Retro Player of the Year 2008-09 UPDATE — Lebron James

[One_and_Done]

Lebron 09 PS per 100: 48-12-10 on 618 TS%, with a 128 Ortg and a 100 Drtg.

Kobe 09 PS per 100: 39-7-7 on 564 TS%, with a 117 Ortg and a 104 Drtg.

Not seeing how it's 'close'.

[OldSchoolNoBull]

My thoughts:

1. LeBron James

I'll have LeBron at #1 for leading his team to huge numbers - 66-16, 8.68 SRS, +10.0 Net Rtg - with a lackluster roster and recording some eye-popping individual numbers - but I feel like the "GOAT season" arguments are a little over-the-top, given that that there are very dominant individual seasons in NBA history that ended with a title - 67 Wilt, 71 Kareem, 94 Hakeem, 00 Shaq, 03 Duncan, 23 Jokic, plus a few of LeBron's own future seasons(12, 13, 16) and, yes, 2-3 MJ seasons.

It is difficult to blame LeBron for losing to the Magic, given the gargantuan individual numbers he put up and how close some of those losses were, but I would point to Game 4 a little bit. The Magic were up 2-1, and while LeBron did put up 44 points, 12 boards, and 7 assists, he also turned the ball over eight times, including seven times in the 4th and OT in a game decided by two points, and that resulted in the Magic being up 3-1 instead of the series being tied 2-2. Is that not a fair criticism?

Anyway, I can't honestly make a case for anyone else here. The closest is Kobe, and when even his team's superlative numbers trail the Cavs(not by that much though!) despite having a superior roster, I can't get there.

2. Kobe Bryant

Led his team to the second best record in the league(by a hair) the title as #1. Was +11.1 in the RS and +12.4 in the playoffs. Played all 82 games. Won Finals MVP. One of his signature seasons.

3. Dwyane Wade

His roster was even worse than LeBron's. That roster had no business making the playoffs. His next best players were Marion until he was traded, and then Jermaine O'Neal post-trade. Then it's rookie Beasley, Haslem, Chalmers, Jamario Moon, Daequan Cook, etc. With this roster Wade is +14.2 in the RS and +13.5 in the PO, leading the team to 43 wins and the playoffs.

Worth mentioning though that this was also Spo's first year as head coach. Perhaps his performance here should've been an early indication that he was for real.

4. Chris Paul

Great individual numbers again, quite similar to the previous season. The team is considerably worse, but it looks like that was largely due to Tyson Chandler missing a bunch of time with ankle injuries and not being himself in the playoffs.

5. Undecided, but probably Dwight

Dwight is the most obvious choice here, having led his team to the Finals, but, I mean, he got lucky. He wouldn't have made it to the ECF if KG hadn't been hurt(it took the Magic 7 games to beat the KG-less Celtics), and then some of those games against the Cavs were so close that the Magic easily could've lost if Dwight's teammates hadn't been hot from three. What's more, Dwight was -12.7 on/off in the playoffs. I don't really understand that on/off - it's hard to reconcile it with the monster box numbers he was posting and the defensive impact we know he had - but it seems damning nonetheless.

Melo is guy not getting any conversation here, but if there's any year for him to be considered at all, it'd be this one. His team not only made the WCF, they took two games off a very, very good Lakers team and lost two other games by 2 and 6, respectively. That series was closer than 4-2 implies. His on/offs are solid though not huge - +7.5 and +3.2. The issue here is how responsible he was for the playoff success. There's potential colinearity with Billups, and there's also the defensive impact of the three-headed monster of Nene/K-Mart/Birdman.

Dirk is another option, but I'm unconvinced.

Gasol was a very good #2 for the champs, so I'd consider him too.

It's probably Dwight, but I have reservations.

[Gibson22]

seasons that could be in doubt
11
15
16
2020
2024

[homecourtloss]

This is very clearly James even though you had great seasons from Wade (cut short), Kobe on a dominant Lakers team, and from Dwight. It’s likely the greatest peak in NBA history.

1. LeBron. Everything has already been said, but what is interesting is that who was on the court did not matter at all. The supporting cast should not have been able to get this team to 66 wins and an 8+ SRS. One of the things that hurt was the injury to Big Ben who came back in the playoffs a shell of himself and was soon out of the league.

LeBron ON, West, Wallace, BigZ, Varejao OFF: +18.0
LeBron ON, Gibson, Szczerbiak, Pavlovic OFF: +15.7

with Vareajao OFF: +17.1
with BigZ OFF: +15.5
with Pavlovic OFF: +15.4
with West OFF: +14.2
with Gibson OFF: +13.8
with Mo OFF: +13.5
with Wallace OFF: +12.0

with BigZ and Varejao OFF, +18.2
with Varejao and Gibson OFF, +17.3
with Mo and West OFF, +13.0
with BigZ and Ben OFF, +12.0
with Ben and West OFF, +11.4
with Mo and Ben OFF, +10.6

without Ben Wallace, 1,802 minutes, +12.03
without Gibson, 2,003 minutes, +13.43
without Mo Williams, 836 minutes, +13.46 (Mo without James, 616 minutes, -3.25)
without West, 1,025 minutes, +14.21
without Illgauskas, 1,547 minutes, +14.45
without Szczerbiak, 2,151 minutes, +15.39
without Andy V., 1,195 minutes, +17.13

LeBron without Mo and Varejao, 309 minutes, +10.68; Mo and Varejao without LeBron, 388 minutes, -1.13
without Ben and Illgauskas, 1,000 minutes, +11.97
without Mo and West, 240 minutes, +12.99
without Ben and Varejao, 382 minutes, +13.54
without Ben, Andy, Big Z, 254 minutes, +15.73

You see the beginning of an unprecedented length of great offensive playoff series here in 2009 for James (James in orange)



as well as ATG defenses not doing much to deter James




Colts18 has made a long post about 2009 James.

Spoiler:

Stats:
28-8-7, .591 TS%, 9.3 RAPM (1st)

31.7 PER (4th all-time), .318 WS/48 (6th all-time)

LeBron led his team in points, assists, rebounds, blocks, and steals becoming only the 4th player in history to accomplish that feat.

Team Success:
66-16 (.805)
+8.68 SRS (8.83 when LeBron played, 6th in the 3 point era)
112.4 Offensive Rating
102.4 Defensive Rating
+10.0 efficiency differential (4th in NBA history)

On court: +15.0
Off court: -6.2 off court (equivalent to this year’s Suns)
Net: +21.2 plus/minus

Top 10 total on court plus/minus since 1997:
1. 09 James +871
2. 97 Jordan +818
3. 97 Pippen +807
4. 08 Pierce +784
5. 03 Nowitzki +778
6. 97 Hornacek +775
7. 97 Malone +768
8. 07 Duncan +746
9. 08 Garnett +737
10. 00 Shaq +706


Best plus/minus since 2008:
1. 09 James +21.83
2. 09 Paul +19.65
3. 12 Griffin +18.65
4. 11 Pierce +17.75
5. 10 Durant 16.80
6. 09 Odom +16.63
7. 10 James +16.61

From 08-10, LeBron missed 14 games. Here are the results:
With: .737 win% +5.81 MOV
Without: 1-13 (.071 win%) (-7.68 MOV)
Difference: .666 win%, +13.67 MOV

Defense:

On court: 100.6 D rating (-7.7 relative to league average)
Off court: 108.8 D rating (+0.5 rel to LA)
Difference: -8.2 (According to BasketballValue.com, that difference is the 2nd highest in the league behind Pryzbilla)

The Cavs went from #1 D in the league with LeBron on the court to the equivalent of 18th when he left.

6.5 Defensive win shares (#2 in the league, only SF with more in a season are Pippen and Havlicek)

10.4 opponent counterpart PER according to 82games (equivalent to this year Alonzo Gee and Francisco Garcia)
82games also has opponent SF scoring 12.8 pts/36 and .525 TS% vs LeBron while opposing PF scored 13.3 pts/36 and .484 TS% when LeBron played PF.

Top 5 in on court defensive rating in 2009 (min. 2000 MP):
1. West: 99.2
2. LeBron 100.6
3. Odom 101.4
4. Turkoglu 101.4
5. Howard 101.8

LeBron is also 3rd in FG%, 4th in 3P%, and 3rd in eFG%.

Here is what some of the top SF of 2009 did vs LeBron offensively (their regular season per 36 in parenthesis)

Durant- 16.4 PPG, .518 TS% (23.3 PPG, .577 TS%)
Pierce- 18.1 PPG, .474 TS% (19.7 PPG, .582 TS%)
Johnson- 13.7 PPG, .475 TS% (19.5 PPG, .534 TS%)
Carmelo- 15.8 PPG, .488 TS% (23.8 PPG, .532 TS%)
Butler- 14.2 PPG, .438 TS% (19.4 PPG, .552 TS%)
Gay- 10.9 PPG, .357 TS% (18.3 PPG, .528 TS%)
Average dropoff: -5.8 PPG, -9.3 TS%

What’s amazing is that when faced Cleveland and LeBron was off the court, they dominated:

The 6 SF’s stats when (Per 36):
LeBron on court: 15.1 PPG, .461 TS%, 3.3 Reb, 3.6 AST-3.4 TOV, -9.4 +/-
LeBron off court: 24.6 PPG, .596 TS%, 5.9 Reb, 2.3 AST-1.8 TOV, +0.9 +/-

That is a 9.5 points per 36 and 13.5 TS% difference. In the playoffs, LeBron continued playing elite man defense. Here are how some of his guys did when LeBron was on the court (per 36 minutes):

Tayshaun Prince: 3.9 PPG, .260 TS%
Joe Johnson: 15.3 PPG, .480 TS%
Marvin Williams: 5.8 PPG, .337 TS%
Dropoff from regular season averages: -7.6 PPG, -18.1 TS%

Defensive stats from Hoopsstats.com for his position:
17.3 pts/game allowed (1st in league) (13.2 points per 36 minutes)
41.2 FG% allowed (1st)
15.1 FGA allowed (2nd fewest)
16.6 Efficiency allowed (1st)
1.3 Offensive rebounds allowed (3rd)

+2.8 Defensive RAPM [2nd among qualifying perimeter players (Artest)]

4th Quarter:
LeBron averaged 32 Points, 8.4 Rebounds, 7 Assists, .596 TS% per 36 minutes in the 4th quarter. When LeBron was on the court in the 4th, the Cavs had a 121.2 O Rating, 96.6 D rating (+24.6 Net). He had an absurd 44.1 Assist% in the 4th (equivalent to this year’s John Wall assist%).

In the playoffs he averaged 32-10-8, .574 TS%, 113.8 on court O rating, 98.7 D rating in the 4th quarter. His assist% in the 4th was 48% which is right around NBA Assist leader Greivis Vasquez current assist%.

Highest 4th quarter on court plus/minus from 1997 to 2013:
1. 09 James +265
2. 13 James +242 Pro-rated (Currently at +207)
3. 03 Marbury +220
4. 11 Korver +219
5. 09 Williams +212
6. 02 George +211
7. 04 Garnett +208
8. 11 Bosh +199

The Cavs were +265 (+24.5 per 100 possessions) in the 4th with LeBron on court and -97 (-13.17 per 100) without LeBron in the 4th quarter which gives LeBron a +37.7 plus/minus in the 4th quarter.

Offense:

On court: 115.6 (+7.3 relative to league average)
Off court: 102.6 (-5.7 relative to league average)
Net: +13.0 (2nd highest behind CP3).

The offense went from the equivalent of the 87 Lakers offense to the 2nd worst offense in the league in the minutes LeBron missed. The Cavs had a 39.3 3P% in 2009 which is the 12th best in history with the extended 3 point line.

Clutch:

Clutch stats (per 48): 56-13-13, 4 stl, 2 blk, .693 TS%

In the clutch, LeBron’s on court Offensive rating was 135.1 O rating, 89.5 D rating (+45.5 Net).

In the playoffs LeBron averaged 58-18-8, .696 TS%, 139.6 on court O rating, +30.5 per 48 minutes in the clutch.

Top 10 teams in clutch per 100 possessions since 1997:


2009 Cavaliers: +39.9
2013 Heat: +33.7
2011 Mavericks: +29.5
2007 Mavericks: +29.0
2006 Clippers: +27.1
2010 Cavaliers: +26.4
1998 Lakers: +26.2
1999 Magic: +25.7
2008 Cavaliers: +24.2
2004 Pacers: +23.4

LeBron is up there with Dirk in terms of GOAT clutch players.

Playoffs:

Averaged 35-9-7, .618 TS%. His 37.4 PER and .399 WS/48 are both the best in playoff history. He had a 128 O rating and 100 D rating in the playoffs. Michael Jordan has never beaten either of those numbers in a single playoff.

First 2 rounds:

In the first 2 rounds, LeBron averaged 33-10-7, .644 TS%, 139 O Rating, 90 D rating while rocking an absurd 6 turnover% and 35 usage%. LeBron controlled the game like no one has in those 2 rounds. LeBron had a 117.2 on Court offensive Rating (+9.4 relative to opponent) and 92.4 D Rating (-16.0 relative to opponent ), which gave him a +24.8 on court plus/minus. The Cavs/LeBron played elite defense in the first 2 round.

LeBron had a 43.6 PER in the first 2 rounds (46.8 PER vs. Hawks). To put that into perspective, from 1993-1998, Michael Jordan’s highest PER in a series was 35.0.

Vs Orlando:
Against the #1 defense in the league, LeBron averaged 39-8-8, .591 TS%. The Cavs had a 112.9 O rating when he was on the court. That is a +11.0 offense relative to Orlando’s regular season D rating. That would be a historic offensive playoff performance.

In 2 of Cleveland’s losses, LeBron’s on court plus/minus was positive. That means the Cavs outscored the Magic in those games, but the Cavs bench gave up the lead when LeBron was sitting.

LeBron was amazing because of his foul drawing prowess in that series. He drew 64 fouls in that series.

09 LeBron vs. Magic: 64 fouls drawn in 6 games
06 Wade vs. Mavs: 63 fouls drawn in 6 games

So he was as good as Wade who had ref help in terms of drawing fouls.

Here are the highest fouls drawn per game in the playoffs (min. 2 series) since 2006:
1. 09 LeBron 10.1
2. 10 Howard 9.7
3. 06 Duncan 9.2
4. 09 Howard 8.9
5. 08 LeBron 8.8


Teammates:

LeBron’s accomplishments are impressive when you factor his mediocre supporting cast. In the Orlando series, LeBron had 3 teammates who averaged 10+ PPG. But they combined for a .505 TS%. In the playoffs LeBron had a 37.4 PER and the 2nd best PER on his team had a 14.5 PER. That’s a 22.9 PER gap which is the highest in NBA history between the #1 and #2 guy. Of course I have to mention how his teammates collapsed when he wasn’t there to bail him out.
 

Biggest SRS dropoff in history:
1. 99 Bulls -15.82 (MJ/Pippen/Rodman)
2. 11 Cavs -15.05 (LeBron)
3. 97 Spurs -13.91 (Drob injured)
4. 91 Nuggets -11.88 (English)
5. 83 Rockets -10.73 (Moses)

If you look at some of LeBron’s highest minutes played guys, they have fallen off without LeBron.

Big Z- Out of the league 1 year later
Mo Williams- Went from 2nd option to 6th man the next year
Delonte West- Out of the league
Varejao- Same player, but injury prone
Ben Wallace- Out of the league
Wally- 2009 was his final year, out of the league
Pavlovic- 10th man after he left Cleveland
Boobie Gibson- Bench player
Joe Smith- Out of the league
Hickson- Became one of the worst players in the league before bouncing back this year

One day people will look back and be amazed that LeBron won 66 games with Mo Williams and Delonte West as his #2 and #3 options

The 4th quarter and clutch statistics are interesting because this team that’s not talented at all won many close games.

4th Quarter:
LeBron averaged 32 Points, 8.4 Rebounds, 7 Assists, .596 TS% per 36 minutes in the 4th quarter. When LeBron was on the court in the 4th, the Cavs had a 121.2 O Rating, 96.6 D rating (+24.6 Net). He had an absurd 44.1 Assist% in the 4th (equivalent to this year’s John Wall assist%).

In the playoffs he averaged 32-10-8, .574 TS%, 113.8 on court O rating, 98.7 D rating in the 4th quarter. His assist% in the 4th was 48% which is right around NBA Assist leader Greivis Vasquez current assist%.

Highest 4th quarter on court plus/minus from 1997 to 2013:
1. 09 James +265
2. 13 James +242 Pro-rated (Currently at +207)
3. 03 Marbury +220
4. 11 Korver +219
5. 09 Williams +212
6. 02 George +211
7. 04 Garnett +208
8. 11 Bosh +199

The Cavs were +265 (+24.5 per 100 possessions) in the 4th with LeBron on court and -97 (-13.17 per 100) without LeBron in the 4th quarter which gives LeBron a +37.7 plus/minus in the 4th quarter.

Offense:

On court: 115.6 (+7.3 relative to league average)
Off court: 102.6 (-5.7 relative to league average)
Net: +13.0 (2nd highest behind CP3).

The offense went from the equivalent of the 87 Lakers offense to the 2nd worst offense in the league in the minutes LeBron missed. The Cavs had a 39.3 3P% in 2009 which is the 12th best in history with the extended 3 point line.

Clutch:

Clutch stats (per 48): 56-13-13, 4 stl, 2 blk, .693 TS%

In the clutch, LeBron’s on court Offensive rating was 135.1 O rating, 89.5 D rating (+45.5 Net).

In the playoffs LeBron averaged 58-18-8, .696 TS%, 139.6 on court O rating, +30.5 per 48 minutes in the clutch.

Top 10 teams in clutch per 100 possessions since 1997:


2009 Cavaliers: +39.9
2013 Heat: +33.7
2011 Mavericks: +29.5
2007 Mavericks: +29.0
2006 Clippers: +27.1
2010 Cavaliers: +26.4
1998 Lakers: +26.2
1999 Magic: +25.7
2008 Cavaliers: +24.2
2004 Pacers: +23.4

As of the playoffs, the highest peak continued. One thing that’s not brought up when posters all about outliers is Dwight’s outlier FT shooting, i.e., 59% to 70% including 7-9 and 2-2 in close games 4 and 1.

2. Kobe. Great season meshing a talented roster with Odom putting together his skills and focusing on basketball.
3. Wade. Tremendous season with a trash roster but cut short.
4. Dwight. ‘10 might be even better but a great season anchoring the #1 defense.
5. Dirk.

[eminence]

I also applauded Dwight's FT shooting vs the Cavs, but highlighting a 2-2 performance is hilarious.

[jjgp111292]

Championship aside, this and 2010 are among the most obvious #1s.

[homecourtloss]

I also applauded Dwight's FT shooting vs the Cavs, but highlighting a 2-2 performance is hilarious.

Not in a 1 point game. Interesting that’s the only thing you point out from the post, though.

[The Explorer]

It is not obvious at all.

Cleveland in 2009 had a very strong season, which is why the ECF against Orlando has to be seen as a collapse.
- 3rd in drtg
- #1 in ppg allowed
- 39-2 at home, 2nd best all time home record
- 8-0 in first 2 rounds

Yet they failed to take advantage of All star Jameer Nelson not even playing a single game in the series.

James has good stat lines and good moments including the buzzer beater, but collapsed in several crucial moments

- Game 1 Orl down 16 points in 1st half and end up winning. Defensively, in 4th q, allows Lewis to go 5/5 including game winning 3
- Final possession with Howard on the bench, fails to create a good look for himself.
- Game 3 in final 2:30 Lebron goes 0-3, 3/5 ft with a TO
- Game 4 4th quarter + OT goes 4-10 fg, 8-10 FT, but commits 6 TO, leading to 3-1 hole
- Game 6 with season on the line, he scores zero points in 2nd quarter and goes 3-13 fg, 5-9 ft over the last 3 quarters

Lebron fans like to shift blame to the supporting cast, but in the regular season, the other 4 starters average 51.0 ppg. In the ECF the other 4 starters average 51.7 ppg, almost exactly the same performance scoring wise. Cleveland is the only Eastern team in the last 65 years to win at least 66 regular season games and not win the championship.

James even said himself he didn't do his part to meet Bryant in the finals.

"I know the world wanted to see it," LeBron said. "I wanted it; we wanted it. He held up his end, and I didn't hold up my end, and I hate that. I hate that that didn't happen."

If this is what the GOAT peak looks like, you guys have incredibly low standards.

[eminence]

I also applauded Dwight's FT shooting vs the Cavs, but highlighting a 2-2 performance is hilarious.

Not in a 1 point game. Interesting that’s the only thing you point out from the post, though.

Oh yes it is, best comedy on the site since JB in his prime.

Completely unrelated - what's Mo Williams % on 3/4 court heaves?

[eminence]

I would not say LeBron allowed Lewis to do anything. LeBron barely defended Lewis.

Spent the first 3 quarters on Skip and the 4th quarters on Hedo to the best of my recollection.

[OhayoKD]

If this is what the GOAT peak looks like, you guys have incredibly low standards.

The "incredibly low standard" being much better than Micheal Jordan has ever been at any point in his life

[falcolombardi]

It is not obvious at all.

Cleveland in 2009 had a very strong season, which is why the ECF against Orlando has to be seen as a collapse.
- 3rd in drtg
- #1 in ppg allowed
- 39-2 at home, 2nd best all time home record
- 8-0 in first 2 rounds

Yet they failed to take advantage of All star Jameer Nelson not even playing a single game in the series.

James has good stat lines and good moments including the buzzer beater, but collapsed in several crucial moments

- Game 1 Orl down 16 points in 1st half and end up winning. Defensively, in 4th q, allows Lewis to go 5/5 including game winning 3
- Final possession with Howard on the bench, fails to create a good look for himself.
- Game 3 in final 2:30 Lebron goes 0-3, 3/5 ft with a TO
- Game 4 4th quarter + OT goes 4-10 fg, 8-10 FT, but commits 6 TO, leading to 3-1 hole
- Game 6 with season on the line, he scores zero points in 2nd quarter and goes 3-13 fg, 5-9 ft over the last 3 quarters

Lebron fans like to shift blame to the supporting cast, but in the regular season, the other 4 starters average 51.0 ppg. In the ECF the other 4 starters average 51.7 ppg, almost exactly the same performance scoring wise. Cleveland is the only Eastern team in the last 65 years to win at least 66 regular season games and not win the championship.

James even said himself he didn't do his part to meet Bryant in the finals.

"I know the world wanted to see it," LeBron said. "I wanted it; we wanted it. He held up his end, and I didn't hold up my end, and I hate that. I hate that that didn't happen."

If this is what the GOAT peak looks like, you guys have incredibly low standards.

Is exactly the opposite lmao, lebron is the only player who would have a series of this caliber nitpicked or diminished

Jordan still gets glazed for all his losses to pistons and celtics, even the sweeps/gentlemen sweeps

Lebron is judged on a curve compared to anyone else because is the only way to diminish him at times for on court reasons

[ceoofkobefans]

It’s such a shame that Kobe has arguably his best season and had a year that win POY in most seasons but it overlapped with LeBron hitting his peak so he gets **** out of another POY season

[One_and_Done]

It’s such a shame that Kobe has arguably his best season and had a year that win POY in most seasons but it overlapped with LeBron hitting his peak so he gets **** out of another POY season

09 Kobe would not be POY 'most seasons'. Kobe played on a team that would have won 55 games without him, and reaped the rewards of that. He's just fortunate the opposing teams were not up to snuff. If KG never gets hurt in 09 then history remembers Kobe as Shaq's Robin, who never won without him. All the guys better than him this year (Lebron, Wade, Dwight, Nash, etc) were stuck on teams with inferior support casts. If anything Kobe is lucky this year.

[AEnigma]

3) First point I'd qualify as disagreement - I see more problems with Brons play than just one scoring matchups. LeBron was well below his normal defensive impact vs Orlando in '09.

Impact is abstract but based on what I saw I have no particular criticisms of Lebron that series, no. He could have been better… but as you acknowledge, that is pretty much always true when players are expending so much energy on offence.

And struggled in more areas offensively than just scoring vs the Celtics (TOV issues,

Would not call that totally distinct from scoring or even necessarily an unexpected increase against the league’s best turnover-forcing team, but sure, Game 1 was abominable, and Games 2 and 6 were higher than I would say was excusable (not that it likely made a difference in Game 2’s result or was a sufficient negative to cost the team in Game 6).

as the far and away primary ballhandler, it's at least partially on him if none of the rest of the team gets going - his playmaking was more limited than Robinsons ever was - in terms of percent of impact).

I have no particular criticisms of his individual playmaking relative to his regular season, and I think Lebron’s individual responsibility was low on the list for the team’s offensive underperformance, but in an abstracted sense, sure, to the extent it was his job to lead the team offensively, it is not worth praising that the team overall did not do well on that end.

I don't have the same LeBron characterization - he also seemed to struggle across (meaningful) matchups at this point. LeBron succeeds later - absolutely - but for this stretch of his career, I don't see some immortal PO performer, better than Robinson sure, but not particularly strong.

Filtering “meaningful” matchups limits what we can use here (whereas I think Robinson had all the same offensive issues even in less meaningful matchups and has that mediocre Warriors upset on his record in what should not have been a “meaningful” matchup), but I would not say this Magic matchup qualifies as any “struggle”, no. At absolute worst, I could say there might be a “struggle” with consistency… but even then it is minimally applicable to this year.

5) '96 MJ leading an all-time dominant team, sure, and I can see folks taking issue with '08 KG. But Hakeem was putting out outright lackluster regular seasons by POY standards.

Not a particularly regular season focused group, and I would say that only significantly applies to 1995 anyway. 1994 Hakeem was a top two regular season player (alongside one of the GOAT “impact” regular seasons) with the second-best record in the league, and he won both MVP and DPoY.

He has great PO runs, but I don't see a justification for Hakeem '94/'95 to have a significant lead over '09/'10 Kobe overall (I would personally lean Kobe but have them in the same tier). '95 Shaq I don't find particularly notable in terms of a POY #1 contender - prefer Howard from '09.

Both of those are pretty extreme minority positions outside of the pro-Kobe public, but I encourage you to make the case for Dwight seeing as no one else seems overly inclined to do so.

6. By what measures do you feel this way? I don't rate him looking significantly better than Kobe vs the same opponents in the '08-'10 stretch.

I do not feel overly strongly about it in 2008 — if I did, I probably would not have voted Kobe ahead — but if we agree that Lebron was a “better” (albeit not more successful) playmaker and better defender, and he led a worse team to much closer competition, then you need to place a lot of weight on Kobe’s scoring profile to cover the gap. And then in 2010 Kobe does not even have a determinable advantage as a scorer.

I'm not sure which other players we'd directly compare him with.

He and Wade had common opponents in both 2009/10. Lebron was much better in 2009; in 2010, Wade was at least more impressive offensively, and one voter has already said they will be dropping Lebron below Wade, although personally I think Lebron was still better overall.

7. Career wise there are others I think range from arguable to outright preferring, but most relevant to this thread it's perfectly reasonable to prefer Dwight in '09.

Strongly disagree, and I am more sympathetic to the value of elite defenders than most.

Rashard is good, but that Magic cast is not so solid that that outcome should've been any sort of given. Hedo/Skip/Lee/Pietrus 3-6 is not a particularly inspiring group.

I think they are when they shoot so much better, and while we can credit Dwight for his interior scoring gravity, it does not seem tenable to ascribe a sufficient difference in interior gravity that would support him being the most responsible part of that shooting disparity.

Dwight hitting his FTs at 70% is a weapon.

I do not think he was so close in value to Lebron that a free throw hot streak up to 70% closes it — although you are right that it makes him more valuable, and with two wins decided by a point, that does matter.

I guess on review I'm more bothered by my perception of the gap than anyone preferring the LeBron stretch. To me LeBron feels like an arguable #1 who I wouldn't wind up picking for any of these seasons (KG or Kobe in '08, Kobe in '09/'10), but that diverges pretty strongly from the early posts here which would indicate this version of Bron as a true top tier POY peak.

I mean to me that just indicates you are the voter most focused on giving RPoY to the title winner (barring perceived share splits as with the 1970 Knicks or presumably the three Pistons titles), to a degree well beyond the average for both this voting bloc and the 2010 bloc, but to each their own.

[Djoker]

It’s such a shame that Kobe has arguably his best season and had a year that win POY in most seasons but it overlapped with LeBron hitting his peak so he gets **** out of another POY season

09 Kobe would not be POY 'most seasons'. Kobe played on a team that would have won 55 games without him, and reaped the rewards of that. He's just fortunate the opposing teams were not up to snuff. If KG never gets hurt in 09 then history remembers Kobe as Shaq's Robin, who never won without him. All the guys better than him this year (Lebron, Wade, Dwight, Nash, etc) were stuck on teams with inferior support casts. If anything Kobe is lucky this year.

You have no credibility when it comes to Kobe Bryant. You left him off the freaking ballot in 2008, for God's sakes.

How do you know his team wins 55 games without him? This is just a baloney take.

[One_and_Done]

It’s such a shame that Kobe has arguably his best season and had a year that win POY in most seasons but it overlapped with LeBron hitting his peak so he gets **** out of another POY season

09 Kobe would not be POY 'most seasons'. Kobe played on a team that would have won 55 games without him, and reaped the rewards of that. He's just fortunate the opposing teams were not up to snuff. If KG never gets hurt in 09 then history remembers Kobe as Shaq's Robin, who never won without him. All the guys better than him this year (Lebron, Wade, Dwight, Nash, etc) were stuck on teams with inferior support casts. If anything Kobe is lucky this year.

You have no credibility when it comes to Kobe Bryant. You left him off the freaking ballot in 2008, for God's sakes.

How do you know his team wins 55 games without him? This is just a baloney take.

All of us here are engaging in conjecture, that’s how rankings work. That said, there’s some pretty strong evidence that Kobe isn’t providing the lift you think he is, and I cited a lot of it in the 2008 thread that you were just complaining about.

- Kobe’s record in games from 00-07 without Shaq is 135-137
- From 00-04, in games without Kobe, Shaq had the Lakers playing at a 60+ win pace
- In 2008 without Pau/Bynum the Lakers were 11-9 with Kobe
- In 2008 the Lakers were 24-11 with Bynum
- In 2008 the Lakers were 22-5 with Pau

The evidence doesn’t suggest Kobe has this huge lift his fans want him to. I’m not an advanced stats guy, but the advanced stats hate him. The conventional numbers don’t like him either once you look past volume scoring (e.g. CP3 & Nash contribute more pp100 than him once you factor in assists). Then you look at the guys he’s being compared to, and they seem to be lifting teams in a way he has always failed to, with no difficulty (e.g. Dwight in 08 and 09, Lebron in 09 and 10, Nash in 06 and 10, etc).

We can’t be 100% certain of anything. But I see Pau, a guy who led 50ish win teams in a deep West with a mediocre support cast, and Odom who is a proven 2nd best player on playoff teams, and Bynum who had grown into an elite center, and Ariza who is an elite 3&D wing, and Fisher who is a solid starting point guard, and Radmanovic who is a very good bench player, and decent bench guys like Farmer and Walton, and I feel pretty confident this team was winning 55-ish games even without Kobe.

And I'm not alone in that view:
viewtopic.php?t=2342758

[ShotCreator]

It’s such a shame that Kobe has arguably his best season and had a year that win POY in most seasons but it overlapped with LeBron hitting his peak so he gets **** out of another POY season

If it makes you feel any better, Chris Paul should clearly be placed #2 on a list like this, even with getting injured and playing in the playoffs when he shouldn't have.

[eminence]

3) First point I'd qualify as disagreement - I see more problems with Brons play than just one scoring matchups. LeBron was well below his normal defensive impact vs Orlando in '09.

Impact is abstract but based on what I saw I have no particular criticisms of Lebron that series, no. He could have been better… but as you acknowledge, that is pretty much always true when players are expending so much energy on offence.

And struggled in more areas offensively than just scoring vs the Celtics (TOV issues,

Would not call that totally distinct from scoring or even necessarily a an unexpected increase against the league’s best turnover-forcing team, but sure, Game 1 was abominable, and Games 2 and 6 were higher than I would say was excusable (not that it likely made a difference in either or was a sufficient negative to cost the team in Game 6).

as the far and away primary ballhandler, it's at least partially on him if none of the rest of the team gets going - his playmaking was more limited than Robinsons ever was - in terms of percent of impact).

I have no particular criticisms of his individual playmaking relative to his regular season, and I think Lebron’s individual responsibility was low on the list for the team’s offensive underperformance, but in an abstracted sense, sure, to the extent it was his job to lead the team offensively, it is not worth praising that the team overall did not do well on that end.

I don't have the same LeBron characterization - he also seemed to struggle across (meaningful) matchups at this point. LeBron succeeds later - absolutely - but for this stretch of his career, I don't see some immortal PO performer, better than Robinson sure, but not particularly strong.

Filtering “meaningful” matchups limits what we can use here (whereas I think Robinson had all the same offensive issues even in less meaningful matchups and even has that mediocre Warriors upset on his record in what should not have been a “meaningful” matchup), but I would not say this Magic matchup qualifies as any “struggle”, no. At absolute worst, I could say there might be a “struggle” with consistency… but even then it is minimally applicable to this year.

5) '96 MJ leading an all-time dominant team, sure, and I can see folks taking issue with '08 KG. But Hakeem was putting out outright lackluster regular seasons by POY standards.

Not a particularly regular season focused group, and I would say that only significantly applies to 1995 anyway. 1994 Hakeem was a top two regular season player (alongside one of the GOAT “impact” regular seasons) with the second-best record in the league, and he won both MVP and DPoY.

He has great PO runs, but I don't see a justification for Hakeem '94/'95 to have a significant lead over '09/'10 Kobe overall (I would personally lean Kobe but have them in the same tier). '95 Shaq I don't find particularly notable in terms of a POY #1 contender - prefer Howard from '09.

Both of those are pretty extreme minority positions outside of the pro-Kobe public, but I encourage you to make the case for Dwight seeing as no one else seems overly inclined to do so.

6. By what measures do you feel this way? I don't rate him looking significantly better than Kobe vs the same opponents in the '08-'10 stretch.

I do not feel overly strongly about it in 2008 — if I did, I probably would not have voted Kobe ahead — but if we agree that Lebron was a “better” (albeit not more successful) playmaker and better defender, and he led a worse team to much closer competition, then you need to place a lot of weight on Kobe’s scoring profile to cover the gap. And then in 2010 Kobe does not even have a determinable advantage as a scorer.

I'm not sure which other players we'd directly compare him with.

He and Wade had common opponents in both 2009/10. Lebron was much better in 2009; in 2010, Wade was at least more impressive offensively, and one voter has already said they will be dropping Lebron below Wade, although personally I think Lebron was still better overall.

7. Career wise there are others I think range from arguable to outright preferring, but most relevant to this thread it's perfectly reasonable to prefer Dwight in '09.

Strongly disagree, and I am more sympathetic to the value of elite defenders than most.

Rashard is good, but that Magic cast is not so solid that that outcome should've been any sort of given. Hedo/Skip/Lee/Pietrus 3-6 is not a particularly inspiring group.

I think they are when they shoot so much better, and while we can credit Dwight for his interior scoring gravity, it does not seem tenable to ascribe a sufficient difference in interior gravity that would support him being the most responsible part of that shooting disparity.

Dwight hitting his FTs at 70% is a weapon.

I do not think he was so close in value to Lebron that a free throw hot streak up to 70% closes it — although you are right that it makes him more valuable, and with two wins decided by a point, that does matter.

I guess on review I'm more bothered by my perception of the gap than anyone preferring the LeBron stretch. To me LeBron feels like an arguable #1 who I wouldn't wind up picking for any of these seasons (KG or Kobe in '08, Kobe in '09/'10), but that diverges pretty strongly from the early posts here which would indicate this version of Bron as a true top tier POY peak.

I mean to me that just indicates you are the voter most focused on giving RPoY to the title winner (barring perceived share splits as with the 1970 Knicks or presumably the three Pistons titles), to a degree well beyond the average for both this voting bloc and the 2010 bloc, but to each their own.

We are wildly far apart on the defensive quality of LeBron in that ECF.

I 'acknowledged' that LeBron didn't have the energy (or the capability) to be a primary rim protector. Not that he couldn't/shouldn't have been better defensively, a pretty notable difference. I expected a lot more from him - for perspective, I grade it similarly to Melo's concurrent series vs the Lakers, which is, a distinct negative.

The effort for the first 3 quarters was bad (some nice low impact Wade style 2nd help defender blocks for the highlight reel though), way too many possessions standing doing nothing in the midrange. Off ball and not digging on Dwight or closing on anyone else, just standing 'guarding' Skip/Pietrus in the corner - but not engaged enough that he could close adequately even 1 pass away. The 4th quarter had the idea of him 'turning it on' and being more on ball but it wasn't effective as Dwight easily screened him off Hedo leaving Big Z isolated (BBQ chicken). They went to Z trapping Hedo because LeBron was so poor at navigating the screens. Didn't work any better, woohoo Dwight with a runway. Finally back to conserving energy 'on' Skip/Pietrus, similar results off-ball.

[AEnigma]

Defensive Player of the Year

1. Dwight Howard
2. LeBron James
3. Lamar Odom

Weird year after Dwight. Garnett is injured, Chandler is injured, Bogut is injured, Camby is injured, Jermaine is injured, Kenyon is injured, the Wallaces are injured and essentially done… And Duncan, a mainstay for the past decade, is in decline and an underwhelming first round exit. Lebron himself gets in mostly by default as the most important defender in aggregate on a top three defence with a conference finals run. I then glance over at Nenê or Yao, but Nenê is splitting responsibility with Kenyon, and while Yao is a clearer anchor big, he also has a ludicrously good defensive cast around him (Battier and Artest is just unfair), and the team survived fine without him the prior year (recall that was the year of the 22-game win streak). But what I am dancing around is that none of these teams or their representative players were the best defence this year. No, that status goes to the Lakers, and in a weird year, I may as well give some acknowledgment to Odom for being the best piece on that title-winning defence (Phil Jackson excluded ).

Offensive Player of the Year

1. Lebron James
2. Kobe Bryant
3. Brandon Roy

Lebron of course was transcendent. I prefer 2013/14 Lebron as a scorer, and 2017/18 Lebron as an overall playmaker, creator, and offensive threat, but this was Lebron at his most explosive (before putting on weight in Miami) and at his peak as a slasher and finisher. He set new highs basically across the board as both a scorer and playmaker (apart from total points and points per game, because he set a new low in minutes per game), and then he carried that over into the postseason. The talk about “prime” is silly because 2005-08 Lebron was already on par with the best wings in history, but 2009 is where we can say he enters his sustained peak period. And although I am not sure that means he is a better offensive player than a healthy Nash (who will return to the top of my ballot next year), this form of him is good enough to compete with anyone else. And that includes Kobe leading a relatively comfortable title team.

Could go in several directions with the third spot: Paul’s injury and Nash’s postseason absence open up a potential space to players like Wade, Dirk, Roy, or Deron… and I suppose keeping in line with my third place DPoY vote, I will give the edge to Brandon Roy for captaining the league’s best offence and individually scoring better against the Rockets than Kobe did (this latter observation is a minor note; it basically came down to random shooting variance).

Honestly, I'd take Brandon Roy over all of them -- a truly skillful player that can shoot 3s.

Player of the Year

1. Lebron James
2. Kobe Bryant
3. Dwyane Wade
4. Dwight Howard
5. Dirk Nowitzki

Lebron has what I consider the greatest (although next year is arguably even better) regular season in league history, and he maintains that form through the conference finals. However, the Cavaliers’ frontcourt is completely unable to stop Dwight and loses in six games, with two games which could have been flipped by a single basket. And that talent deficit would have been even wider if they had made the Finals. I am not sure this is the Lebron I would take to win a single do-or-die game, but it is certainly the most productive Lebron and probably the most impactful Lebron. In an RPoY sense, 2012/13 are cleaner, but otherwise, this season can stack up with any even without the ring.

2009 LeBron crushes the competition

Stats:
28-8-7, .591 TS%, 9.3 RAPM (1st)

31.7 PER (4th all-time), .318 WS/48 (6th all-time)

LeBron led his team in points, assists, rebounds, blocks, and steals becoming only the 4th player in history to accomplish that feat.

Team Success:
66-16 (.805)
+8.68 SRS (8.83 when LeBron played, 6th in the 3 point era)
112.4 Offensive Rating
102.4 Defensive Rating
+10.0 efficiency differential (4th in NBA history)

On court: +15.0
Off court: -6.2 off court (equivalent to this year’s Suns)
Net: +21.2 plus/minus

Top 10 total on court plus/minus since 1997:
1. 09 James +871
2. 97 Jordan +818
3. 97 Pippen +807
4. 08 Pierce +784
5. 03 Nowitzki +778
6. 97 Hornacek +775
7. 97 Malone +768
8. 07 Duncan +746
9. 08 Garnett +737
10. 00 Shaq +706

Best plus/minus since 2008:
1. 09 James +21.83
2. 09 Paul +19.65
3. 12 Griffin +18.65
4. 11 Pierce +17.75
5. 10 Durant 16.80
6. 09 Odom +16.63
7. 10 James +16.61

From 08-10, LeBron missed 14 games. Here are the results:
With: .737 win% +5.81 MOV
Without: 1-13 (.071 win%) (-7.68 MOV)
Difference: .666 win%, +13.67 MOV

Defense:

On court: 100.6 D rating (-7.7 relative to league average)
Off court: 108.8 D rating (+0.5 rel to LA)
Difference: -8.2 (According to BasketballValue.com, that difference is the 2nd highest in the league behind Pryzbilla)

The Cavs went from #1 D in the league with LeBron on the court to the equivalent of 18th when he left.

6.5 Defensive win shares (#2 in the league, only SF with more in a season are Pippen and Havlicek)

10.4 opponent counterpart PER according to 82games (equivalent to this year Alonzo Gee and Francisco Garcia)
82games also has opponent SF scoring 12.8 pts/36 and .525 TS% vs LeBron while opposing PF scored 13.3 pts/36 and .484 TS% when LeBron played PF.

Top 5 in on court defensive rating in 2009 (min. 2000 MP):
1. West: 99.2
2. LeBron 100.6
3. Odom 101.4
4. Turkoglu 101.4
5. Howard 101.8

LeBron is also 3rd in FG%, 4th in 3P%, and 3rd in eFG%.

Here is what some of the top SF of 2009 did vs LeBron offensively (their regular season per 36 in parenthesis)

Durant- 16.4 PPG, .518 TS% (23.3 PPG, .577 TS%)
Pierce- 18.1 PPG, .474 TS% (19.7 PPG, .582 TS%)
Johnson- 13.7 PPG, .475 TS% (19.5 PPG, .534 TS%)
Carmelo- 15.8 PPG, .488 TS% (23.8 PPG, .532 TS%)
Butler- 14.2 PPG, .438 TS% (19.4 PPG, .552 TS%)
Gay- 10.9 PPG, .357 TS% (18.3 PPG, .528 TS%)
Average dropoff: -5.8 PPG, -9.3 TS%

What’s amazing is that when faced Cleveland and LeBron was off the court, they dominated:

The 6 SF’s stats when (Per 36):
LeBron on court: 15.1 PPG, .461 TS%, 3.3 Reb, 3.6 AST-3.4 TOV, -9.4 +/-
LeBron off court: 24.6 PPG, .596 TS%, 5.9 Reb, 2.3 AST-1.8 TOV, +0.9 +/-

That is a 9.5 points per 36 and 13.5 TS% difference. In the playoffs, LeBron continued playing elite man defense. Here are how some of his guys did when LeBron was on the court (per 36 minutes):

Tayshaun Prince: 3.9 PPG, .260 TS%
Joe Johnson: 15.3 PPG, .480 TS%
Marvin Williams: 5.8 PPG, .337 TS%
Dropoff from regular season averages: -7.6 PPG, -18.1 TS%

Defensive stats from Hoopsstats.com for his position:
17.3 pts/game allowed (1st in league) (13.2 points per 36 minutes)
41.2 FG% allowed (1st)
15.1 FGA allowed (2nd fewest)
16.6 Efficiency allowed (1st)
1.3 Offensive rebounds allowed (3rd)

+2.8 Defensive RAPM [2nd among qualifying perimeter players (Artest)]

4th Quarter:
LeBron averaged 32 Points, 8.4 Rebounds, 7 Assists, .596 TS% per 36 minutes in the 4th quarter. When LeBron was on the court in the 4th, the Cavs had a 121.2 O Rating, 96.6 D rating (+24.6 Net). He had an absurd 44.1 Assist% in the 4th (equivalent to this year’s John Wall assist%).

In the playoffs he averaged 32-10-8, .574 TS%, 113.8 on court O rating, 98.7 D rating in the 4th quarter. His assist% in the 4th was 48% which is right around NBA Assist leader Greivis Vasquez current assist%.

Highest 4th quarter on court plus/minus from 1997 to 2013:
1. 09 James +265
2. 13 James +242 Pro-rated (Currently at +207)
3. 03 Marbury +220
4. 11 Korver +219
5. 09 Williams +212
6. 02 George +211
7. 04 Garnett +208
8. 11 Bosh +199

The Cavs were +265 (+24.5 per 100 possessions) in the 4th with LeBron on court and -97 (-13.17 per 100) without LeBron in the 4th quarter which gives LeBron a +37.7 plus/minus in the 4th quarter.

Offense:

On court: 115.6 (+7.3 relative to league average)
Off court: 102.6 (-5.7 relative to league average)
Net: +13.0 (2nd highest behind CP3).

The offense went from the equivalent of the 87 Lakers offense to the 2nd worst offense in the league in the minutes LeBron missed. The Cavs had a 39.3 3P% in 2009 which is the 12th best in history with the extended 3 point line.

Clutch:

Clutch stats (per 48): 56-13-13, 4 stl, 2 blk, .693 TS%

In the clutch, LeBron’s on court Offensive rating was 135.1 O rating, 89.5 D rating (+45.5 Net).

In the playoffs LeBron averaged 58-18-8, .696 TS%, 139.6 on court O rating, +30.5 per 48 minutes in the clutch.

Top 10 teams in clutch per 100 possessions since 1997:


2009 Cavaliers: +39.9
2013 Heat: +33.7
2011 Mavericks: +29.5
2007 Mavericks: +29.0
2006 Clippers: +27.1
2010 Cavaliers: +26.4
1998 Lakers: +26.2
1999 Magic: +25.7
2008 Cavaliers: +24.2
2004 Pacers: +23.4

LeBron is up there with Dirk in terms of GOAT clutch players.

Playoffs:

Averaged 35-9-7, .618 TS%. His 37.4 PER and .399 WS/48 are both the best in playoff history. He had a 128 O rating and 100 D rating in the playoffs. Michael Jordan has never beaten either of those numbers in a single playoff.

First 2 rounds:

In the first 2 rounds, LeBron averaged 33-10-7, .644 TS%, 139 O Rating, 90 D rating while rocking an absurd 6 turnover% and 35 usage%. LeBron controlled the game like no one has in those 2 rounds. LeBron had a 117.2 on Court offensive Rating (+9.4 relative to opponent) and 92.4 D Rating (-16.0 relative to opponent ), which gave him a +24.8 on court plus/minus. The Cavs/LeBron played elite defense in the first 2 round.

LeBron had a 43.6 PER in the first 2 rounds (46.8 PER vs. Hawks). To put that into perspective, from 1993-1998, Michael Jordan’s highest PER in a series was 35.0.

Vs Orlando:
Against the #1 defense in the league, LeBron averaged 39-8-8, .591 TS%. The Cavs had a 112.9 O rating when he was on the court. That is a +11.0 offense relative to Orlando’s regular season D rating. That would be a historic offensive playoff performance.

In 2 of Cleveland’s losses, LeBron’s on court plus/minus was positive. That means the Cavs outscored the Magic in those games, but the Cavs bench gave up the lead when LeBron was sitting.

LeBron was amazing because of his foul drawing prowess in that series. He drew 64 fouls in that series.

09 LeBron vs. Magic: 64 fouls drawn in 6 games
06 Wade vs. Mavs: 63 fouls drawn in 6 games

So he was as good as Wade who had ref help in terms of drawing fouls.

Here are the highest fouls drawn per game in the playoffs (min. 2 series) since 2006:
1. 09 LeBron 10.1
2. 10 Howard 9.7
3. 06 Duncan 9.2
4. 09 Howard 8.9
5. 08 LeBron 8.8


Teammates:

LeBron’s accomplishments are impressive when you factor his mediocre supporting cast. In the Orlando series, LeBron had 3 teammates who averaged 10+ PPG. But they combined for a .505 TS%. In the playoffs LeBron had a 37.4 PER and the 2nd best PER on his team had a 14.5 PER. That’s a 22.9 PER gap which is the highest in NBA history between the #1 and #2 guy. Of course I have to mention how his teammates collapsed when he wasn’t there to bail him out.
 

Biggest SRS dropoff in history:
1. 99 Bulls -15.82 (MJ/Pippen/Rodman)
2. 11 Cavs -15.05 (LeBron)
3. 97 Spurs -13.91 (Drob injured)
4. 91 Nuggets -11.88 (English)
5. 83 Rockets -10.73 (Moses)

If you look at some of LeBron’s highest minutes played guys, they have fallen off without LeBron.

Big Z- Out of the league 1 year later
Mo Williams- Went from 2nd option to 6th man the next year
Delonte West- Out of the league
Varejao- Same player, but injury prone
Ben Wallace- Out of the league
Wally- 2009 was his final year, out of the league
Pavlovic- 10th man after he left Cleveland
Boobie Gibson- Bench player
Joe Smith- Out of the league
Hickson- Became one of the worst players in the league before bouncing back this year

One day people will look back and be amazed that LeBron won 66 games with Mo Williams and Delonte West as his #2 and #3 options

Kobe was not remotely as impressive against the Magic as Lebron was, but I would not take anyone else in the postseason. He won a ring because he had better teammates, yes; he still performed better than someone like Wade did and was the best player in all four of his series.

The prolific offensive play this year was not restricted to Lebron, as his banana boat buddies also put up their most productive seasons. Paul’s injury takes him out of contention for me in a competitive field, but while Wade’s first round exit was underwhelming compared to his regular season and to Lebron, he was generally still the player who came closest to replicating Lebron’s production.

I think Howard at this point had far too many offensive limitations to go higher (2011 Dwight probably steals an extra game against the Lakers and could have moved Wade down a spot), but he was the definite best player on the conference winning team and reached the Finals by thoroughly dominating an ostensibly (if not actually) superior team. Impact metrics are hurt by having a good backup, although they do partially show the quality of the roster around him and his own inability to drive a team to the same degree as these three above him.

Extremely competitive race for the final spot, but think Dirk was the best player in both his series, and that goes a long way. Did not intend to be voting him here, but the more I looked, the more I struggled to place anyone else here. Carmelo was a notably worse player (Nuggets could have conceivably upset the Lakers with Dirk in his place), Paul again was injured, Garnett was even more injured, Nash missed the postseason, Roy had elite support, Duncan easily lost the head-to-head… so Dirk it is.