Harden may be coming here?

[ejftw]

I’d rather give up draft assets than Mann. If we’re gonna trade for a good old timer, we need to maximize our chances now.

But will Lue finally trust Mann...if not, keep the picks.

I have a feeling this is going to be pending on the finding of a third team that will give up some sort of an asset for Zu, as Philly has no need for him.

[esqtvd]

I’d rather give up draft assets than Mann. If we’re gonna trade for a good old timer, we need to maximize our chances now.

Well, it seems moot because Mann is not gonna get you Harden. Maybe he could start somewhere else, but on the Sixers he's no more than a backup. Zu too. Morey needs picks. Hell, at least Powell is a bona fide 6th man candidate who's topped 16 ppg four times.

And I don't see how Ballmer can part with any more draft capital just for a shot-in-the-dark rental like Harden. Because the problem isn't just the picks themselves, it's the Stepien Rule, which freezes the picks in the years surrounding the ones you traded. Another 4 years of that?

[Wammy Giveaway]

9:00 PM Pacific Coast Time. That's 12:00 AM Eastern Coast Time. The new CBA is officially in effect.

Clippers have missed out on trading for superstar James Harden under old CBA. Now they will be forced to send out even more players to get him.

Clippers will have to punt the season with the roster as is, accept the penalties and wait a few years as dead lottery team. Or, take the hit by trading some pieces to recoup draft capital and be a lottery team for a few years.

They're stuck.

[TrueLAfan]

^^This. We just went from about 50-50 on making a major deal to about 90-10 against it. The new CBA constrains us/teams like us significantly.

I think the Eric Gordon release kinda foreshadowed this. He's a guy that only would have provided a (possible) plus for a year or two, at an above market average price that ballooned into a massive financial hit because of the luxury tax apron(s).

We're not out of the trade market yet, but the likelihood is smaller. OTOH, I think the chances of something I've suspected might happen have increased. I think the other thing we've done--the release of commentary that we may not be willing to pay full max extension money to PG and Kawhi (which I think is a total team leak) will end up with at least one if not both of them renegotiating their deals after this season to a deal that includes 2024/5. I could see a request to being--look, we can't give you the max with the injury issues. We just can't. Maybe you'll find someone who will back up the money truck for you--maybe you won't. But we can offer 4 years/$156 million--with salary drops each year. $45 million, $41 million, $38 million, $35 million, with a player option/$10 million buyout in the fourth year. It's kinda similar to what CP3 did in Phoenix, and that helped that team build substantially. The thing is, those dropping salary deals make the final years of the deal a much easier pay pill to swallow, or trade off. The way the cap is rising, an MLE salary will be nearer $20 million than $15 million in a couple of years. If we don't do a deal now, I think one or both of PG13 and Kawhi will be offered deals like that.

[Captain Ballmer]

^^This. We just went from about 50-50 on making a major deal to about 90-10 against it. The new CBA constrains us/teams like us significantly.

I think the Eric Gordon release kinda foreshadowed this. He's a guy that only would have provided a (possible) plus for a year or two, at an above market average price that ballooned into a massive financial hit because of the luxury tax apron(s).

We're not out of the trade market yet, but the likelihood is smaller. OTOH, I think the chances of something I've suspected might happen have increased. I think the other thing we've done--the release of commentary that we may not be willing to pay full max extension money to PG and Kawhi (which I think is a total team leak) will end up with at least one if not both of them renegotiating their deals after this season to a deal that includes 2024/5. I could see a request to being--look, we can't give you the max with the injury issues. We just can't. Maybe you'll find someone who will back up the money truck for you--maybe you won't. But we can offer 4 years/$156 million--with salary drops each year. $45 million, $41 million, $38 million, $35 million, with a player option/$10 million buyout in the fourth year. It's kinda similar to what CP3 did in Phoenix, and that helped that team build substantially. The thing is, those dropping salary deals make the final years of the deal a much easier pay pill to swallow, or trade off. The way the cap is rising, an MLE salary will be nearer $20 million than $15 million in a couple of years. If we don't do a deal now, I think one or both of PG13 and Kawhi will be offered deals like that.

But otoh, at best 3rd option guys like FVV getting 43 million per year fully guaranteed. Doubt they will accept to take back seat like Kyrie does with their "clean" public image.

[TrueLAfan]

^^This. We just went from about 50-50 on making a major deal to about 90-10 against it. The new CBA constrains us/teams like us significantly.

I think the Eric Gordon release kinda foreshadowed this. He's a guy that only would have provided a (possible) plus for a year or two, at an above market average price that ballooned into a massive financial hit because of the luxury tax apron(s).

We're not out of the trade market yet, but the likelihood is smaller. OTOH, I think the chances of something I've suspected might happen have increased. I think the other thing we've done--the release of commentary that we may not be willing to pay full max extension money to PG and Kawhi (which I think is a total team leak) will end up with at least one if not both of them renegotiating their deals after this season to a deal that includes 2024/5. I could see a request to being--look, we can't give you the max with the injury issues. We just can't. Maybe you'll find someone who will back up the money truck for you--maybe you won't. But we can offer 4 years/$156 million--with salary drops each year. $45 million, $41 million, $38 million, $35 million, with a player option/$10 million buyout in the fourth year. It's kinda similar to what CP3 did in Phoenix, and that helped that team build substantially. The thing is, those dropping salary deals make the final years of the deal a much easier pay pill to swallow, or trade off. The way the cap is rising, an MLE salary will be nearer $20 million than $15 million in a couple of years. If we don't do a deal now, I think one or both of PG13 and Kawhi will be offered deals like that.

But otoh, at best 3rd option guys like FVV getting 43 million per year fully guaranteed. Doubt they will accept to take back seat like Kyrie does with their "clean" public image.

Yes and no. I think I might start a thread here (or on the General Board) about paying players who play and the new pay scaling factors. Fred VanVleet has a lousy midrange game, but he consistently plays 80% of his team’s games and plays 35+ minutes. He’s a good defender, very good perimeter shooter, plays well without the ball, and doesn’t make mistakes as a very good passing guard. He can run your offense fine, thanks—and scores pretty well on top of that. You do that for 65 games a year and put up 19-6.5-4 as a starter, you’re going to get big coin at 29. He’s not my favorite player or type of player, but he’s an Ime Udoka type player.

But I think the new TV contract is going to keep pumping up salaries for a while, and I do see the point that there will start to be more separation between MLE players (13-15 million a year) and max players. I think there will start to 3-4 levels between those groups:

This is starting to play out. Jerami Grant is a very good player. Max player? No. Injury risk? Yup. Young/In Prime? Yup. He’s getting $30 million a year. Chris Paul—Max player who is old and is an injury risk. Also a $30 million guy. Khris Middleton? Borderline max guy who is younger but actually a greater injury concern. Also around $30 million. Players have always been paid on ability and potential; more and more, they will be getting paid on how much they’re actually playing. That’s what I think management will tell Paul George and Kawhi Leonard, anyway.

[KL2]

It’s hard being patient. I’m the worst at it. From what I’m reading/understanding is the Harden trade is even more likely now. It gets tougher sure but it’ll get done.

[PeteyPablo]

Lilard on the trade block

[KL2]

Of course Clippers are interested.

They seem to be more interested than doing.

[MartinToVaught]

They're "interested" in anything other than drafting, scouting, developing players... in other words, the things you need to do to actually win.

[ejftw]

Think the Dame news and the "interest" in him, which we know is impossible to go for, considering the land of assets, might make Harden more likely of a target.

[Bobbymcgee]

Let me guess, the Clippers are going to trot out the same blue-plate special to Portland for Lillard that they did to the Sixers for Harden.

[PeteyPablo]

I read a report that the Sixers wanted :

Powell
Covington
Brandon Boston
Bones Hyland
Mann

[Roscoe Sheed]

I read a report that the Sixers wanted :

Powell
Covington
Brandon Boston
Bones Hyland
Mann

that's too much- subtract Powell, Hyland, and Mann are solid contributors. The Sixers also need to take Morris

[og15]

^^This. We just went from about 50-50 on making a major deal to about 90-10 against it. The new CBA constrains us/teams like us significantly.

I think the Eric Gordon release kinda foreshadowed this. He's a guy that only would have provided a (possible) plus for a year or two, at an above market average price that ballooned into a massive financial hit because of the luxury tax apron(s).

We're not out of the trade market yet, but the likelihood is smaller. OTOH, I think the chances of something I've suspected might happen have increased. I think the other thing we've done--the release of commentary that we may not be willing to pay full max extension money to PG and Kawhi (which I think is a total team leak) will end up with at least one if not both of them renegotiating their deals after this season to a deal that includes 2024/5. I could see a request to being--look, we can't give you the max with the injury issues. We just can't. Maybe you'll find someone who will back up the money truck for you--maybe you won't. But we can offer 4 years/$156 million--with salary drops each year. $45 million, $41 million, $38 million, $35 million, with a player option/$10 million buyout in the fourth year. It's kinda similar to what CP3 did in Phoenix, and that helped that team build substantially. The thing is, those dropping salary deals make the final years of the deal a much easier pay pill to swallow, or trade off. The way the cap is rising, an MLE salary will be nearer $20 million than $15 million in a couple of years. If we don't do a deal now, I think one or both of PG13 and Kawhi will be offered deals like that.

But otoh, at best 3rd option guys like FVV getting 43 million per year fully guaranteed. Doubt they will accept to take back seat like Kyrie does with their "clean" public image.

FVV got lucky in terms of when he's a FA and Houstons situation. Houston had way too much cap room. Even with FVV's approximate starting salary and adding their rookies, they have 13 players and are still $13 million below the minimum salary and around $27 million below the salary cap.

Before his signing, their highest paid player was basically an MLE sized contract.

[wakelaunch1]

this is the trade.

https://www.si.com/nba/clippers/news/massive-paul-george-damian-lillard-knicks-three-team-trade-idea

[Wammy Giveaway]

Yes and no. I think I might start a thread here (or on the General Board) about paying players who play and the new pay scaling factors. Fred VanVleet has a lousy midrange game, but he consistently plays 80% of his team’s games and plays 35+ minutes. He’s a good defender, very good perimeter shooter, plays well without the ball, and doesn’t make mistakes as a very good passing guard. He can run your offense fine, thanks—and scores pretty well on top of that. You do that for 65 games a year and put up 19-6.5-4 as a starter, you’re going to get big coin at 29. He’s not my favorite player or type of player, but he’s an Ime Udoka type player.

...

This is starting to play out. Jerami Grant is a very good player. Max player? No. Injury risk? Yup. Young/In Prime? Yup. He’s getting $30 million a year. Chris Paul—Max player who is old and is an injury risk. Also a $30 million guy. Khris Middleton? Borderline max guy who is younger but actually a greater injury concern. Also around $30 million. Players have always been paid on ability and potential; more and more, they will be getting paid on how much they’re actually playing. That’s what I think management will tell Paul George and Kawhi Leonard, anyway.

Will this post also judge if the player's contract value is too high, too low or just right, and if it's one of the extremes, suggest a proper value and how it affects the team (like did overpaying a player put them over an apron, forcing team to surrender a player for salary dumping purposes)? Let's circle back to VanVleet in your example: was he paid right or wrong (over or under)? If the latter, what should have been his actual value, and will the Rockets have to give up something in order to satisfy the deal? Perhaps a lesser value would have prevented losing players, such as a rumored trade involving K.J. Martin.

[KL2]

Would appreciate any updates as they come as Twitter is no longer an option.

Same with the other thread.

[mttwlsn16]

Would appreciate any updates as they come as Twitter is no longer an option.

Same with the other thread.

Yup Twitter and BR both ruined, since BR no longer shows tweets.

Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

[wakelaunch1]

Would appreciate any updates as they come as Twitter is no longer an option.

Same with the other thread.

Yup Twitter and BR both ruined, since BR no longer shows tweets.

Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

elon has trashed one of the greatest social media sites. He stopped paying the bills, lost all the marketing revenue and cut most of the staff. I cant wait till there is an alternative.