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2024 NBA Draft Thread

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Re: 2024 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1161 » by Hal14 » Mon May 13, 2024 3:32 pm

Kalela wrote:
165bows wrote:Was on a Pelle Larson kick at one point earlier in the year. Can’t remember if I made this comparison then but he’s sort of a Malcolm Brogdon-y sort of player, without the weird vibe afaik.

Spoiler:
Watching the playoffs over the past several years, it’s become increasingly evident that teams are working diligently to key on the discernable weaknesses of their opponents. Non-shooters get ignored. Shooters who can’t dribble and/or finish get run off the line. Smaller players get bullied. Lumbering bigs are forced to guard in space. A well-rounded skill set has never been more important.

Given that, it’s hard not to reconsider the stock of Arizona’s Pelle Larsson. The senior wing out of Arizona has always done a little bit of everything. Watching the tape, he finds a variety of ways to keep defenses off balance. He’s effective in important areas on the court and he makes good decisions. Defensively, his strength and feel help keep him above board. However, the subtle nature of his game often understates the productive funk that he brings to the table. Today, we’re going to give Pelle Larsson some NBA Draft love, because there’s a real chance that his wide-ranging skill set allows him to climb during the pre-draft process.

Keeping Them Honest

One of the easiest ways for a wing to stay on the floor offensively is to space the floor, and Pelle Larsson can do that. He made 42.6% of his threes this past season and 39.7% of his threes over the course of his four-year college career. His right-handed stroke looks repeatable time after time. He’s also shown a bit of variety as far as how he can get into his shot. He knows how to relocate into defensive holes, he can move into his shot off screens or in transition, and he’s comfortable pulling up when given space (44.0% on 25 off-the-dribble threes this past season). His mechanics, consistency, and productivity allow him to draw hard closeouts.

My one gripe with Larsson here is that I wish he were a bit more assertive with his shot. He only took 5.4 threes per 100 possessions this season, and I can’t think of a better shooter who took that few. He can be a little too passive and a little too slow going into his motion, and he’ll want to clean that up during the pre-draft process. Still, opponents respect Larsson because they know he’s a knockdown guy when he pulls the trigger. It’s also tough to blame Larsson for wanting to go inside, because he’s one heck of a downhill player, too.

Making Them Pay

If opponents aren’t careful when they close out on Pelle Larsson, he will make them pay. One tool at his disposal is his excellent pump fake. He’s able to bring it really high and get opponents to bite on it before starting his attack. From there, Larsson’s first step does him a lot of favors. While he’s not the twitchiest athlete in many respects, he’s actually very good at exploding out of a complete standstill into his drive. Once he gets going, his strength makes it difficult to knock off his line. At the rim, Larsson can show some bounce off one foot or convert using his touch. In particular, he has a unique gift when it comes to arcing the ball over the top of big rim protectors near the cup. Even better, contact doesn’t bother him one bit. He remains coordinated even when someone bumps into him in mid-air.

Larsson’s jolty stop-start first step, power, and touch enable him to put a lot of pressure on the rim relative to his position. This year, 36.6% of his halfcourt shots came at the basket, and he made an impressive 57% of them. My one knit to pick is that I wish he was more willing to go to his left hand at the cup. Even still, he’s effective. While he’s sometimes mistakenly classified as a shooter, Larsson is a real deal rim pressure guy. Arizona’s coaching staff recognized this, often utilizing him as a screener who they would short-roll. Better yet, Larsson is an excellent passer on his way to the rim.

Pelle Larsson’s head is always up. He knows how to take his time, play methodically, and find openings when operating out of a ball screen. He recognizes his own gravity as a driver and will spray it out to open shooters if a perimeter defender abandons their assignment. Going downhill, he does a great job of reading the last level of the defense. When the rim protector comes out too far, Larsson is always ready to dump it to his big man in the dunker spot. If his big man gets behind their defender as a roller, he’ll throw him an accurate lob. His pass placement is typically on point. When he’s spotting up, he’ll routinely make sharp extra passes. My favorite element of his distribution, though, is that he does a tremendous job of looking off his dishes. That extra layer of trickery further misshapes defenses and makes the rotations even more difficult. Larsson ended the year with a 20.1 AST% while averaging 3.7 APG to only 1.9 TOV.

In totality, Larsson has an incredibly intriguing offensive profile. Playoff performers need to be able to dribble, pass, and shoot. Larsson can do all of that. I ran a BartTorvik on wing-sized players from high-major conferences who scored, shot threes, and distributed the ball at a level similar to Larsson over the past 10 years. The results were rather encouraging.

Showing No Weakness

Larsson’s well-rounded productivity insulates him on the offensive end. Still, come playoff time, NBA teams are looking to sniff out any weakness possible. I have some concerns with Larsson on the defensive end of the floor. That said, I wouldn’t throw in the towel. Larsson has some great moments on that end of the floor, and much of it has to do with his physical strength and how well he can leverage it.

Larsson’s truly a stout defender. He plays with a level of discipline that prevents him from biting on misdirection and he does a great job of taking away the angles a player is seeking to attack. He loves to throw his chest on his opponent, and when he does, they have a hard time shaking him loose. His ability to stay vertical shows up when he helps around the basket. Smaller players like Mark Sears can find themselves swallowed up by his smothering technique and bigger dudes like Grant Nelson can still struggle to get to their spots against him. While his career 1.7 STL% and 1.1 BLK% may not fly off the page, Larsson knows what he’s doing out there. Add in his physicality and strength, and he’s able to hold his own.

He’s not without his limitations here. His feet aren’t the quickest and he has a hard time recovering when he does get shaken. Too often, he’ll be flat-footed when guarding the ball. Those are technical elements of his defensive game that will need to be fine-tuned at the next level. He’ll need to improve his lateral agility and balance. But with that being said, Larsson’s tenacity and smashmouth tactics should keep him in the game. Per Hoop-Explorer, Arizona’s defensive net rating against Top 100 teams was better when Larsson was on the floor, and his DBPM of 3.3 is no joke. He’s proven to be a capable part of a defensive system.


https://www.noceilingsnba.com/p/the-understated-funk-of-pelle-larsson


The way they described him here, you would think he is the ultimate role player or maybe even more and would fit in perfectly with any playoff team.

No Ceilings often over-hypes guys..often will talk extensively about a player's positive attributes but talk very little (or downplay) their drawbacks.

Larsson is good..and I wouldn't hate it if we drafted him (or signed him as UDFA..he went undrafted in a couple of community mocks I participated in recently).

Really the only drawbacks with Larsson are that he's an older prospect and had low usage in college.

I talk about why (for the most part) guys who had higher usage % prior to being drafted end up being better NBA role players than super low usage guys (like under 20%) here:
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Also, Larsson has good but not great size for a wing.
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Re: 2024 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1162 » by Smart2Nesmith43 » Tue May 14, 2024 2:03 am

Earlier in the thread I highlighted likely targets for the Celtics based on Stevens draft record. Some of them had their measurements taken today at the combine.

Name / Height / Weight / Wingspan / Standing Reach
Tyler Smith / 6-8.75 / 223.8 / 7-1 / 8-9
Carlton Carrington / 6-3.75 / 194.8 / 6-8 / 8-3
Izan Almansa / 6-9.25 / 219.6 / 7-1 / 9-2

All aboard the Almansa train.
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Re: 2024 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1163 » by NuckyPowell » Tue May 14, 2024 7:06 am

I really like Dunn, but it's a near lock he'll be gone before we pick. Seems perfect for Thibs.
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Re: 2024 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1164 » by Kalela » Tue May 14, 2024 7:30 am

Shannon is much taller than I expected even though his wingspan is average. He may drop because of his age (turns 24 in July) but he is a fighter. He plays hard in every game and he is an athletic freak.
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Re: 2024 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1165 » by hugepatsfan » Tue May 14, 2024 12:02 pm

If the front office has any Celtics pride in their bodies they’ll draft Bronny and then just stash him in the GLeague and never let Lebron play with his son
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Re: 2024 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1166 » by BK_2020 » Tue May 14, 2024 12:11 pm

hugepatsfan wrote:If the front office has any Celtics pride in their bodies they’ll draft Bronny and then just stash him in the GLeague and never let Lebron play with his son

What do we do if Lebron calls the bluff and join the Maine Lobsceltics.
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Re: 2024 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1167 » by hugepatsfan » Tue May 14, 2024 12:22 pm

BK_2020 wrote:
hugepatsfan wrote:If the front office has any Celtics pride in their bodies they’ll draft Bronny and then just stash him in the GLeague and never let Lebron play with his son

What do we do if Lebron calls the bluff and join the Maine Lobsceltics.


That’s why we bought the gleague team… so we can tell
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Re: 2024 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1168 » by Dogen » Tue May 14, 2024 2:51 pm

Smart2Nesmith43 wrote:Earlier in the thread I highlighted likely targets for the Celtics based on Stevens draft record. Some of them had their measurements taken today at the combine.

Name / Height / Weight / Wingspan / Standing Reach
Tyler Smith / 6-8.75 / 223.8 / 7-1 / 8-9
Carlton Carrington / 6-3.75 / 194.8 / 6-8 / 8-3
Izan Almansa / 6-9.25 / 219.6 / 7-1 / 9-2

All aboard the Almansa train.


Celtics could use an athletic big to develop alongside Walsh. A Naz Reid, Jaylin Williams type. Almansa seems to have slipped a bit. Maybe he's available at 54?
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Re: 2024 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1169 » by playa-hater » Tue May 14, 2024 3:45 pm

Dogen wrote:
Smart2Nesmith43 wrote:Earlier in the thread I highlighted likely targets for the Celtics based on Stevens draft record. Some of them had their measurements taken today at the combine.

Name / Height / Weight / Wingspan / Standing Reach
Tyler Smith / 6-8.75 / 223.8 / 7-1 / 8-9
Carlton Carrington / 6-3.75 / 194.8 / 6-8 / 8-3
Izan Almansa / 6-9.25 / 219.6 / 7-1 / 9-2

All aboard the Almansa train.


Celtics could use an athletic big to develop alongside Walsh. A Naz Reid, Jaylin Williams type. Almansa seems to have slipped a bit. Maybe he's available at 54?


Seems like this had been said for years.
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Re: 2024 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1170 » by brackdan70 » Tue May 14, 2024 3:49 pm

playa-hater wrote:
Dogen wrote:
Smart2Nesmith43 wrote:Earlier in the thread I highlighted likely targets for the Celtics based on Stevens draft record. Some of them had their measurements taken today at the combine.

Name / Height / Weight / Wingspan / Standing Reach
Tyler Smith / 6-8.75 / 223.8 / 7-1 / 8-9
Carlton Carrington / 6-3.75 / 194.8 / 6-8 / 8-3
Izan Almansa / 6-9.25 / 219.6 / 7-1 / 9-2

All aboard the Almansa train.


Celtics could use an athletic big to develop alongside Walsh. A Naz Reid, Jaylin Williams type. Almansa seems to have slipped a bit. Maybe he's available at 54?


Seems like this had been said for years.

You can never have enough undeveloped athletic bigs IMO.
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Re: 2024 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1171 » by Dogen » Tue May 14, 2024 4:00 pm

brackdan70 wrote:
playa-hater wrote:
Dogen wrote:
Celtics could use an athletic big to develop alongside Walsh. A Naz Reid, Jaylin Williams type. Almansa seems to have slipped a bit. Maybe he's available at 54?


Seems like this had been said for years.

You can never have enough undeveloped athletic bigs IMO.


Finding a "developed" big at 54 is a tall order though. If Brad stays in the draft at all, maybe an upperclassman 23 year old is in the cards if Brad thinks he can land a guy who can hit the floor running, as it were. Walsh looks like he could use another year, um, developing.

If the team is interested in stocking the Maine 2-Way pipeline with Walsh/Queta/Davison replacements, I'm more interested in a guy like Chomche. For some reason, the Celtics pass every year. Maybe it's too risky to take the boom or bust bigs in the draft when yu can buy low on some of them in a few years. But when a guy like Reid starts putting it together, they are no longer available.
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Re: 2024 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1172 » by Hal14 » Tue May 14, 2024 4:19 pm

Kalela wrote:Shannon is much taller than I expected even though his wingspan is average. He may drop because of his age (turns 24 in July) but he is a fighter. He plays hard in every game and he is an athletic freak.
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He also has to go to trial for a rape charge:

https://southernillinoisnow.com/2024/05/11/illinois-basketball-star-terrence-shannon-jr-ordered-to-stand-trial-on-a-rape-charge-in-kansas/
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Re: 2024 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1173 » by Dogen » Tue May 14, 2024 4:23 pm

Speaking of drafting bigs, it occurs to me that the last time the Celtics drafted a big I was really high on, it was Robert Williams in 2018.

Before that? Big Al Jefferson in 2004!
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Re: 2024 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1174 » by Dogen » Tue May 14, 2024 4:45 pm

Hal14 wrote:
Kalela wrote:Shannon is much taller than I expected even though his wingspan is average. He may drop because of his age (turns 24 in July) but he is a fighter. He plays hard in every game and he is an athletic freak.
Read on Twitter


He also has to go to trial for a rape charge:

https://southernillinoisnow.com/2024/05/11/illinois-basketball-star-terrence-shannon-jr-ordered-to-stand-trial-on-a-rape-charge-in-kansas/


Still unlikely to slip past the top half of the draft. HEaT CuLtUre, anyone?
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Re: 2024 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1175 » by Kalela » Tue May 14, 2024 4:45 pm



I was reading about that few days and it completely skipped my mind somehow. Yeah, no team is touching him anytime soon. I remember how fast the Celtics cut Jabari Bird. Ime case too even though what he did was not technically illegal.

Dogen wrote:Speaking of drafting bigs, it occurs to me that the last time the Celtics drafted a big I was really high on, it was Robert Williams in 2018.

Before that? Big Al Jefferson in 2004!


Ainge liked those semi-skilled small ball fives or power forwards. Yabusele, Grant Williams, Big Baby, Sullinger. He also traded for Brandon Bass. Anyway, if I was Brad Stevens, I would trade up for Kel'el Ware if it is possible. I think he would thrive here in Boston with this crew.
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Re: 2024 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1176 » by BK_2020 » Tue May 14, 2024 5:00 pm

Kalela wrote:


I was reading about that few days and it completely skipped my mind somehow. Yeah, no team is touching him anytime soon. I remember how fast the Celtics cut Jabari Bird. Ime case too even though what he did was not technically illegal.

Dogen wrote:Speaking of drafting bigs, it occurs to me that the last time the Celtics drafted a big I was really high on, it was Robert Williams in 2018.

Before that? Big Al Jefferson in 2004!


Ainge liked those semi-skilled small ball fives or power forwards. Yabusele, Grant Williams, Big Baby, Sullinger. He also traded for Brandon Bass. Anyway, if I was Brad Stevens, I would trade up for Kel'el Ware if it is possible. I think he would thrive here in Boston with this crew.

We don't know the full story but what Ime did could easily be violation of Title 7 which is definitely illegal, just not criminally illegal.
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Re: 2024 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1177 » by Dogen » Tue May 14, 2024 5:01 pm

Kalela wrote:


I was reading about that few days and it completely skipped my mind somehow. Yeah, no team is touching him anytime soon. I remember how fast the Celtics cut Jabari Bird. Ime case too even though what he did was not technically illegal.

Dogen wrote:Speaking of drafting bigs, it occurs to me that the last time the Celtics drafted a big I was really high on, it was Robert Williams in 2018.

Before that? Big Al Jefferson in 2004!


Ainge liked those semi-skilled small ball fives or power forwards. Yabusele, Grant Williams, Big Baby, Sullinger. He also traded for Brandon Bass. Anyway, if I was Brad Stevens, I would trade up for Kel'el Ware if it is possible. I think he would thrive here in Boston with this crew.


Ainge and his small ball PF/C's. Good times! :lol:

If Brad moves up in the first round, I think that is a first for him? Not sure. Anyway, if he trades up for Kel'el Ware, that would be very interesting. Essentially putting Ware as the proverbial Horford replacement.
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Re: 2024 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1178 » by threrf23 » Tue May 14, 2024 5:06 pm

Kalela wrote: I remember how fast the Celtics cut Jabari Bird. Ime case too even though what he did was not technically illegal.


Technically, Cs never cut Jabari Bird.

Also, what Jabari Bird did makes Miles Bridges look like a good guy by comparison.

Anyways Terrence Shannon is nearly 24 years old, not a stud prospect to begin with, and nbadraft.net has him going lottery. No need to investigate.
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Re: 2024 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1179 » by 165bows » Tue May 14, 2024 5:09 pm

brackdan70 wrote:
playa-hater wrote:
Dogen wrote:
Celtics could use an athletic big to develop alongside Walsh. A Naz Reid, Jaylin Williams type. Almansa seems to have slipped a bit. Maybe he's available at 54?


Seems like this had been said for years.

You can never have enough undeveloped athletic bigs IMO.

Team acts like you can never have enough developed unathletic bigs though :lol: :lol:

Speaking of, any chance they draft rich man's Grant Williams in the form of Dillon Jones?
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Re: 2024 NBA Draft Thread 

Post#1180 » by brackdan70 » Tue May 14, 2024 5:16 pm

165bows wrote:
brackdan70 wrote:
playa-hater wrote:
Seems like this had been said for years.

You can never have enough undeveloped athletic bigs IMO.

Team acts like you can never have enough developed unathletic bigs though :lol: :lol:

Speaking of, any chance they draft rich man's Grant Williams in the form of Dillon Jones?

Plays at my local school (I haven’t watched a game though). I like the vid I have watched. Seems to be more of an all around player than Grant with ball handling, passing, and more mobile. Seems like a good use of a second round pick if he’s around at 54 or trading back from 30 . Seems like the type of guy that could help right away maybe.


I have him as Draymond lite rather than rich man’s Grant.
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