winforlose wrote:King Ken wrote:winforlose wrote:
I am sorry but while agree that KAT by himself isn’t worth Trae, Trae isn’t close to worth Ant. As for KAT for Murray, you would need to throw in JJ and we still probably wouldn’t be there. I have had this discussion with your board before, and I have no desire to rehash. I was just looking around active seller boards and I saw someone suggest Jaden for Murray. I get why you value Murray, but Jaden is a legit all defense player with untapped offensive upside that is finally starting to peek out. His value to us is too high to straight swap for Murray.
You meant AJ right? JJ is more valuable to us than KAT so no. Not a chance in hell. You must think KAT is Giannis. KAT is on a supermax going into his 30s. Be honest bro. He's not a top 15 guy. He's a top 50 guy like Murray and like Gobert. Ant is your top 15 guy. Trae is our top 25 guy.
What are you willing to do as far as Ant? I am willing to trade Trae and extra for Ant
We don't want Jaden like that bro. If you want a top 50 player for him, please search elsewhere. Maybe someone will be interested. I really like Jaden too, I am higher on him than most but for Murray, I want more offensive value. He's too defensive.
Bro you are asking for 20/5/5 on 58% TS who's a former all defensive player.
Put simply KAT is a 52/44/87 guy who could easily drop 30 a night (he shoots less so Ant and Jaden can develop,) and who is defending in space at a high level. You know his defense is working because we aren’t just the best defense in the west, we are the best defense in the NBA, and #2 isn’t even close. Karl is a 2 time all NBA, 4 time All star, and having a career year at PF, while playing real and successful minutes at SF (yeah you heard that right, Karl plays winning minutes at SF with Naz at PF and Rudy at C.) If that isn’t worth JJ than you obviously don’t want to deal with the Wolves. Ant is not on the market and Trae isn’t close to Ant’s value. Jaden is going to be All defense and is averaging 51.7/37/77 and 10.9 points as a 4th or 5th option. His attacking off the dribble is getting dangerous and his corner 3s are consistently around 40+ percent across multiple seasons. I don’t think you know enough about the Wolves to evaluate our talent.
The Hawks are not successful with DJM and TY. DJM needs the ball in hands and so does TY. You can try and say that DJM is still the same guy as he was in San Antonio, but his defense has regressed, and his numbers are down from then. 21.5/5/5 is impressive, but he is doing it on the #11 team in the east. I think end of the day you guys will rebuild and that is fine. But don’t try to convince me that elite players on an elite team are worth less than they are.
There are about ten reasons the Hawks aren't currently successful before we address the Trae/Murray fit. They aren't our problem. Could we find a better fit, potentially but they aren't our problem.
There is the reality and there is the potential. KAT if in a more offensive role can score 30 but he's not in that role currently because of Ant in primary scorer and that won't change. Same like Murray being our 2. That said, Murray will be in his best position in Minnesota around the largest backcourt in the NBA instead of the smallest. So that statement for KAT works for Murray as well.
Gobert is the reason for your defensive success. Everything runs around him. It helps you have Jaden, Conley, Ant, all surrounding KAT.
I really could care less about your team success. Your roster is what, 230 million based on production. That's a significant reason why we are not successful but the LT and 2nd apron will fix that against you guys. You have a stacked roster. Depth, a legit starting five, no one is in a steep decline. Your peeking at the right time but this ain't affordable. This is an one year trial. GS in the new system can't afford this and that's the most loaded franchise in the NBA by a mile. The Hawks have depth issues. 9-15 is the least amount of production in the NBA by a significant margin. That's the reason we aren't successful.
Mike Conley is by the data your most significant player and when I watch, he's not but you don't have an alternative at PG. Add Murray, that's a significant upgrade. It's a role he's best in as well and Murray is on a terrific contract. Murray has one of the best contracts in the NBA moving forward. That's a fact.
It's cool to be a fan boy but don't disrespect our fanbase in the process. We watch every Hawks game. We know this team well. We know what we have and don't have. We know what our players are capable of. We know this.
You don't know our team yet you have really strong and really wrong opinions. It's one thing if you are the media where you could give a damn about the Hawks but you aren't. You are a fan who came into our domain.
If you don't want to trade Ant for Trae. That's fine, I wouldn't either. Ant has top 5-10 potential. The KAT **** is fanboy ****. He's role is similar to Murray but on a stacked squad. Our squad ain't stacked. It lacks depth and one of our best impacts is regressing and is no longer giving us the value he once did at center and OO is not a great fit in Quin scheme as he was in Nate's scheme. Our frontcourt lost JC and we replaced him with nothing. Hunter is critical and he's been hurt till recently. JJ was hurt and that hurt us as well. We don't have the depth to deal with injuries and we don't have the center for Quin scheme to be what he wants it to be.
We aren't built to win. You guys are but it's a 230 million dollar squad. Ours is more like 150 million based on production. All of these teams will feel it at some point outside of NY who somehow got great contracts till this summer. OKC will go through it soon. Everyone will. You can't stack rosters up anymore.
