ItsDanger wrote:
Is it wrong that I have him thinking "what kind of basketball game is this"?
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ItsDanger wrote:

GreatWhiteStiff wrote:ItsDanger wrote:
Is it wrong that I have him thinking "what kind of basketball game is this"?
sbsat wrote:No one is saying the people who play hockey are inherently racist, but the entire system and culture (a by product of years and years) is exclusionary along the lines of race. Its also acceptable to do racist things, because when your in the system, no one knows any better.
Why is there lack of diversity in the league? Explain it. The immigrant population in Canada and the Northern States of the USA have wealth. You can no longer peg it to affordability. I also know people with young kids (coloured south asian) who say their kids were never made to feel they "fit in" when they tried hockey.
Lastly, I should say I grew up a leafs fan even though my parents could never afford to put me in hockey. My eyes were opened in my first year of university when my roomate (who played hockey in the OHL) exposed me to the racist underbelly of hockey. He would often make very insensitive jokes about black people and indians and when I would confront him he would say this is how we would talk in the locker room. Hes not racist, he just didn't know any better.
Los_29 wrote:Hockey players have refused to wear LGBT themed jerseys because of “religious” beliefs. Has that happened in other sports as frequently as it has in hockey? Just seems like hockey hasn’t progressed as much as the other sports. Even something like fighting took way too long to phase out. It’s also the only sport in the world where its players can’t tolerate losing and resort to fighting and cheap shots towards the end of the game. It’s mainly comprised of adults that haven’t grown up yet. Lol. With that said I enjoy watching playoff hockey when the Leafs are in it.
Hockey has had a lot of serious issues come to light the past few years. Hopefully they take the necessary steps to prevent these issues from happening in the future. I am encouraged with some of the things they have been doing recently to try and bring more diversity to the sport. But the harsh reality is it’s a game of privilege and that is why you have an alarming number of players with fathers who played in the NHL.
GQStylin wrote:sbsat wrote:No one is saying the people who play hockey are inherently racist, but the entire system and culture (a by product of years and years) is exclusionary along the lines of race. Its also acceptable to do racist things, because when your in the system, no one knows any better.
Please show me PROOF of this to be true? You're taking some incidents of racism in hockey and painting the narrative that this is a widespread issue. I've said repeatedly that pretty much all these incidents of racism happened in the minor leagues and that no player in the NHL has been accused and proven to be saying anything racist on the ice during a game.
Also again I ask why aren't people like you making this same deep dive analysis of other sports like baseball, basketball and football who are also greatly lacking diversity especially Asian diversity. The NFL and NBA are mostly black and white players and baseball only has mostly Japanese and Korean imports with very few North American born Asian players in their league. Why aren't you spot lighting that lack of diversity the same way you're doing it for hockey?Why is there lack of diversity in the league? Explain it. The immigrant population in Canada and the Northern States of the USA have wealth. You can no longer peg it to affordability. I also know people with young kids (coloured south asian) who say their kids were never made to feel they "fit in" when they tried hockey.
The answer is likely most minority kids either grow up having little interest in playing hockey to begin with and/or they have little interest in playing it at a high level the same reason why you don't find many minority kids playing in the NBA and NFL. Again you have BILLIONS of Asian people in the world and yet there's barely any playing in the NBA and NFL. Why is that? Are those sports not inclusive and racist as well? Or is the more drama free and simple answer is that Asian kids have no interest and/or aren't capable of reaching the highest levels of those sports because of not enough skill and/or not having the physical abilities to do so?
Go through the entire list of Olympic sports and you'll see plenty of events that are almost completely devoid of black athletes competing in them. Go through the list again and you'll see plenty of events that are almost completely devoid of Asian athletes. Does this mean that some sports are hugely racist towards black people and other sports are hugely racist towards Asian people or maybe, JUST MAYBE Asians and blacks have different preferences as to which sports they enjoy and are good at and want to pursue at a high level?
I guess to people like you, this is just rampant racism and intolerance at work that every sport isn't massively diverse while to me to me the above is a logical explanation as to why some sports are dominated by some race/ethnic groups and other sports are dominated by other race/ethnic groups with little to no racist/discrimination/intolerant aspect to it at all.Lastly, I should say I grew up a leafs fan even though my parents could never afford to put me in hockey. My eyes were opened in my first year of university when my roomate (who played hockey in the OHL) exposed me to the racist underbelly of hockey. He would often make very insensitive jokes about black people and indians and when I would confront him he would say this is how we would talk in the locker room. Hes not racist, he just didn't know any better.
Back in the day before the SJW movement went into full crazy mode, making racial and insensitive jokes was often just that. IE banter between friends. If these people actually disliked some if not all minorities and mistreated them in everyday life then that would be a problem and a different story. Years ago simply making racial and offensive jokes among friends didn't make you racist. Tons of famous comedians in the 80s and 90s had plenty of racist and offensive jokes in their acts and no one took issue with it. It wasn't until the SJW movement really got going did comedians who it was long understood were allowed to push boundaries in what they could say were reigned in and mostly brought under control because a relative small number of people felt it was 'too offensive'.
Charles Barley probably said it best when he made it clear that while saying racist, intolerant and offensive things in public wasn't acceptable that he wouldn't ever stop doing so among his own friends and in his private life because that's his business. The problem with the SJW movement is that they want to regulate EVERYTHING you say ANYWHERE. Well for white people anyways because we've never seen black or native people be censored or disciplined much for all the offensive things they say because apparently supposed 'victim groups' can say whatever they like still and not face much if any backlash. Rules for thee and not for me of course.
maternal85 wrote:No need wasting your time. He's clearly a racist that enjoys his privilege.
Even when you put facts in their face, they'll still gaslight you. I remember getting tickets to an NHL game. First hockey game ever. Me and my little brother were literally getting dirty looks. Like "what are they doing here". If you're a minority, you know the look I'm talking about. You couldn't pay me to attend another NHL game. I definitely would have followed the league more and got into if the culture was more accepting.
The socio economic excuse is not legit anymore. A lot of visible minorities are doing very well; especially 1st, 2nd, etc generation. They can afford to put their kids in hockey, but they choose not too. The racism is too much. My friends who are professionals and make well over 6 figures, refuse to put their kids in hockey. Money is not an issue either.
I don't think I've ever seen Nav at a hockey game. Not just as a guest appearance too. Him being there because he legit wants to be there.
sbsat wrote:Dude again can you consider condensing your rhoughts this is crazy. The nba isn't basketball. I beleive there are leagues thriving in china, Philippines and other parts of asia..m these peoplem are playing the sport. Baseball, look at Korea, japan, DR,mexico, cuba, etc etc etc.... The sport is being played and thriving. Where do you see this with hockey?? This is silly
Los_29 wrote:Hockey players have refused to wear LGBT themed jerseys because of “religious” beliefs. Has that happened in other sports as frequently as it has in hockey? Just seems like hockey hasn’t progressed as much as the other sports. Even something like fighting took way too long to phase out. It’s also the only sport in the world where its players can’t tolerate losing and resort to fighting and cheap shots towards the end of the game. It’s mainly comprised of adults that haven’t grown up yet. Lol. With that said I enjoy watching playoff hockey when the Leafs are in it.
Hockey has had a lot of serious issues come to light the past few years. Hopefully they take the necessary steps to prevent these issues from happening in the future. I am encouraged with some of the things they have been doing recently to try and bring more diversity to the sport. But the harsh reality is it’s a game of privilege and that is why you have an alarming number of players with fathers who played in the NHL.
GQStylin wrote:sbsat wrote:Dude again can you consider condensing your rhoughts this is crazy. The nba isn't basketball. I beleive there are leagues thriving in china, Philippines and other parts of asia..m these peoplem are playing the sport. Baseball, look at Korea, japan, DR,mexico, cuba, etc etc etc.... The sport is being played and thriving. Where do you see this with hockey?? This is silly
I'm sorry but often I have alot to say on certain issues and try as I might to condense things it still comes out as a rather long response. I would hope that if you're interested in a serious discussion that taking an extra 30 seconds or a minute to read what I've written isn't too much of a burden.
As for basketball the highest level of play is the NBA and its there where we see almost no diversity in its athletes the same as we see very little diversity in the NHL. You seem to only attribute that lack of diversity in the NHL to racism/intolerance and lack of inclusion while I attribute it to much more logical and reasonable explanations which again being lack of interest, lack of skill and/or physical abilities.
If you're going to say the NHL isn't diverse for racism reasons, then why shouldn't we attribute the lack of diversity in the NBA to the same and say they're also not very tolerant and inclusive?
Also ice hockey is being played in a number of nations around the world, just that they almost all happen to be predominately white nations in Europe with a little bit of interest in a few nations in Asia. So hockey is a popular sport in the world, just not as popular and widespread as other sports, but you could say that for the majority of Olympic sports as well where only certain nations are really serious about certain sports while displaying zero interest in others. And lets be real. Soccer is the ONLY single sport that you can truly say is a global and diverse sport that reaches all corners of the planet. Any other sport pales in comparison in its reach.
ATLTimekeeper wrote:You need ice rinks to play ice hockey. It's not rocket science. The barrier to entry for hockey as a pastime is much higher. Basically take the easiest athletic skill, like running, and remove that from the sport entirely because there's no running in hockey. There's no throwing, no catching, no kicking. All basic skills that are taught toddlers. It's a complicated sport to play with a lot of equipment required, and I can see why it wouldn't catch on as a popular pastime aside from places where there's frozen water in the winter.

sbsat wrote:ATLTimekeeper wrote:You need ice rinks to play ice hockey. It's not rocket science. The barrier to entry for hockey as a pastime is much higher. Basically take the easiest athletic skill, like running, and remove that from the sport entirely because there's no running in hockey. There's no throwing, no catching, no kicking. All basic skills that are taught toddlers. It's a complicated sport to play with a lot of equipment required, and I can see why it wouldn't catch on as a popular pastime aside from places where there's frozen water in the winter.
Keep drinking that kool aid. North america has 2nd,3rd and beyond generations of coloured people and they somehow get filtered out of the sport. Underrepresented at all levels. Also do you have stats on grassroots engagement of this populous in the sport? Also have you watched black ice, a first hand account of lingering anti black racism from pk subban himself and based on a written book?
Drink that kool aid!
apologies. My disdain for hockey has me on tiltATLTimekeeper wrote:sbsat wrote:ATLTimekeeper wrote:You need ice rinks to play ice hockey. It's not rocket science. The barrier to entry for hockey as a pastime is much higher. Basically take the easiest athletic skill, like running, and remove that from the sport entirely because there's no running in hockey. There's no throwing, no catching, no kicking. All basic skills that are taught toddlers. It's a complicated sport to play with a lot of equipment required, and I can see why it wouldn't catch on as a popular pastime aside from places where there's frozen water in the winter.
Keep drinking that kool aid. North america has 2nd,3rd and beyond generations of coloured people and they somehow get filtered out of the sport. Underrepresented at all levels. Also do you have stats on grassroots engagement of this populous in the sport? Also have you watched black ice, a first hand account of lingering anti black racism from pk subban himself and based on a written book?
Drink that kool aid!
What kool aid am I drinking? I was responding to your comment about why there aren't pro hockey leagues in places like South America and Africa. There's no question that racism in hockey is a barrier as well.

ItsDanger wrote:Los_29 wrote:Hockey players have refused to wear LGBT themed jerseys because of “religious” beliefs. Has that happened in other sports as frequently as it has in hockey? Just seems like hockey hasn’t progressed as much as the other sports. Even something like fighting took way too long to phase out. It’s also the only sport in the world where its players can’t tolerate losing and resort to fighting and cheap shots towards the end of the game. It’s mainly comprised of adults that haven’t grown up yet. Lol. With that said I enjoy watching playoff hockey when the Leafs are in it.
Hockey has had a lot of serious issues come to light the past few years. Hopefully they take the necessary steps to prevent these issues from happening in the future. I am encouraged with some of the things they have been doing recently to try and bring more diversity to the sport. But the harsh reality is it’s a game of privilege and that is why you have an alarming number of players with fathers who played in the NHL.
LOL, define privilege. NBA has a height privilege as an example. You're limiting privilege to one variable. No shock there.
Bet you've never played contact sports in your life to complain about end of game fights.
sbsat wrote:This is not rocket science. Im talking about the sport you keep focusing on the leagues. Im focusing on the sport. There is no argument to be made that hockey isnt the least diverse of the major sports. Ask yourself why. There is so much of what you are saying is patently false. There are majoy basket ball leagues in europe, north america, asia, latin america, oceania and now africa is next. I honestly dont think i can continue dialogue with someone so blind.. that or you have an inability to to seperate league from sport.