efficient on offense. (3's, ftrs,) cut the turnovers even more, or become a much better defender. Preferably all of them.

I think it’s going to be really hard for Luka to reach “best player in the world” status if he doesn’t improve his defense. He’d literally need to be by far the best offensive player of all time to compensate for his subpar defense

[tsherkin]

That year 6 age 24 season is When Lebron & Giannis became legit Mvp caliber players from an impact perspective. Hopefully Luka follows suit even if he doesn't win the award. He either needs to get more efficient on offense. (3's, ftrs,) cut the turnovers even more, or become a much better defender. Preferably all of them.

I think it’s going to be really hard for Luka to reach “best player in the world” status if he doesn’t improve his defense. He’d literally need to be by far the best offensive player of all time to compensate for his subpar defense

I don't think he needs to be a much better defender, just a better scorer. He's "only" a 105 TS+ guy (and that's his peak to date) as of 2023, and that's not really enough to put the highest-end offensive pressure on a D in this era.

[itsxtray]

That year 6 age 24 season is When Lebron & Giannis became legit Mvp caliber players from an impact perspective. Hopefully Luka follows suit even if he doesn't win the award. He either needs to get more efficient on offense. (3's, ftrs,) cut the turnovers even more, or become a much better defender. Preferably all of them.

I think it’s going to be really hard for Luka to reach “best player in the world” status if he doesn’t improve his defense. He’d literally need to be by far the best offensive player of all time to compensate for his subpar defense

Best player in the world probably but not mvp caliber impact wise, he could be a slight negative or neutral and reach that mark

[TroubleS0me]

1st win of the season vs Victor