Breaking: Rogers Aquires Bell Stake In MLSE

[Raps in 4]

Lets see if they decide to spend money on payroll

Me too, but all major nations control their own Telco, for good reason. They are all state run Oligopolies, and can charge whatever.

Pay roll in basketball is only relevant for teams trying to retain talent. We're not at the point where it matters yet.

My bigger issue with Rogers is how they manage their sports teams. Ed wants yes-men running his teams, not competent executives. He's a menace.

[ForeverTFC]

Who do you guys think will be replacing Masai? Who is the Mark Shapiro of the NBA? Someone with decades of experience running another franchise into the ground.

It that Danny Ferry's music?

As a bonus, he and Ed could bond over how Masai has "more than a little African in him"...

[Raps in 4]

Lets see if they decide to spend money on payroll

Me too, but all major nations control their own Telco, for good reason. They are all state run Oligopolies, and can charge whatever.

And yet we pay some of the highest rates in the world. If the government can block competition in the industry, they can also regulate prices (and need to, because competition won't).

[Mr Funk]

Do you want us to pretend this didn’t happen:

Edward Rogers actively fought plans to keep Masai Ujiri as head of the Toronto Raptors this summer — saying that he was not worth the amount offered — and then tried to extract an extraordinary benefit for his own company, the Star has learned.

To the relief of fans, the ploy by Rogers was unsuccessful, and the Raptors announced on Aug. 5 that Ujiri was staying on in Toronto as vice chairman and president of basketball operations.

However, new details have emerged suggesting that behind the scenes Edward Rogers tried to sabotage a high-performing executive with whom he had grown disenchanted — and ultimately failed in his bid because he appeared not to fully understand the governance structure of the NBA franchise.

https://www.thestar.com/business/edward-rogers-fought-plans-to-keep-raptors-masai-ujiri-but-was-thwarted-by-mlse-head/article_2abb5319-c18e-583b-9924-7da418c9680a.html

Or that Roger’s didn’t March Grange out as their chief propaganda correspondent to preview Ed’s takeover plans just last season?

Watch on YouTube

I'm not asking nor expecting anyone "to pretend this didn't happen" That story incidentally was reported by Doug no sources Smith and Christine Dobby, a business correspondent. Do either of them have deeply embedded and knowledgable sources within the organization? Probably not. Is Ed Rogers a blustering buffoon who could potentially mess around with the inner-workings of the Raptors organization, royally pissing off fans and therefore setting the franchise back with considerable damage? Certainly. Rogers is odious and the worst kind of bourgeois. However, unlike the over-the-top negative and panic prone tendencies of the contributors on this board, I'm not going to take the proverbial "omg panic!" bait of the prior Doug Smith reporting, plus the sensational negative panic narratives forming in this thread being spun by the negative and panic prone contributors.

[Raps in 4]

Do you want us to pretend this didn’t happen:

Edward Rogers actively fought plans to keep Masai Ujiri as head of the Toronto Raptors this summer — saying that he was not worth the amount offered — and then tried to extract an extraordinary benefit for his own company, the Star has learned.

To the relief of fans, the ploy by Rogers was unsuccessful, and the Raptors announced on Aug. 5 that Ujiri was staying on in Toronto as vice chairman and president of basketball operations.

However, new details have emerged suggesting that behind the scenes Edward Rogers tried to sabotage a high-performing executive with whom he had grown disenchanted — and ultimately failed in his bid because he appeared not to fully understand the governance structure of the NBA franchise.

https://www.thestar.com/business/edward-rogers-fought-plans-to-keep-raptors-masai-ujiri-but-was-thwarted-by-mlse-head/article_2abb5319-c18e-583b-9924-7da418c9680a.html

Or that Roger’s didn’t March Grange out as their chief propaganda correspondent to preview Ed’s takeover plans just last season?

Watch on YouTube

I'm not asking nor expecting anyone "to pretend this didn't happen" That story incidentally was reported by Doug no sources Smith and Christine Dobby, a business correspondent. Do either of them have deeply embedded and knowledgable sources within the organization? Probably not. Is Ed Rogers a blustering buffoon who could potentially mess around with the inner-workings of the Raptors organization, royally pissing off fans and therefore setting the franchise back? Certainly. However, unlike the over-the-top negative and panic prone tendencies of the contributors on this board, I'm not going to take the proverbial "omg panic!" bait of the prior sensationalist "reporting", plus the sensational negative panic narratives forming in this thread being spun by the negative and panic prone contributors. Sorry, but you can all go on and on and on, telling one another that you know everything and have all of the answers, but I'm not biting.

Was this also a "sensationalist" piece? https://torontosun.com/2015/01/23/the-inside-story-on-how-rogers-tried-to-replace-blue-jays-president-paul-beeston

Or this? https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/rogers-family-court-docs-1.6226342

The guy is a **** menace. We shouldn't want him anywhere near our sports teams.

[Mr Funk]

Do you want us to pretend this didn’t happen:

https://www.thestar.com/business/edward-rogers-fought-plans-to-keep-raptors-masai-ujiri-but-was-thwarted-by-mlse-head/article_2abb5319-c18e-583b-9924-7da418c9680a.html

Or that Roger’s didn’t March Grange out as their chief propaganda correspondent to preview Ed’s takeover plans just last season?

Watch on YouTube

I'm not asking nor expecting anyone "to pretend this didn't happen" That story incidentally was reported by Doug no sources Smith and Christine Dobby, a business correspondent. Do either of them have deeply embedded and knowledgable sources within the organization? Probably not. Is Ed Rogers a blustering buffoon who could potentially mess around with the inner-workings of the Raptors organization, royally pissing off fans and therefore setting the franchise back? Certainly. However, unlike the over-the-top negative and panic prone tendencies of the contributors on this board, I'm not going to take the proverbial "omg panic!" bait of the prior sensationalist "reporting", plus the sensational negative panic narratives forming in this thread being spun by the negative and panic prone contributors. Sorry, but you can all go on and on and on, telling one another that you know everything and have all of the answers, but I'm not biting.

Was this also a "sensationalist" piece? https://torontosun.com/2015/01/23/the-inside-story-on-how-rogers-tried-to-replace-blue-jays-president-paul-beeston

Or this? https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/rogers-family-court-docs-1.6226342

The guy is a **** menace. We shouldn't want him anywhere near our sports teams.

I wasn't finished editing my post and I don't care about baseball, but yes, Ed Rogers is the worst kind of bourgeois.

[Quattro]

Do you want us to pretend this didn’t happen:

Edward Rogers actively fought plans to keep Masai Ujiri as head of the Toronto Raptors this summer — saying that he was not worth the amount offered — and then tried to extract an extraordinary benefit for his own company, the Star has learned.

To the relief of fans, the ploy by Rogers was unsuccessful, and the Raptors announced on Aug. 5 that Ujiri was staying on in Toronto as vice chairman and president of basketball operations.

However, new details have emerged suggesting that behind the scenes Edward Rogers tried to sabotage a high-performing executive with whom he had grown disenchanted — and ultimately failed in his bid because he appeared not to fully understand the governance structure of the NBA franchise.

https://www.thestar.com/business/edward-rogers-fought-plans-to-keep-raptors-masai-ujiri-but-was-thwarted-by-mlse-head/article_2abb5319-c18e-583b-9924-7da418c9680a.html

Or that Roger’s didn’t March Grange out as their chief propaganda correspondent to preview Ed’s takeover plans just last season?

Watch on YouTube

I'm not asking nor expecting anyone "to pretend this didn't happen" That story incidentally was reported by Doug no sources Smith and Christine Dobby, a business correspondent. Do either of them have deeply embedded and knowledgable sources within the organization? Probably not. Is Ed Rogers a blustering buffoon who could potentially mess around with the inner-workings of the Raptors organization, royally pissing off fans and therefore setting the franchise back with considerable damage? Certainly. Rogers is odious and the worst kind of bourgeois. However, unlike the over-the-top negative and panic prone tendencies of the contributors on this board, I'm not going to take the proverbial "omg panic!" bait of the prior Doug Smith reporting, plus the sensational negative panic narratives forming in this thread being spun by the negative and panic prone contributors.

The star wouldn't print accusations like this without a confirmed source. It's the difference between real journalists and the nonsense you get on the internet. So ya, this happened

[Michael Bradley]

The Jays won zero playoff games during that span, and the team got worse each year as it bled talent without replacing the lost production.

The team was built by adding a bunch of free agents (to get butts in seats), while completely neglecting the farm system. The end result is the dumpster fire we have now.

The 2022 team that had the 3rd best record in the AL was built around prospects the team either drafted, signed, or traded for (Vlad, Bo, Kirk, Teoscar, Gurriel, Jansen, Espinal, Manoah, Romano). They supplemented that talent with veterans like Gausman, Springer, Chapman, etc, but the core of that team was at least equal parts homegrown, if not more. The issue with subsequent teams (2023 in particular) was regression of that young talent, for one reason or another, as well as not being able to produce a 2nd wave of talent from the minors to add on to the existing one. That's on player development, scouting, coaching, bad luck, etc. There's clearly an issue somewhere there, which is why I believe player development and at the very least Atkins needs to be replaced.

The best Jays team of that era was the 2021 iteration that featured two MVP-level position players (Vladdy and Semien). The team then lost Semien and his 6.0 fWAR the following year without replacing his production. It has been a downhill ride since.

They essentially replaced Semien with Chapman, and if you look at fWAR, Chapman had a 3.9 WAR in 2022 versus 4.4 for Semien, with Chapman being the better offensive player based on wRC+/OPS+ that year. Considering Semien signed for 7/175 with Texas, I'm not sure what counter the Jays could have realistically done to get him to stay considering the tax differences. To get two years of Chapman as a replacement (for practically nothing) was a solid outcome.

The biggest reason the 2023 team disappointed was because Vlad/Bo/Kirk/Manoah/Jansen/Espinal went from a combined 21.5 fWAR in 2022 to a combined 9.1 fWAR in 2023. They still won 89 games in spite of that but it should have been a lot more.

Three of the players in that young core (Valddy, Jansen, Romano), were drafted/signed by the previous FO. This current FO has done a piss poor job of identifying and developing young talent.

Yes and no. I thought the team did a good job with player development early on in their tenure, but it got progressively worse over time, especially since 2023. Keep in mind Romano was a failed starter, and Jansen hit .206 in A ball when Shapiro was hired. Teoscar was raw as hell when he got to Toronto and eventually turned into a legitimate middle of the order bat. They did decent things early on, but have definitely gotten away from that in the last few years.

Rogers fired AA the same season the team went to the ALCS. He also tried to fire Masai right after the championship season. Ed is the furthest thing from a rational owner.

AA's contract was up, he wasn't fired. Not sure about the Rogers/Masai stuff since I wasn't really paying attention to it at the time. I think what Masai has done post title has been pretty subpar, depending on how involved he was in the day to day. If Ed tried to fire him right after the title, then yes, Ed was out of his mind.

[D.Brasco]

Almost don't want to support this team with how trash their owner is.

[Anticon]

Do you want us to pretend this didn’t happen:

Edward Rogers actively fought plans to keep Masai Ujiri as head of the Toronto Raptors this summer — saying that he was not worth the amount offered — and then tried to extract an extraordinary benefit for his own company, the Star has learned.

To the relief of fans, the ploy by Rogers was unsuccessful, and the Raptors announced on Aug. 5 that Ujiri was staying on in Toronto as vice chairman and president of basketball operations.

However, new details have emerged suggesting that behind the scenes Edward Rogers tried to sabotage a high-performing executive with whom he had grown disenchanted — and ultimately failed in his bid because he appeared not to fully understand the governance structure of the NBA franchise.

https://www.thestar.com/business/edward-rogers-fought-plans-to-keep-raptors-masai-ujiri-but-was-thwarted-by-mlse-head/article_2abb5319-c18e-583b-9924-7da418c9680a.html

Or that Roger’s didn’t March Grange out as their chief propaganda correspondent to preview Ed’s takeover plans just last season?

Watch on YouTube

I'm not asking nor expecting anyone "to pretend this didn't happen" That story incidentally was reported by Doug no sources Smith and Christine Dobby, a business correspondent. Do either of them have deeply embedded and knowledgable sources within the organization? Probably not. Is Ed Rogers a blustering buffoon who could potentially mess around with the inner-workings of the Raptors organization, royally pissing off fans and therefore setting the franchise back with considerable damage? Certainly. Rogers is odious and the worst kind of bourgeois. However, unlike the over-the-top negative and panic prone tendencies of the contributors on this board, I'm not going to take the proverbial "omg panic!" bait of the prior Doug Smith reporting, plus the sensational negative panic narratives forming in this thread being spun by the negative and panic prone contributors.

It isn't panic. It's resignation and acceptance. We know exactly how Rogers operates.

They are threatened by success and people with ambition and vision. The Blue Jays have been the most pointless moribund team for decades.

I'll happily eat crow if I'm wrong, but there is a real track record that suggests this will go similarly.

[WuTang_CMB]

video of the putz
https://www.sportsnet.ca/nhl/article/rogers-mlse-deal-a-seismic-shift-for-canadian-sports/

"That unholy alliance of two competing telcos and then a minority shareholder (Tanenbaum) being the face of the entire organization was always difficult … A streamlined governance is the way to go," said Brian Cooper, a former MLSE vice-president who is chairman of the MKTG Canada sponsorship agency.

goat speaks on it

Former MLSE president and CEO Tim Leiweke says the proposed sale "uncomplicates life and decision-making." He calls it "a very good deal for MLSE, for the partners but especially the fans."

Leiweke says Edward Rogers, whom he enjoyed working for, has the resources "to do whatever they've got to do to be competitive and to grow."

"And that gives (MLSE president Keith Pelley) and the rest of that organization huge resources, without debate. That's a good day."

Leiweke, who is president of the Oak View Group, also sees it as positive for Bell.

"They made a good deal. They had to protect their shareholders. They made them a ton of money and it's really brilliant on their part. Because they're a public company. So they have to be about return on investment."

Bell said it plans to use proceeds of the sale "towards reducing debt levels and to support its ongoing transformation from telco to techco with a focus on core growth drivers."

Pelley, in a short statement, said MLSE "has been fortunate to have one of the very best ownership groups in sports and entertainment for many years and it has led to MLSE becoming one of the leading organizations in our industry."

"As an organization, we are grateful for their contributions, and we remain fully focused on our priorities and further driving a championship mentality across MLSE.”

“He (Edward Rogers) is on his way to creating one company that controls all of the sports assets,” one insider with knowledge of the situation said. “You could see that company – with the MLSE holdings and the Blue Jays – spun into a separate company from Rogers, and then (Edward) going after an NFL team for Toronto. At that point, he’d be largest sports owner in the world. It would be his legacy.”

[ciueli]

Of course there’s a random debate about the Chicago Bulls happening in this thread for some reason.

It has something to do with people needing to denigrate other franchises to make themselves feel better about their own. It's funny to me because the Bulls have an almost identical record to us over the past four seasons, but somehow they're poorly run and we aren't.

2020-2021: Bulls 31-41, Raptors 27-45
2021-2022: Bulls 46-36, Raptors 48-34
2022-2023: Bulls 40-42, Raptors 41-41 (and they beat us in the play-in in a game that will haunt our dreams forever)
2023-2024: Bulls 39-43, Raptors 25-57

[Quattro]

Of course there’s a random debate about the Chicago Bulls happening in this thread for some reason.

It has something to do with people needing to denigrate other franchises to make themselves feel better about their own. It's funny to me because the Bulls have an almost identical record to us over the past four seasons, but somehow they're poorly run and we aren't.

2020-2021: Bulls 31-41, Raptors 27-45
2021-2022: Bulls 46-36, Raptors 48-34
2022-2023: Bulls 40-42, Raptors 41-41 (and they beat us in the play-in in a game that will haunt our dreams forever)
2023-2024: Bulls 39-43, Raptors 25-57

Now go back another 10 years. What happens to your analysis?

[ciueli]

Of course there’s a random debate about the Chicago Bulls happening in this thread for some reason.

It has something to do with people needing to denigrate other franchises to make themselves feel better about their own. It's funny to me because the Bulls have an almost identical record to us over the past four seasons, but somehow they're poorly run and we aren't.

2020-2021: Bulls 31-41, Raptors 27-45
2021-2022: Bulls 46-36, Raptors 48-34
2022-2023: Bulls 40-42, Raptors 41-41 (and they beat us in the play-in in a game that will haunt our dreams forever)
2023-2024: Bulls 39-43, Raptors 25-57

Now go back another 10 years. What happens to your analysis?

Joe Dumars won a title in Detroit and came very close to winning a second one the next season, had a much better post-title run with his team than Masai has had here and they still canned him when they went through too many losing seasons. That's the way it works, what you've done recently is far more important than what you did a decade ago.

[batman54]

Wow. Teddy may be the least inspirational owner of of a massive business that I've ever seen.
I'm actually happy we don't hear from him much.
On the Masia front, he did a great job for a number of year, but really seems to have checked out for a few as well.
I won't mind if there's a change there at this point, but it shouldn't be Webster.

[ForeverTFC]

It has something to do with people needing to denigrate other franchises to make themselves feel better about their own. It's funny to me because the Bulls have an almost identical record to us over the past four seasons, but somehow they're poorly run and we aren't.

2020-2021: Bulls 31-41, Raptors 27-45
2021-2022: Bulls 46-36, Raptors 48-34
2022-2023: Bulls 40-42, Raptors 41-41 (and they beat us in the play-in in a game that will haunt our dreams forever)
2023-2024: Bulls 39-43, Raptors 25-57

Now go back another 10 years. What happens to your analysis?

Joe Dumars won a title in Detroit and came very close to winning a second one the next season, had a much better post-title run with his team than Masai has had here and they still canned him when they went through too many losing seasons. That's the way it works, what you've done recently is far more important than what you did a decade ago.

You should be embarrassed by your takes.

[ciueli]

Now go back another 10 years. What happens to your analysis?

Joe Dumars won a title in Detroit and came very close to winning a second one the next season, had a much better post-title run with his team than Masai has had here and they still canned him when they went through too many losing seasons. That's the way it works, what you've done recently is far more important than what you did a decade ago.

You should be embarrassed by your takes.

Dumars went 5 straight seasons with the Pistons missing the playoffs and was gone, Masai has missed the playoffs in 3 of the last 4 seasons and quite likely will miss it 5 of the last 6 by the time his contract is up with the way this team is headed. In some ways Dumars was more successful with the Pistons than Masai has been with the Raptors.

[Badonkadonk]

AA's contract was up, he wasn't fired. Not sure about the Rogers/Masai stuff since I wasn't really paying attention to it at the time. I think what Masai has done post title has been pretty subpar, depending on how involved he was in the day to day. If Ed tried to fire him right after the title, then yes, Ed was out of his mind.

The AA contract comment is disingenuous, yes it was up but the offer was for Alex to report into Shapiro as just a GM. In any work situation, offering a strong performer (especially a young, up and coming executive) a lateral move or effective demotion is basically saying we don't want you here. His next job with the Dodgers was VP of Baseball Ops and then he got to run the whole show with the Braves as an EVP.

He basically went out and proved his value on the market. Ed, in his infinite wisdom, opted to bet on the stunning mediocrity of the Cleveland braintrust. Shapiro became their GM in 2001 and was there, with various promotions through 2014, winning one Central Division pennant (lol) in the weakest division in baseball.

Lots of recency bias on how badly Shapiro/Atkins have managed this "contending window", but the huge tell to me was when they first took over and completely BOTCHED the rebuild, flipping guys like Donaldson at their absolute low point (1.1 WAR, he was 4.9 the year before and 5.2 the year after) for guys like Julian-freakin-Merryweather. He effectively parlayed the Bautista/EE era into nothing in terms of prospects.

He's MLB's Bryan Colangelo, and he's been allowed to twiddle his thumbs for nine years of additional mediocrity with the Jays. Ed + Shapiro are the main reason I stopped watching and going to games, it's hard to be optimistic when morons run the show.

[OAKLEY_2]

I hate Rogers. I do have a 1939 Rogers Majestic vacuum tube radio needing some repairs on the tuner dial but Rogers modern era has killed my interest in the Jays. Raptors might have the same fate now. It is clalled: who cares. Exercises in sports futility with Shatkins. Edward is a complete D-bag and those door to door red shirt package hustlers are even worse. This news is pukey. No sugarcoating this situation.

[OAKLEY_2]

First they killed HNIC. Next the Jays. Now the Raptors. Hey TO sports much?