Note: My availability will be limited for the next week, so in addition to handing of thread running to other mods, I'm basically expecting to repeat my vote for a bit.
Induction Vote 1: Cliff Hagan
Induction Vote 2: Bill SharmanSo in the current Nominee pool, I see 3 legends, a talent whose ego damaged his prime significantly, and a player I love but I can't really separate from a lot of other guys.
I'll take the two legends with decent longevity. Between Hagan & Sharman, here's the thing that's had me leaning Hagan:
I see Hagan as a guy who, in practice, was more of a self-creator, and was exceptionally good at it. The fact that he was doing this on offense-dependent teams, with greater volume, and even more known for this in the playoffs, all while being 3 inches taller, makes me just see Hagan as a more capable star than Sharman.
It's possible that I'm flat out wrong in my assessment of what happened, and and possible that Sharman was capable of doing more along these lines but wasn't given the opportunity next to Cousy. It's possible I'm mistaken on neither, but Sharman's defense was enough better that that should be the determining factor, but at this point I'm not convinced it should be.
Nomination 1: Jayson TatumSo, I expect I'll be quoting DSMok's post until Tatum gets voted in, and as much as I want to credit him, I don't want to push notifications to him every dang thread. Hence, the quote below will be nameless.
[quote=]
Code: Select all
3 Year Stints within the 1997-2023 era above points/100 possession thresholds
5000 Min. Minimum >8 >7 >6 >5 >3 >1
Al Horford 0 0 0 0 3 13
Andre Iguodala 0 0 1 2 5 15
Andre Miller 0 0 0 0 1 11
Andrei Kirilenko 0 1 2 3 6 8
Baron Davis 0 0 0 4 7 10
Carmelo Anthony 0 0 0 0 3 11
Chris Bosh 0 0 1 2 7 11
Deron Williams 0 0 0 0 1 9
Elton Brand 0 0 0 1 4 7
Jayson Tatum 1 2 2 4 5 5
Jrue Holiday 0 0 1 3 8 11
Klay Thompson 0 0 0 1 4 7
Lamar Odom 0 0 0 0 4 10
Lamarcus Aldridge 0 0 0 2 11 13
Luka Doncic 0 0 0 0 3 3
Luol Deng 0 0 0 0 5 11
Marc Gasol 0 0 0 0 6 10
Metta World Peace 0 1 1 5 7 10
Paul Milsap 0 0 0 1 12 13
Peja Stojakovic 0 0 0 0 2 10
Rashard Lewis 0 0 0 1 5 10
Shawn Marion 0 0 0 0 4 8
Tony Parker 0 0 0 1 5 11
Vlade Divac 0 0 0 0 5 7
Yao Ming 0 0 0 1 6 6By point of comparison---LeBron has 13 stints above +8, and Duncan has 10.[/quote]
Sure looks to me like Tatum is head and shoulders above the rest of the guys here. Look, folks who have been consistent about weighing longevity heavily have a perfectly reason to keep voting some other guys in above Tatum, but I would challenge the idea that Tatum's "just not that good".
It's not that I don't think better guys exist than Tatum right now, but Tatum's an only-not-MVP-because-others-better guy to me, not someone who'd stick out as the worst MVP if he ended up taking home one of those trophies. And the man's been incredibly consistent in his impact almost from the jump. That really adds up quick for me. I tend to see the run of a standard core to be something like a 5 year thing, and but the Celtics were deep playoff teams right from the jump in Tatum's career 6 (well closer to 7 now I suppose) years ago and while he was a smaller part then, he was still utterly essential.
Nomination 2: Bob DaviesI'll take the opportunity to give Davies love without threat of yanking my support away for a while. For me, I'm sold on him relative to the competition still in play. I think he was the leader and MVP of the first offensive dynasty in NBA history, and the result was a couple of chips in an epoch where all the others went to Mikan. And I think he showed better judgment about his own shot as he aged than Cousy did. I really think Cousy was convinced his schtick was working considerably better than it was because of the defense-driven team success.
