Phenomenologist wrote:I disagree with most of this. For one, the Ross pick definitely came out of left field. ESPN had him early to mid teens (they had Araujo 21st for comparison), but Hollinger had him 29th and a number of other outlets had him lower. I mean, just look at media reactions to the pick. Most were surprised; most thought it was a reach. Again, it's about gradations.
The vast majority of mocks had Drummond no worse than the top-8. My feeling (based on an aggregate of scouting reports and mocks) before the draft went down was that there were EIGHT elite prospects (with gradations between them owing to mental makeup questions and, of course, the Davis factor); thus, once the top seven picks were made, I assumed (or prayed, really) that we would take the final one left, i.e. Drummond. When we not only passed on Drummond, but also other players that were generally ranked higher (Lamb, for instance), I was shocked and horrified. I almost broke my TV, it was a really depressing night.
The media and the rest of us had similar reactions too. In other words, it was pretty clear at the time it was made that the Ross pick was an indefensible one. That it's turned out about as poorly as it could have only intensifies the overall horribleness of it.
And as to all of your reasoning about where Drummond would have gotten his minutes ... I don't buy any of it. We were supposedly a rebuilding team -- you take the best asset and worry about development later. There is nothing else to be said about it. If Drummond had shown the kind of ability he is showing now, then he would have earned his minutes. In others words, it would have been one hell of a "problem" to have.
he wouldnt have. not as nearly as he's gettign in detroit and he's not getting much..15 minutes per night. Drummond was automatically the 3rd best big man coming into training camp for the Pistons, without a single game on his resume, the same can't be said for the Raptors. He'd be the 5th best big man coming into camp (Val is more polished than raw Drummond). That isnt to say he wouldnt have earned his minutes, most likely if he's playing with the demeanor and can-do attitude as he's display right now, he would have received the minutes. However it's really a debatable issue of just assembling the assmebling a raw talent together regardless of position vs drafting a position of need. Granted you can make the argument: this is a rebuilding team; it should always be taking the best talent available however when looking at the raptors at that given time having already 3 young big man + bargnani on your team, it doesn't make sense to add a 5th unless youre just downright hoarding. Hoarding doesnt necessarily end well either. Minnesota and their continual drafting of PGs is a good example of this.
The main point I'm trying to make is two things
1) This is hindsight. it's been done with, we really shouldnt be continually talking about Drummond, when's he's signed to another team as he's not part of ours and if people wishes to do so; they should do it on the Pistons board
2) The Drummond pick is a gamble just like any other pick. Ross, like Drummond, is an asset and a rookie. Drummond's ceiling may be higher but he presents the same gamble as any other player of panning out as Ross can potentially be just as good as Drummond in the long run (no one can really determine that until both of their careers are over and done with). Unlike Araujo, who proved he's absolutely useless from the start, Ross has shown a variety of tools and athleticism that almost justifies being picked at 8. At the very moment, right now it looks like Drummond seems to have the better outlook. Should we be crying about it? No. Did we gamble on the wrong player? That's not to be determined yet. Would Drummond look nice in a Raptor uniform? Absolutely but he's not. He's a piston. lets talk about our players on this board.
I don't really get it. Ross hasnt proved he's a bust. he's shown flashes of brilliance out there. Are we really infactuated and obsessed with Drummond to the point where we're focused more on his growth than our own? Let's take into accoutn what you've stated about the whole "top 8 talent" coming into the draft. Again as I stated in #2, it doesnt mean they will pan out. Tyrus Thomas. bismack Biyombo. Jerryd Bayless, Randy Foye, all top talents coming into the draft who hasnt panned out the way they were supposed to be. Jerryed Bayless in particular is a similar case to Drummond. He was the top PG prospect coming into the draft yet team after team passed up on him although he was the top PG talent coming into the draft. Was the potential there in Bayless? Absolutely! The man could ball and we saw that in his time here in Toronto. However he hasnt lived it up and the gamble that Portland took on him failed, because that's how the draft works.
There are plenty of justifications on why we should have picked Drummond but just as many justification on why we shouldnt have. They're both equally valid and raises good points where you can't redeem one side being more justified/logical than the other. Although we may still have a short-sighted piss poor GM, choosing one side in this case does not make a person any more or less moronic unless there's concrete evidence to show that there was truly a illogical/irrational reason to choose player X over Y.
And also basically hillbilly hare stated in his post; people in this board have to start acting like actual fans instead of people running around with pitchforks looking for an issue to riot on.
As for what hare stated about whether Drummond would do well in Toronto or not. It's purely speculation, and that's not something you can determine. there's equal chance of him doing well here as well as him failing horribly.
Apologies if I'm not making sense here and there, its 4am. and wanted to make this post before going to sleep.