The Trae Young Dilemma

Analysis: With Trae Young, the numbers are rarely in question

The numbers that Atlanta guard Trae Young are putting up are notable, averaging 28.1 points and 11.3 assists per game so far this season. Keep that up for an entire season, and he’ll do something that only Oscar Robertson, Tiny Archibald and James Harden have accomplished.

Stats like those typically get a player at least mentioned in an MVP conversation.

With Young, it's not even be a guarantee that he’ll be in the All-Star conversation.

The Hawks opened their post-Christmas schedule at Chicago on Tuesday night, when Young was trying to do something that nobody has ever pulled off in NBA history. He had at least 30 points and 10 assists in each of his last seven games, tying Robertson’s league-record stretch done in the 1964-65 season.

He had to settle for tying Robertson’s record of 30-10 point-assist games: Young had 21 points and 13 assists in Atlanta’s 118-113 loss at Chicago on Tuesday. But maybe the way Young didn’t want to talk about tying the mark is a sign of maturity from someone who has a confident swagger that can be perceived as arrogance.

...his numbers get looked at as empty calories. Young’s stretch of 30-point, 10-assist games seemed barely noticed. And it should be noted, the banged-up Hawks went 3-4 in those seven games with Young on this 30-10 tear. Great numbers, not great results.

Young averaged 26.7 points and 10.3 assists before the All-Star break last season — and didn’t make the All-Star Game. In the formula used to determine the starters, Young finished fifth among Eastern Conference guards in the fan voting, sixth in the media voting and, maybe most damning, 12th in voting among fellow players. There were 375 players who returned All-Star ballots last season (player voting counts as 25% of the formula) and 13 (3.5%) of them listed Young as someone who should start.

Young made it clear that he wasn’t happy about not being picked for the team that USA Basketball sent to the World Cup in Manila earlier this year. That, combined with no All-Star nod and not making the All-NBA team last season, seems to have made Young even more defiant. Maybe he has been disrespected. Maybe he hasn’t merited more respect yet.

His numbers are elite, but for the Hawks — and for Young — to reach their full potential, those numbers need to add up to something bigger than stats.

Associated Press

Post #69 » by **Jamaaliver** » Thu Dec 28, 2023 5:50 pm

NBA Star Power Index

Trae Young ties Oscar Robertson in history books

Trae Young

ATL • PG • #11

Young joined Oscar Robertson as the only player in history to record seven straight games with at least 30 points and 10 assists. Even in the most statistically inflated time in NBA history, those numbers are not to be taken lightly.

Young had a chance to break Robertson's record but finished with a ho-hum 21 and 13 in a loss to the Bulls on Tuesday.

And therein lies the rub of Young's offensive boom, which has more or less been happening his entire career: Save for a bracket-friendly 2021 playoff run, it doesn't lead to winning. The Hawks have dropped eight of their last 11. Considering what is a legitimately talented roster, the Hawks are rocking an almost embarrassing 12-18 mark for the season. If the postseason started today, they wouldn't even be in the play-in.

This is not all Young's fault. But he's at the core of Atlanta's biggest issue: defense. Particularly, perimeter containment. You can think the Hawks' point-of-attack defense should be at least OK with Dejounte Murray in the fold, but you'd be wrong. For starters, he gets beat more than you'd think, but beyond that, Young is a turnstile, as is Bogdan Bogdanovic, and Garrison Mathews, and pretty much on down the line.

Even if Atlanta had Rudy Gobert as a rim protector, that kind of consistent perimeter puncturing is almost impossible to overcome. Schematically, the Hawks prioritize running teams off the 3-point line as often as possible -- which is a difficult strategy to employ when you're asking half-hearted defenders like Young to make multiple efforts after closing out hard -- is over 38% of the shots they defend coming at the rim, the third highest frequency in the league via Dunks and Threes.

All told, Atlanta sports the third-worst schedule-adjusted defense in the league. Young is the single biggest culprit. There's no denying his offensive brilliance, but given his size and general defensive apathy once the action moves beyond his initial responsibility, whether on or off ball, the Hawks, taking their lead from their best player, are playing uphill every night.

CBS Sports

Post #70 » by **Jamaaliver** » Thu Jan 4, 2024 2:27 pm

Hawks acquiring Dejounte and playing Trae off ball was supposed to fix this issue.

But Trae doesn't move without the ball! :banghead:

jayu70 wrote:

Read on Twitter

....still haven't solved the Trae trap with the rest of the team making plays.

Post #71 » by **Jamaaliver** » Thu Jan 4, 2024 4:03 pm

A pretty candid response:

Read on Twitter

jayu70 · Post #72 » by **jayu70** » Thu Jan 4, 2024 5:33 pm

Jamaaliver wrote:Hawks acquiring Dejounte and playing Trae off ball was supposed to fix this issue.

But Trae doesn't move without the ball!

....still haven't solved the Trae trap with the rest of the team making plays.

Yeah, about that - I think the most simplest explanation is: Quin might be seeing that DJ isn't the playmaker that Trae is. In the non-Trae minutes, he hasn't kept pace offensively in running the team as effectively.
There is nuance to having Trae play true offball, he's no Steph, so that's not it. Are we playing offball for real CnS opportunities, asking him to cut more to the basket? The biggest question is, who's gonna get him the ball in those scenarios?

jayu70 · Post #73 » by **jayu70** » Fri Jan 5, 2024 9:24 pm

He's trying to do his part on defense while still carrying the offensive load. He'll never be considered a great defender but effort, focus, anticipation, buy in and just being a pest is a good place to start.

Read on Twitter

?s=20

Read on Twitter

?s=20

Post #74 » by **HMFFL** » Sat Jan 6, 2024 7:54 pm

3/20 in his last two games from 3.
I hope he breaks out of his slump soon, but in the meantime, he needs to stop shooting us out of games, and more players need to STEPUP.

Sent from my SM-N975U using RealGM mobile app

Post #75 » by **Jamaaliver** » Sun Jan 7, 2024 12:23 am

HMFFL wrote:3/20 in his last two games from 3.

I hope he breaks out of his slump soon, but in the meantime, he needs to stop shooting us out of games, and more players need to STEPUP.

Yeah, those 35 foot pull ups with no rebounder under the rim are still pretty terrible shots.

In the clip below...Jalen is wide open on the perimeter with space to shoot or drive to the hoop.

Trae never looks at him.

Read on Twitter

Post #76 » by **Jamaaliver** » Wed Jan 10, 2024 3:41 am

Read on Twitter

Haliburton and Young are first and second in the league in assists per game. Haliburton is averaging 24.2 points, 12.7 assists, 4.3 rebounds and 1.2 steals per game. Young is averaging 27.8 points, 11.0 assists, 3.1 rebounds and 1.5 steals. Haliburton's shooting percentages are meaningfully better but Young gets to the line at such a high rate that it closes a lot of the gap in their true shooting percentages. Haliburton is a much better defender but that alone doesn't account for the different outcomes their production has created for their teams.

The Pacers, with Haliburton at the helm, are 20-15 and just a half-game out of the No. 4 seed in the Eastern Conference. They're leading the league in offensive efficiency, riding a tide of positive vibes, shopping for stars at the trade deadline and already fantasizing about the free agents they might be able to lure this summer.

The Hawks, meanwhile, are 14-21... They have arguably more talent and depth than the Pacers but are reportedly considering selling off parts at the trade deadline and deciding between a full-scale rebuild or trying to reload on the fly.

Both teams have a star point guard in the center of everything, one who, on paper, looks incredibly generous in setting up their teammates and creating easy scoring chances for everyone around them. But the way they do that is very different.

While Haliburton and Young register a similar number of assists, they come on a very different volume of passes. Young averages about two more minutes per game than Haliburton, but about 15 fewer passes — 57.2 to 72.3. If you compare that to their total touches we find that about 76 percent of Haliburton's touches end with a pass; for Young, that number is just 64 percent.

That may not seem like a huge difference and there is an argument that there is value in Young turning a higher percentage of his passes into assists. But the other side of that coin is Haliburton giving up the ball more freely even in non-assist situations, offering his teammates the opportunity to attack and create chances on their own. Whereas Young's teammates are more likely to only get a pass if it's an obvious scoring chance.

What that means is that Young's teammates spend a lot more time watching him with the ball in his hands. Haliburton is more likely to pass, move, get the ball back, pass and move again. Even though their possession stats are similar, Haliburton doesn't dominate the ball in the same way as Young.

Post #77 » by **Jamaaliver** » Sat Jan 13, 2024 2:46 pm

Do with this whatever you will...

Read on Twitter

jayu70 · Post #78 » by **jayu70** » Wed Jan 17, 2024 3:27 pm

Check out this NBA content!

https://www.nba.com/watch/video/nba-on-tnt-trae-young-stops-by-studio-talks-hoops-and-more

Post #79 » by **Jamaaliver** » Wed Jan 17, 2024 3:57 pm

Read on Twitter

Post #80 » by **HMFFL** » Thu Jan 18, 2024 1:48 am

Trae Young is the fastest player to 10k points, 1k three pointers, and 3.5k assist.

Sent from my SM-N975U using RealGM mobile app