NBA Draft 2024
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Re: College Basketball, the 2024 NBA Draft and the return of the Ghost of Kleine
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Re: College Basketball, the 2024 NBA Draft and the return of the Ghost of Kleine
Another potential big wing with floor spacing, high IQ, playmaking and solid athletic versatility to consider in Payton Sandfort?
Re: College Basketball, the 2024 NBA Draft and the return of the Ghost of Kleine
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Re: College Basketball, the 2024 NBA Draft and the return of the Ghost of Kleine
Hidden gem/potential steals late 2nd round- undrafted range 3 & D shooting guards/defensive wings
Part 3 0f 5 positional prospect list
1- Nique' Clifford (Colorado)
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/nique-clifford-1.html
At 6'6- 6'7 with a long wingspan, very high basketball IQ, great defensive versatility, quick burst lateral speed, and explosive vertical burst (above the rim explosiveness), Nique' is a slightly smaller budget version of what we had in Mikal Bridges. He always plays within himself, not doing too much, but still doing a bit of everything being adept at passing, shooting, dribbling, making sound defensive plays and also always makes the smart winning plays. He's a smooth slashing wing with a pretty jumpshot and good finishing around the rim. Nique' is also a great rebounder, solid ballhandler, and generally a very talented, very versatile high end two-way wing.
2- Matthew Cleveland- (Miami)
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/matthew-cleveland-1.html
At 6'7 195 lbs with a 6'10 - 6'11 wingspan, Cleveland is a long, rangy, high end athletic versatile two way wing with great defensive versatility, a solid basketball IQ, high end motor, and great weakside recovery, anticipatory instincts and is great in the passing lanes as well. He has a high projectable two-way ceiling along the lines of Devin Vassell, and a floor of a more athletic Danny Green/ Josh Richardson perhaps?
3- Otego Oweh (Miami)
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/otega-oweh-1.html
At 6'5 and 215 lbs with a strong frame and great athleticism and elite shooting efficiency Oweh is a really high potential two-way wing that plays with great energy, intensity and a non stop motor. He's very athletic and versatile with a good basketball IQ. Oweh is also a great spot up shooter, has good movement and relocation skills and is a tenacious defender with good anticipatory skills that help him rack up steals.
4- Terrence Arcenaux- (Houston)
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/terrance-arceneaux-1.html
At around 6'6- 6'7 with a 7 ft wingspan and a relentless motor and elite defensive attributes in high end awareness, anticipation and ability to cover large distances in defensive closeouts and recovery situations, TA has a very high end defensive ceiling. He's super tenacious, very disruptive playing the passing lanes, is always hustling and diving for loose balls too. He a a great glue guy wing option that is a solid floor spacer, weakside shotblocker and basically does all the little things to help his team win. He always plays with great intensity and passion!
5- Terrence Shannon- (Illinois)
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/terrence-shannonjr-1.html
At 6'6 210 lbs with a 6'10 wingspan and high end athleticism, good physicality, a high end motor and great tenacity and defensive anticipation and weakside recovery ability (underrated weakside shotblocker with great bounce), Terrence Shannon is a highly versatile and impactful two-way wing prospect. Shannon is very fast changing ends on the break and has elite rim rocking athleticism and solid range of fundamentals being able to dribble, pass, rebound, defend 1-4 positions, and has potential to develop into a "lockdown" defensive wing. He's also a fluid 3 level wing with great lateral mobility and a smooth jumper. He'd add great value as a strong, athletic versatile two-way impact wing. But whatever team that chooses to draft him, would be well advised to keep an eye on his character choices, and life choices being mentored carefully.
6- Kobe Johnson
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/kobe-johnson-1.html
at 6'5 170 lbs with a strong, athletic frame, high end motor, and a physical and aggressive mentality and a really solid basketball IQ, Johnson (The younger brother of the Atlanta Hawks Jalen Johnson) is a very solid rebounder and an underrated passer and a solid 3 level scorer with a smooth jumpshot shooting upwards of 36% from three. He's an energetic, physical defender with good recovery and anticipatory skills that racks up steals at a 4.4% rate. He's another strong, physical, smart, versatile two-way wing with three level scoring ability that never takes plays off and makes underrated impact plays on both ends. His game/playstyle reminds of Raja Bell somewhat.
7- Josiah James Jordan- (Tennesee)
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/josiah-jordan-james-1.html
At 6'6 207 lbs with a 6'11 wingspan and a sturdy frame,a rugged physical mentality, and solid athleticism, James is a solid physical value versatile wing that has a good motor, plus athleticism, servicable but improving jumpshot, is an underrated playmaker and good connector who iniates good screen assists and who has good court vision, James is also a solid disruptive defender that gets steals and can block some shots too with his recovery anticipation and solid defensive recovery and drop coverage instincts. He will need to polish up his shooting and overall offensive game. And he'll need to become more assertive trusting his abilities, but he's got very solid foundational skills that'll bring value to some team. He's more or less a very solid bargain version of bruce Brown?
8- Scotty Middleton- (Ohio State)
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/scotty-middleton-1.html
At 6'7 195 lbs, Middleton is a long, rangy, wiry but high end athletic and very switchable versatile wing with a smooth jumpshot and good relocation skills and movement shooting. Middleton is also a phenomenal spot up shooter hitting well over 43% of his threes and can really guard multiple positions up and down the line with his great fluidity and lateral defensive mobility. He has a very high end trajectory given his immense versatility, switchability, basketball IQ, and smooth two way ability and impressive handle. He's going to provide impact value and defensive versatility from the jump for whatver team that drafts him.
9- Vontarius Woolbright- (Western Carolina)
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/vonterius-woolbright-1.html
At 6'6 210 lbs (but closer to 6'8- 6'9), Woolbright is a long, wiry, smooth but not very athletic wing with guard skills a fairly decent jumpshot but not a legit floor spacing threat currently, still, Woolbright has really crafty, smooth downhill ability, and who is a tenacious defender, a good playmaker, a PHENOMENAL REBOUNDER, and a stat stuffing monster at times. Woolbright is a double double machine and an talented slashing wing/guard with a a unique amount of size, wiry strength and fluidity. He also has good bounce and a fair amount of above the rim ability. He plays with a tough, physical mentality and a bully ball style of play utilizing his size well against smaller players. He's an incredible rebounder for his size, shows instances of advanced playmaking, skillful connective passing, and a unique mix of a power and finesse game.
10- Keshawn Harris Smith- (Maryland)
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/deshawn-harris-smith-2.html
At 6'5 210 lbs with ELITE athleticism, vertical burst and a high end relentless motor, KSH is ironically very similar to another high end defensive wing in KCP!! . And although Keshawn isn't yet the accomplished shooter/floor spacer that KCP is, KSH is a high end potential "lockdown" defensive wing with elite defensive instincts and attributes. He'll just need time to properly develop. He has ELITE athleticism, strength, and top notch feel for cutting to the basket and scoring with a soft touch around the rim. He plays with a great intensity and edginess for the game! He has a relentless motor that never quits, and has a low usage, "do whatever is needed to win" humble yet passionate mentality. He's a very good physical defender with a nose for the ball and who leverags his size,energy and athleticism well to his advantage in matchups. He does a variety of little things that impact the game and habitually makes winning plays. Again, he's a more athletic but (currently) less offensively polished version of Kentavious Caldwell Pope (Denver Nuggets).
Part 3 0f 5 positional prospect list
1- Nique' Clifford (Colorado)
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/nique-clifford-1.html
Spoiler:
At 6'6- 6'7 with a long wingspan, very high basketball IQ, great defensive versatility, quick burst lateral speed, and explosive vertical burst (above the rim explosiveness), Nique' is a slightly smaller budget version of what we had in Mikal Bridges. He always plays within himself, not doing too much, but still doing a bit of everything being adept at passing, shooting, dribbling, making sound defensive plays and also always makes the smart winning plays. He's a smooth slashing wing with a pretty jumpshot and good finishing around the rim. Nique' is also a great rebounder, solid ballhandler, and generally a very talented, very versatile high end two-way wing.
2- Matthew Cleveland- (Miami)
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/matthew-cleveland-1.html
Spoiler:
At 6'7 195 lbs with a 6'10 - 6'11 wingspan, Cleveland is a long, rangy, high end athletic versatile two way wing with great defensive versatility, a solid basketball IQ, high end motor, and great weakside recovery, anticipatory instincts and is great in the passing lanes as well. He has a high projectable two-way ceiling along the lines of Devin Vassell, and a floor of a more athletic Danny Green/ Josh Richardson perhaps?
3- Otego Oweh (Miami)
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/otega-oweh-1.html
Spoiler:
At 6'5 and 215 lbs with a strong frame and great athleticism and elite shooting efficiency Oweh is a really high potential two-way wing that plays with great energy, intensity and a non stop motor. He's very athletic and versatile with a good basketball IQ. Oweh is also a great spot up shooter, has good movement and relocation skills and is a tenacious defender with good anticipatory skills that help him rack up steals.
4- Terrence Arcenaux- (Houston)
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/terrance-arceneaux-1.html
Spoiler:
At around 6'6- 6'7 with a 7 ft wingspan and a relentless motor and elite defensive attributes in high end awareness, anticipation and ability to cover large distances in defensive closeouts and recovery situations, TA has a very high end defensive ceiling. He's super tenacious, very disruptive playing the passing lanes, is always hustling and diving for loose balls too. He a a great glue guy wing option that is a solid floor spacer, weakside shotblocker and basically does all the little things to help his team win. He always plays with great intensity and passion!
5- Terrence Shannon- (Illinois)
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/terrence-shannonjr-1.html
Spoiler:
At 6'6 210 lbs with a 6'10 wingspan and high end athleticism, good physicality, a high end motor and great tenacity and defensive anticipation and weakside recovery ability (underrated weakside shotblocker with great bounce), Terrence Shannon is a highly versatile and impactful two-way wing prospect. Shannon is very fast changing ends on the break and has elite rim rocking athleticism and solid range of fundamentals being able to dribble, pass, rebound, defend 1-4 positions, and has potential to develop into a "lockdown" defensive wing. He's also a fluid 3 level wing with great lateral mobility and a smooth jumper. He'd add great value as a strong, athletic versatile two-way impact wing. But whatever team that chooses to draft him, would be well advised to keep an eye on his character choices, and life choices being mentored carefully.
6- Kobe Johnson
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/kobe-johnson-1.html
Spoiler:
at 6'5 170 lbs with a strong, athletic frame, high end motor, and a physical and aggressive mentality and a really solid basketball IQ, Johnson (The younger brother of the Atlanta Hawks Jalen Johnson) is a very solid rebounder and an underrated passer and a solid 3 level scorer with a smooth jumpshot shooting upwards of 36% from three. He's an energetic, physical defender with good recovery and anticipatory skills that racks up steals at a 4.4% rate. He's another strong, physical, smart, versatile two-way wing with three level scoring ability that never takes plays off and makes underrated impact plays on both ends. His game/playstyle reminds of Raja Bell somewhat.
7- Josiah James Jordan- (Tennesee)
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/josiah-jordan-james-1.html
Spoiler:
At 6'6 207 lbs with a 6'11 wingspan and a sturdy frame,a rugged physical mentality, and solid athleticism, James is a solid physical value versatile wing that has a good motor, plus athleticism, servicable but improving jumpshot, is an underrated playmaker and good connector who iniates good screen assists and who has good court vision, James is also a solid disruptive defender that gets steals and can block some shots too with his recovery anticipation and solid defensive recovery and drop coverage instincts. He will need to polish up his shooting and overall offensive game. And he'll need to become more assertive trusting his abilities, but he's got very solid foundational skills that'll bring value to some team. He's more or less a very solid bargain version of bruce Brown?
8- Scotty Middleton- (Ohio State)
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/scotty-middleton-1.html
Spoiler:
At 6'7 195 lbs, Middleton is a long, rangy, wiry but high end athletic and very switchable versatile wing with a smooth jumpshot and good relocation skills and movement shooting. Middleton is also a phenomenal spot up shooter hitting well over 43% of his threes and can really guard multiple positions up and down the line with his great fluidity and lateral defensive mobility. He has a very high end trajectory given his immense versatility, switchability, basketball IQ, and smooth two way ability and impressive handle. He's going to provide impact value and defensive versatility from the jump for whatver team that drafts him.
9- Vontarius Woolbright- (Western Carolina)
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/vonterius-woolbright-1.html
Spoiler:
At 6'6 210 lbs (but closer to 6'8- 6'9), Woolbright is a long, wiry, smooth but not very athletic wing with guard skills a fairly decent jumpshot but not a legit floor spacing threat currently, still, Woolbright has really crafty, smooth downhill ability, and who is a tenacious defender, a good playmaker, a PHENOMENAL REBOUNDER, and a stat stuffing monster at times. Woolbright is a double double machine and an talented slashing wing/guard with a a unique amount of size, wiry strength and fluidity. He also has good bounce and a fair amount of above the rim ability. He plays with a tough, physical mentality and a bully ball style of play utilizing his size well against smaller players. He's an incredible rebounder for his size, shows instances of advanced playmaking, skillful connective passing, and a unique mix of a power and finesse game.
10- Keshawn Harris Smith- (Maryland)
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/deshawn-harris-smith-2.html
Spoiler:
At 6'5 210 lbs with ELITE athleticism, vertical burst and a high end relentless motor, KSH is ironically very similar to another high end defensive wing in KCP!! . And although Keshawn isn't yet the accomplished shooter/floor spacer that KCP is, KSH is a high end potential "lockdown" defensive wing with elite defensive instincts and attributes. He'll just need time to properly develop. He has ELITE athleticism, strength, and top notch feel for cutting to the basket and scoring with a soft touch around the rim. He plays with a great intensity and edginess for the game! He has a relentless motor that never quits, and has a low usage, "do whatever is needed to win" humble yet passionate mentality. He's a very good physical defender with a nose for the ball and who leverags his size,energy and athleticism well to his advantage in matchups. He does a variety of little things that impact the game and habitually makes winning plays. Again, he's a more athletic but (currently) less offensively polished version of Kentavious Caldwell Pope (Denver Nuggets).
Re: College Basketball, the 2024 NBA Draft and the return of the Ghost of Kleine
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Re: College Basketball, the 2024 NBA Draft and the return of the Ghost of Kleine
Amari Williams is another very high end athletic, physical, long defender with some intruiging offensive and underlying passing skills that we should have on our big board. He's fairly well skilled with a solid basketball IQ and developing floor spacing skillset for a strong, physical, athletic and aggressive powerful 4/5 option. He plays a bit like a slightly smaller Joel Embiid. But can play either the 4 or the 5, and is a very strong rim protector.
Re: College Basketball Conference Tourney time before the big tourney next week - Prospect watch time!
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Re: College Basketball Conference Tourney time before the big tourney next week - Prospect watch time!
AZ's first conference tourney game starts in 15 minutes.
Re: College Basketball, the 2024 NBA Draft and the return of the Ghost of Kleine
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Re: College Basketball, the 2024 NBA Draft and the return of the Ghost of Kleine
Ghost of Kleine wrote:.
So lets talk about our first round pick. Not sure if you've talked about it much, but obviously that is the biggest potential to inject something new into our rotation.
From Tankathon, I will post their Big Board, then mock, then their projected pick. In the mock, the 3 Cs who go between 13-17 right before us look interesting, especially Donovan Clingan, who looks like a defensive monster with size, blocking a lot of shots, rebounding, etc. He also is playing for UConn, one of the best teams in the country, and one who many pick to win it all in the tourney. We should get at least 4-5 games from him in the next few weeks.
Big Board:
Spoiler:
Mock:
Spoiler:
Our projected pick, a 6'8 SF who is a great defender who can get a ton of blocks, is a great rebounder, etc...only problem is he can't shoot 3s. But he could be a great 5th starter in a small ball lineup with Beal, Book, Allen, Dunn, KD, or just a great rotation guy to beef up the defense.....come in when the first guy sits:
Spoiler:
Re: NBA Draft Prospect watch with March Madness starting tomorrow!
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Re: College Basketball, the 2024 NBA Draft and the return of the Ghost of Kleine
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Re: College Basketball, the 2024 NBA Draft and the return of the Ghost of Kleine
bwgood77 wrote:Ghost of Kleine wrote:.
So lets talk about our first round pick. Not sure if you've talked about it much, but obviously that is the biggest potential to inject something new into our rotation.
From Tankathon, I will post their Big Board, then mock, then their projected pick. In the mock, the 3 Cs who go between 13-17 right before us look interesting, especially Donovan Clingan, who looks like a defensive monster with size, blocking a lot of shots, rebounding, etc. He also is playing for UConn, one of the best teams in the country, and one who many pick to win it all in the tourney. We should get at least 4-5 games from him in the next few weeks.
Big Board:Spoiler:
Mock:Spoiler:
Our projected pick, a 6'8 SF who is a great defender who can get a ton of blocks, is a great rebounder, etc...only problem is he can't shoot 3s. But he could be a great 5th starter in a small ball lineup with Beal, Book, Allen, Dunn, KD, or just a great rotation guy to beef up the defense.....come in when the first guy sits:Spoiler:
I've talked about our pick a little bit here and there man! But mostly mentioned prospects lists (so far) for what might be available in the late 2nd - undrafted range for us with interest to our financial situation. But for my part, I still have us finishing with a 46- 36 record, basically a 1st round exit to maybe a 2nd round upset as the very best outcome if we can upset our 1st round matchup somehow?? With that outcome, I DO have us landing in the 21-24 range (barring our luck finally running out in terms of injury to Durant or Booker or even Nurkic somehow). And I do love Clingan, BUT honestly I don't think there's anyway whatsoever that he'd fall past the The Heat at 15, and quite honestly strongly believe that the Thunder may likely take him at #11. Or very close in that range of where their pick (from the rockets)ultimately lands. I just really think they'd draft him to play Holmgren at the 4 and let Clingan actually body up against the bigger more physical 5s.
As for Dunn, I'd love to have him anchor our perimter defense even though his shooting is almost non existent! And I actually do think there's a solid chance he could fall to us because of his current offensive limitations. I think only maybe Miami (at #15) or Orlando (at #21) pose a big risk to him reaching our range. I agree with you that he'd be a great 5th starter though as a potential defensive catalyst/ defensive playmaker for us in specific matchups or off the bench. I do also believe he'd be an amazing compliment playing next to Allen IF we were to move him to the bench. In a starter role though, I'd likely move Allen to the bench for added bench scoring/leadership. Maybe even have O'neale and Grayson off the bench, and run a starting lineup of:
Starters
Beal/Booker/Dunn/Durant/Nurkic.
(I only suggest this to give our lineup more size and significant frontcourt defensive upgrade to allow us to more comfortably extend our defenders outside of the paint towards the three). 6'5, 6'7, 6'9, 7 ft, 6'11. It'd also significantly upgrade our bench with better size, quality depth, scoring/defense, two way versatility/ rim protection- (Comche).
Bench
Draft/ Allen/ O'neale/ Bol/ Comche.
......
I think that these lineups would offer a big improvement even in spite of our current lack of assets and financial futility. As for the 3 centers that you have (from Tankathon) in the 13-17 range, Clingan, Filipowski,Missi, I'd tier them like this:
Clingan/ Missi/ Filipowski. But honestly would probably take Dunn in that range even over a center option as I've identified numerous equitable quality center options that will be available in the very late 2nd to undrafted range so that we could use that pick on Dunn for his ELITE DEFENSIVE PLAYMAKING VERSATILITY which we desperately need more of on the perimeter and roaming the passing lanes/cutting similar to what Bridges provided defensively. I may keep beating the Ulriche Comche drum though man because of his elite potential two way versatility, ability to switch and play at EITHER the 4 or the 5, and his elite LEGIT 3 & D Big man skillset. Are you at all familiar with him yet? I reasonably see his skillset/talent/versatility as a mix of Al Horford/ Serge Ibaka.
Even as a young prospect, his advance stats/efficiency, etc are very, very impressive already.
https://www.si.com/nba/draft/newsfeed/nba-draft-2024-the-mystery-of-ulrich-chomche
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
Ideally my top preference would be for us to somehow end up high enough to secure value to trade back in this draft.Then pick up Comche to back up Nurkic, and maybe even play some spot minutes beside of Nurkic situationally? (maybe even play Bol at the 3 for an enormous frontcourt lineup? and also maybe pick up an additional pick (2nd) to use on a backup guard option maybe one of Ajay Mitchell whose very similar to tyus Jones in many regards. Or Cam Spencer who's very similar to Reed Sheppard (a budget version), Or IF we'd prefer a two way wing with high end impact and versatility, Nique Clifford (Colorado) who's pretty similar to a young Mikal bridges in terms of versatility/impact/potential.
Lastly, I'd switch out Eubanks with an extremely underrated versatile 4/5 like Drew Pember or maybe Yaxel Lendeborg (UAB) or Quinton Post (Boston) who's a skilled 4/5 budget version of Poetl. Or Joel Soriano (St Johns) that's a 6'11 265 lbs Double/Double machine, is very physicaland strong, but still versatile 4/5 who plays bully ball and is a mix of Kurt Thomas/ Boogie Cousins in terms of physicality, dominance (using size/girth, and has a 15.1 Offensive rebounding percentage.
https://www.noceilingsnba.com/p/no-stone-unturned-2023-the-big-men
Spoiler:
Re: NBA Draft Prospect watch with March Madness starting tomorrow!
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I think what we really need is a C. A defensive player at any position that can also hit 3s would be nice. I'm not as worried about a PG as many, though we could use one. I think we more need players at positions that can have more of an impact defensively.
I don't see us wanting to keep Nurk long term after this contract. He does a lot of great things, but we really need a big defensive presence in the middle the way our roster is built. A great defender, rebounder and if he could hit 3s that would be great...also with great finishing.
I really really like Bol though. I think he should watch a lot of Wemby, Sengun and Gobert. If he can take pieces from their games, it would be nice. I think he's a little like Chet, without as much impact shot blocking, which he should have.
I don't see us wanting to keep Nurk long term after this contract. He does a lot of great things, but we really need a big defensive presence in the middle the way our roster is built. A great defender, rebounder and if he could hit 3s that would be great...also with great finishing.
I really really like Bol though. I think he should watch a lot of Wemby, Sengun and Gobert. If he can take pieces from their games, it would be nice. I think he's a little like Chet, without as much impact shot blocking, which he should have.
Re: NBA Draft Prospect watch with March Madness starting tomorrow!
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Re: NBA Draft Prospect watch with March Madness starting tomorrow!
I like kolek, reminds me of a twitchy goran dragic.
I hate this team.
Re: NBA Draft Prospect watch with March Madness starting tomorrow!
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Re: NBA Draft Prospect watch with March Madness starting tomorrow!
bwgood77 wrote:I think what we really need is a C. A defensive player at any position that can also hit 3s would be nice. I'm not as worried about a PG as many, though we could use one. I think we more need players at positions that can have more of an impact defensively.
I don't see us wanting to keep Nurk long term after this contract. He does a lot of great things, but we really need a big defensive presence in the middle the way our roster is built. A great defender, rebounder and if he could hit 3s that would be great...also with great finishing.
I really really like Bol though. I think he should watch a lot of Wemby, Sengun and Gobert. If he can take pieces from their games, it would be nice. I think he's a little like Chet, without as much impact shot blocking, which he should have.
Excellent points man! And I do fully agree with all that you're saying too. Adding O'neale and having Okogie come back will definitely help somewhat more with our perimeter defense. Although, I'm not overtly excited with either players overall lack of elite size/ athleticism for their roles. But their both solid for their roles for what we can currently afford.
I am quite fond of Dunn ( in spite) of his lack of offensive floor spacing because you're very right that we desperately need a defensive connector/ playmaker. I will say that it isn't too much of a big deal if Dunn wasn't our pick in our range because again, I have identified a number of really solid two way wings.
We'd still end up having an A+ night if we landed Comche for our shot blocking floor spacing power forward-center ( 4/5) backup option. And then Nique' Clifford from the late 2nd to undrafted pool as Clifford has a lot of similar attributes to Bridges, although slightly smaller at 6'6. Or go bigger with Jamir Watkins that is around 6'8 and is vertically explosive. physical, and has secondary playmaking/ guard skills.
Point guard is not too.much of a critical issue Although still important objectively, I'd lean more towards a strong defensive compliment. And if outside of the draft and from the undrafted pool, you won't find much better than Ian Martinez
https://www.noceilingsnba.com/p/jamir-watkins-is-doing-everything
Spoiler:
But the reason that I like Ulriche Comche is because he has basically everything that you mentioned in his toolbox for a 4/5 young center already. AND he could play either the 4 or the 5 given his very impressive versatility. I mean he's shooting 38% from three and averaging around 3 blocks. It doesn't get much more 3 & D than that! And you could also look at any of:
Quinton Post, Drew Pember, Joel Soriano, Danny Wolf, etc that have the 3 & D type complimentary skillset that you mentioned as well. Just not as nearly high of a ceiling or advanced versatility that Comche already posesses now at such an early age.
Re: NBA Draft Prospect watch with March Madness starting tomorrow!
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Re: NBA Draft Prospect watch with March Madness starting tomorrow!
Ghost of Kleine wrote:bwgood77 wrote:I think what we really need is a C. A defensive player at any position that can also hit 3s would be nice. I'm not as worried about a PG as many, though we could use one. I think we more need players at positions that can have more of an impact defensively.
I don't see us wanting to keep Nurk long term after this contract. He does a lot of great things, but we really need a big defensive presence in the middle the way our roster is built. A great defender, rebounder and if he could hit 3s that would be great...also with great finishing.
I really really like Bol though. I think he should watch a lot of Wemby, Sengun and Gobert. If he can take pieces from their games, it would be nice. I think he's a little like Chet, without as much impact shot blocking, which he should have.
Excellent points man! And I do fully agree with all that you're saying too. Adding O'neale and having Okogie come back will definitely help somewhat more with our perimeter defense. Although, I'm not overtly excited with either players overall lack of elite size/ athleticism for their roles. But their both solid for their roles for what we can currently afford.
I am quite fond of Dunn ( in spite) of his lack of offensive floor spacing because you're very right that we desperately need a defensive connector/ playmaker. I will say that it isn't too much of a big deal if Dunn wasn't our pick in our range because again, I have identified a number of really solid two way wings.
We'd still end up having an A+ night if we landed Comche for our shot blocking floor spacing power forward-center ( 4/5) backup option. And then Nique' Clifford from the late 2nd to undrafted pool as Clifford has a lot of similar attributes to Bridges, although slightly smaller at 6'6. Or go bigger with Jamir Watkins that is around 6'8 and is vertically explosive. physical, and has secondary playmaking/ guard skills.
Point guard is not too.much of a critical issue. Although still important. I'd lean more towards a strong defensive compliment. And if outside of the draft and from the undrafted pool, you won't find much better than Ian Martinez
https://www.noceilingsnba.com/p/jamir-watkins-is-doing-everythingSpoiler:
But the reason that I like Ulriche Comche is because he has basically everything that you mentioned in his toolbox for a 4/5 young center already. AND he could play either the 4 or the 5 given his very impressive versatility. I mean he's shooting 38% from three and averaging around 3 blocks. It doesn't get much more 3 & D than that! And you could also look at any of:
Quinton Post, Drew Pember, Joel Soriano, Danny Wolf, etc that have the 3 & D type complimentary skillset that you mentioned as well. Just not as nearly high of a ceiling or advanced versatility that Comche already posesses now at such an early age.
Kind of a weird player looking at his #s. He is 6'11 with a 7'4 wingspan, but shoots 42.4% overall on 11 shots per game. However, he takes 7 3s a game and shoots a little over 38%. So that probably means he's a little over 50% from 2...or around there. He does average a lot of blocks, but his turnovers are crazy. He averages 5 a game or 6 per 36.
I think perimeter D is important but I think having a defensive presense, rim protector, and a guy that can cover a lot of ground quickly with length...basically protecting all of the paint, is important. I don't know that it is super important the C shoot 3s. I like when they can. Brook Lopez would be perfect because he spreads the floor but also contests more shots than any other player in the NBA by far...so he is a great rim protector.
Do you really like Chomche better than DaRon Holmes? Look at the differrence:
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bwgood77 wrote:Ghost of Kleine wrote:bwgood77 wrote:I think what we really need is a C. A defensive player at any position that can also hit 3s would be nice. I'm not as worried about a PG as many, though we could use one. I think we more need players at positions that can have more of an impact defensively.
I don't see us wanting to keep Nurk long term after this contract. He does a lot of great things, but we really need a big defensive presence in the middle the way our roster is built. A great defender, rebounder and if he could hit 3s that would be great...also with great finishing.
I really really like Bol though. I think he should watch a lot of Wemby, Sengun and Gobert. If he can take pieces from their games, it would be nice. I think he's a little like Chet, without as much impact shot blocking, which he should have.
Excellent points man! And I do fully agree with all that you're saying too. Adding O'neale and having Okogie come back will definitely help somewhat more with our perimeter defense. Although, I'm not overtly excited with either players overall lack of elite size/ athleticism for their roles. But their both solid for their roles for what we can currently afford.
I am quite fond of Dunn ( in spite) of his lack of offensive floor spacing because you're very right that we desperately need a defensive connector/ playmaker. I will say that it isn't too much of a big deal if Dunn wasn't our pick in our range because again, I have identified a number of really solid two way wings.
We'd still end up having an A+ night if we landed Comche for our shot blocking floor spacing power forward-center ( 4/5) backup option. And then Nique' Clifford from the late 2nd to undrafted pool as Clifford has a lot of similar attributes to Bridges, although slightly smaller at 6'6. Or go bigger with Jamir Watkins that is around 6'8 and is vertically explosive. physical, and has secondary playmaking/ guard skills.
Point guard is not too.much of a critical issue. Although still important. I'd lean more towards a strong defensive compliment. And if outside of the draft and from the undrafted pool, you won't find much better than Ian Martinez
https://www.noceilingsnba.com/p/jamir-watkins-is-doing-everythingSpoiler:
But the reason that I like Ulriche Comche is because he has basically everything that you mentioned in his toolbox for a 4/5 young center already. AND he could play either the 4 or the 5 given his very impressive versatility. I mean he's shooting 38% from three and averaging around 3 blocks. It doesn't get much more 3 & D than that! And you could also look at any of:
Quinton Post, Drew Pember, Joel Soriano, Danny Wolf, etc that have the 3 & D type complimentary skillset that you mentioned as well. Just not as nearly high of a ceiling or advanced versatility that Comche already posesses now at such an early age.
Kind of a weird player looking at his #s. He is 6'11 with a 7'4 wingspan, but shoots 42.4% overall on 11 shots per game. However, he takes 7 3s a game and shoots a little over 38%. So that probably means he's a little over 50% from 2...or around there. He does average a lot of blocks, but his turnovers are crazy. He averages 5 a game or 6 per 36.
I think perimeter D is important but I think having a defensive presense, rim protector, and a guy that can cover a lot of ground quickly with length...basically protecting all of the paint, is important. I don't know that it is super important the C shoot 3s. I like when they can. Brook Lopez would be perfect because he spreads the floor but also contests more shots than any other player in the NBA by far...so he is a great rim protector.
Do you really like Chomche better than DaRon Holmes? Look at the differrence:
I do really like Holmes, and would not at all be disappointed or upset If we drafted him, and I do think that Holmes would have a solid career and impact in a role similar to Bobby Portis or maybe a bit more like Kevon Looney but with better shooting perhaps? As for liking Comche better than Holmes, In comparing the two IF we had to choose between the two at our pick, then yes, I would give him the distinct edge over Holmes (despite being younger) because of a few key factors in his favor:
1- Better size, Girth, Length (wingspan). As these things matter in scaling up at the NBA level against bigger, stronger, quicker and vastly more athletic competition. Holmes is/has been playing outstanding basketball, and would bring great value and reliable production and defense, but when considering his smaller size, slight frame and 7'0 wingspan for a 6'9 - maybe 6'10 220 lb 4/5. Now Holmes at 21 yrs old, may still have some growth left. But for Comche at only 18 yrs old and already at 6'11 and 234 lbs and already possessing a longer wingspan too at 7'4, I believe the growth considerations are already firmly in his favor.
https://www.tankathon.com/players/compare?players=ulrich-chomche--daron-holmes-ii
2- Much higher long term ceiling. With Comche, again correlating his attributes as well as his deficiencies too back to his young age, he already shows an advanced and very diverse foundation in his overall talent and skillset capabilities. It's true that Holmes is absolutely putting up better scoring numbers and efficiency in some categories with a higher PER too. However, I (for my part) would attribute that more to much higher usage and overall age related experience with that edge going to Holmes favorably. I also attribute his 42% and turnovers concern simply to being young, somewhat inexperienced and perhaps trying to do too much too soon. But in that, in time he'll learn to better let things come to him in the flow of the game, and then those issues will improve or correct themselves (turnovers). And the lower shooting percentages, I also would attribute to style of play with Comche operating more in a faceup big modern big style of play, and with Holmes playing more predominantly in the post as a paint patrolling big with some complimentary versatility on defense too. But overall I believe Holmes takes more efficient shots around/closer to the rim given his style of play post up with some face up vs more face up perimeter oriented style of play from Comche.
3- Comche is just already more dynamic at a younger age. when you watch both prospects play, you'll just notice that Comche is more fluid and dynamic with the ball, both in his ballhandling, taking the ball and leading the break going coast to coast at times, his anticipation and recovery with better lateral fluidity. H's just much more smooth in his movements, etc. Comche is already a more adept and comfortable/skilled passer even though he racks up more turnovers likely again to his youth and inexperience trying to do too much. But again, I do think that gets reigned in more under an nba coaching staff. Again, Comche just already has better size, weight, wingspan and maybe even better vertical burst to bang against actual nba 5s' in specific matchups than Holmes does at a slightly size, weight, and shorter wingspan. Although Holmes experience may cancel some of those factors out initially.
Now to be clear, Both would and should easily be considered a win for us on draft night, But if having to choose between the two, I'd still give the overall edge to Comche for higher long term ceiling as well as higher growth trajectory/ NBA ready build.
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Spoiler:
Another reason I think Holmes might be the better fit, aside from having better overall #s, is that he is a junior, from a solid program in Dayton, and is probably more ready, which we need.
They play AZ early tomorrow, so a good chance to see him go against top level college competition, and Ballo.
On another note, would you like Ballo as an UDFA?
And according to tankathon's big board, Kylan Boswell and Caleb Love are outside the top 60. They could be decent guys to pick up for the cheap.
I think the best AZ prospect though is Pelle Larson..smart player, good all around, plays better in big games, can shoot the 3 (44%), 3.6 apg.
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bwgood77 wrote:Spoiler:
Another reason I think Holmes might be the better fit, aside from having better overall #s, is that he is a junior, from a solid program in Dayton, and is probably more ready, which we need.
They play AZ early tomorrow, so a good chance to see him go against top level college competition, and Ballo.
On another note, would you like Ballo as an UDFA?
And according to tankathon's big board, Kylan Boswell and Caleb Love are outside the top 60. They could be decent guys to pick up for the cheap.
I think the best AZ prospect though is Pelle Larson..smart player, good all around, plays better in big games, can shoot the 3 (44%), 3.6 apg.
For sure man! I would like Ballos' size, physicality, length and girth as an undrafted prospect and as potential Nurkic insurance, Although his lack of shooting/free throw % concern me as they'll likely be targeted heavily ala "hack a Shaq" tactics. I also wouldn't be at all disappointed if we took Holmes with our pick as he's really solid too. And his skillset does address some of our concerns. The experience factor as well as playing in a high major division only adds to his allure too. And I've been a fan of his and had him pretty high on my list in the previous draft trying to figure a way to get him with an acquired 1st via trade. With Comche, I just see a higher overall ceiling long term which I think would be more important with respect to a potential post Durant and maybe even post Booker core?? And given his unique talents, I also just see him having a higher overall impact trajectory and evolution. Although I would be quite pleased with eithwr. BUT regardless of either player, I'm ultimately hoping for a trade back scenario (if at all possible) for us to maybe add another asset or recoup some depth and talent?
I'd be cool with Boswell or Caleb Love outside of the top 60 too. Boswell shares many similar skillset traits to Van Vleet, as Love shares with Jordan Clarkson a bit too. I kind of like Tamin Lipsey in a Jose Alvarado role, Or Eric Gaines as an super quick, elite vertical burst budget version of DeAaron Fox who could really improve our penetration, pace, foul generation too. A really solid under the radar name that everyone should check out is Cam Spencer of Uconn. From a great program, he's very, very solid and a only slightly lesser version of Reed Sheppard honestly and very very close to putting up 50/40/90 club numbers wherein he could offer similar impact as Allen has for us at the backup guard spot (maybe replace Gordon)??
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/cam-spencer-1.html
And Mark Sears of Alabama is strong, aggressive and putting up very impressive numbers:
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/mark-sears-1.html
Darius Brown 2nd is a very solid and intruiging guard with a smooth game that while undersized at 6'2 195 lbs is putting out almost 7 assists to only 2 turnovers with really good shooting and ball handling/game management skills. Did you have any thoughts on names like:
Johni Broome
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/johni-broome-1.html
as another slender framed similar slight 4/5 option with almost identical statistical production and efficiency to Holmes)? But likely a late 2nd to undrafted value option. And his w/s and BPM along with his per 40 numbers are truly impressive. He could be an extreme value alternative to Holmes if we don't draft him specifically.
Quinton Post
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/quinten-post-1.html
as a very skilled/ efficient fundamentally sound 7 ft skilled floor spacing 4/5 comp-liment to whomever we draft?He's kind of a mix of a more two way oriented Poetl/ or a bigger more skilled version of Jock Landale with much better 3 pt shooting too (deep range), passing, etc. He could add great size as a 4/5 interchangable skilled big as an undrafted option. Could be a significant upgrade to Eubanks, allowing us to go super big off the bench in some matchups with Bol at the 3?? Would be a dollar store version of Brook Lopez ironically at least in terms of playstyle, skillset.
Joel Soriano
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/joel-soriano-1.html
as a big, physical double double machine (4/5) that plays with aggression and intensity and has some floor spacing skills, a developing faceup game, and some passing chops too. He's a mix of Boogie Cousins and Jurt Thomas playstyle, but would be another extreme value addition for our frontcourt. He'd be a very solid backup consideration to Nurkic (or Nurkic insurance at least). Or we could play him at the 4 as a very big, physical/ aggressive somewhat skilled 4 and add a highly skilled floor spacing 5 or just have Bol play at the 5 as a spacer for an elite inside/out frontcourt duo?
Amari Williams
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/amari-williams-2.html
As a 6'10 250 lb power 4/5 with an high end motor great physicality and ABSOLUTELY ELITE defensive ability along the lines of a Robert Williams. And a rudimentary offensive face up game, some basic ball handling skills and solid passing as a foundation to build off of toward a potential high end outcome? He's a mix of a smaller Embiid (in style of play) and Timelord (in terms of rim protection, weakside protection/, defensive awareness, anticipation and reaction/recovery.
Danny Wolf
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/danny-wolf-1.html
As a gritty, high motor 7'0 255 lb 4/5 that has solid skill, legit downhill ability, ballhandling, passing, tenacity as a defender and rebounder. And has a really impressive 3 pt shooting at 48% (over 2 attempts per game) he also generates nearly 2.5 stocks per game and a surprising 14% assist rate too. He just oozes skill, versatility and tenacity, although not possessing elite athleticism. He's another rugged 7 footer that can play interchangably at EITHER the 4 or the 5 and would give our frontcourt significant size upgrade and add immense positional matchup options at a value pricetag as an undraftd two way or even exhibit 10 prospect.
Drew Pember
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/drew-pember-1.html
as a long, very mobile, very fluid intense/ passionate 4/5 with incredible versatility and a non stop aggressive motor. Pember at 6'11 has a non stop motor, plays with high end passion/ aggression, and is extraordinarily skilled in that he can handle the ball, pass well, rebound and protect the rim with tenacity, hit the three well, iniate offense, be a defensive playmaker. He's basically a very mobile long, 6'11 aggressive swiss army knife with good offense and switchability as a 4/5 or even some instances at the 3 as well. He's a mix of an ultra quick, athletic frank Kaminsky and Gordon Hayward or Kyle Singler. Pember (or Robbie Avila)
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/robbie-avila-1.html
is exactly the type of player that would be a perfect offensive playmaking versatile compliment to DaRon Holmes defensive playmaking, or Johni Broomes' elite defensive skillset/playmaking all interchangable as 4/5 options depending upon matchup.
Re: NBA Draft Prospect watch with March Madness starting tomorrow!
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Re: NBA Draft Prospect watch with March Madness (AZ playing Dayton and Daron Holmes III now on CBS!)
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Re: NBA Draft Prospect watch with March Madness (AZ playing Dayton and Daron Holmes III now on CBS!)
AZ not looking bad....were looking really good but allowed Dayton to close the gap before the half.
Re: NBA Draft Prospect watch with March Madness (AZ playing Dayton and Daron Holmes III now on CBS!)
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Let’s get back to the elite 8 for the first time in 9 years!
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Hitachi77 wrote:Let’s get back to the elite 8 for the first time in 9 years!
The skies the limit with this team. I don’t normally say this but I truly believe Caleb Love has potential to lead us to the final 4. He’s resilient and unafraid to fail. He has ice in his veins and I believe he will be huge for UofA as the rounds proceed.
Re: NBA Draft Prospect watch with March Madness
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I really like Keshad Johnsons' athleticism, quickness and physicality with purpose! (he utilizes simple and effective moves within his physical advantages). I'd be really cool with him as a backup 3 maybe situational small ball 4 occasionally too.
Maybe he could fill the role of what we were hoping for with Miles Bridges (somewhat as a lesser budget version) but without all of the legal issues and moral concerns?
Maybe he could fill the role of what we were hoping for with Miles Bridges (somewhat as a lesser budget version) but without all of the legal issues and moral concerns?