2025 Offseason Trade and Free Agency Thread (The Fun Never Stops Edition)

[hugepatsfan]

How about...

MIL gets: Simons

BOS gets: Brook Lopez via S&T

It needs to be a 3 year deal for S&T to be legal, but 3rd year can be non guaranteed. Starting salary has to be $20,178,571 for MIL to be sending out enough salary here to match on Simons and I feel like you can make the salary declining. Let's say $20,178,571 in year 1, $19,821,429 in year 2 and then non guaranteed $20M in year 3. So a 3 year $60M deal that's really only 2 years, $40M.

Addresses the roster imbalance of having no 5s this year. Allows you to keep playing 5-out offense even with Porzingis and potentially Horford gone. Puts you closer to ducking the tax this year. Still keeps you under the tax next year.

We get hard capped at the first Apron right? Is it doable? I haven’t crunched the numbers

As of right now, with 13 guys signed, we are $7,369,716 over the 1st apron with 13 players signed. The swap here of Simons for Lopez on that deal saves $7.5M exactly so we'd go to $130,284 under the 1st apron. However, we do need to sign a 14th player. So another move has to be made.

Tillman makes $2,546,675. The rookie minimum is $1,272,869. If they salary dumped Tillman to go up to 2 open rosters spots and then signed the 2 2nd rounders to rookie minimum deals for a combined $2,545,738 then actually save $1K so they stay under the 1st apron while getting up to 14 players.

White / Pritchard / Davison
Brown / Gonzalez / Shulga
Hauser / Scheierman / Walsh
Niang
Lopez / Queta / Amari Williams

Obviously moves could be made with Hauser/Niang instead, but just presenting a path that only involves 3rd string roster maneuvering vs. something more material. In this scenario they might prefer dumping one/both of those guys to keep Horford and/or Kornet as well, even with Lopez. Or just backfilling with minimums to duck the tax while still adding Lopez to have a big man next year when Tatum is back (though he's kind of old to be signing him for what he'll bring in year 2).

Crunching these numbers... I don't really like it honestly haha

[Hal14]

By contrast I haven't heard any credible buzz about Sam Hauser's inclusion in serious trade conversations. The interest would surely be there given Hauser's perimeter prowess and the value contract he holds over the next four years, but the Celtics have largely achieved their financial goals by moving Holiday and Porziņģis. They don't have to trade Hauser. It is also presumed that the Celtics still hope to compete for a playoff spot next season even while Jayson Tatum recovers from a torn Achilles and Hauser figures to be an integral contributor to such aims.

Interesting. Might be a bit of a log jam with Hauser/Niang..and with Scheirman/Walsh/Hugo all trying to get some of those wing mins too..

Offloading Hauser would make it less of a logjam, while saving $ we can use to sign Kornet/Al..

[jfs1000d]

When the Reiensdorf Bulls did this with Marquis Teague it was used in the media to represent the Bulls as a cheap, subserious clown show of an organization.

If a team is serious about winning titles, you need to use the draft to bolster your team by taking the BEST prospect on the board, not the best prospect who sign for less than 120% of scale or 80% of scale or whatever cheapout ask.

Jake fischer:

League sources say Boston has been so focused on its accounting that it took an interesting approach with the No. 28 pick.

In considering various prospects to select with that late first-round turn Wednesday night, sources say that the Celtics initially looked for players who would be willing to accept 80% of their rookie scale contract salary, which is the lowest figure first-round picks can be paid.

I don't think they are being cheap. The over the apron is so limiting that you can't win if you are a multiple time repeater. Flat out, this isn't only about money, it is about roster building. Yes, you can be cheap. It also don't be stupid .

If anyone is trying to think the owners are doing this because they are cheap, then you fundamentally do t understand the CBA. I don't care about lux tax, pay or don't pay, but they are tying salary management to ability it make trades and sign players.


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[cloverleaf]

How about...

MIL gets: Simons

BOS gets: Brook Lopez via S&T

It needs to be a 3 year deal for S&T to be legal, but 3rd year can be non guaranteed. Starting salary has to be $20,178,571 for MIL to be sending out enough salary here to match on Simons and I feel like you can make the salary declining. Let's say $20,178,571 in year 1, $19,821,429 in year 2 and then non guaranteed $20M in year 3. So a 3 year $60M deal that's really only 2 years, $40M.

Addresses the roster imbalance of having no 5s this year. Allows you to keep playing 5-out offense even with Porzingis and potentially Horford gone. Puts you closer to ducking the tax this year. Still keeps you under the tax next year.

We get hard capped at the first Apron right? Is it doable? I haven’t crunched the numbers

As of right now, with 13 guys signed, we are $7,369,716 over the 1st apron with 13 players signed. The swap here of Simons for Lopez on that deal saves $7.5M exactly so we'd go to $130,284 under the 1st apron. However, we do need to sign a 14th player. So another move has to be made.

Tillman makes $2,546,675. The rookie minimum is $1,272,869. If they salary dumped Tillman to go up to 2 open rosters spots and then signed the 2 2nd rounders to rookie minimum deals for a combined $2,545,738 then actually save $1K so they stay under the 1st apron while getting up to 14 players.

White / Pritchard / Davison
Brown / Gonzalez / Shulga
Hauser / Scheierman / Walsh
Niang
Lopez / Queta / Amari Williams

Obviously moves could be made with Hauser/Niang instead, but just presenting a path that only involves 3rd string roster maneuvering vs. something more material. In this scenario they might prefer dumping one/both of those guys to keep Horford and/or Kornet as well, even with Lopez. Or just backfilling with minimums to duck the tax while still adding Lopez to have a big man next year when Tatum is back (though he's kind of old to be signing him for what he'll bring in year 2).

Crunching these numbers... I don't really like it honestly haha

I like that, except I think they'd still try to shave more savings. Makes much more sense from Empty Pockets Chisholm's perspective to pay the really ancient Al the vet minimum (where else could he start?) instead of the merely ancient Brook $20M.

[Gant]

The Celtics either have to re-sign Kornet and Horford, or they have to make more trades. They probably make another trade even if they bring back both those guys. Tatum was the power forward, the leading rebounder, and the leading minutes player in the frontcourt. They need playable talls.

Right now in unfinished rosterland, the big forward is either Jaylen Brown, Hauser or Niang. That's not going to happen, is it?

[flintsky21]

If we move Simons, will we be comfortable with having only one true shot creator on the team?

[redslastlaugh]

When the Reiensdorf Bulls did this with Marquis Teague it was used in the media to represent the Bulls as a cheap, subserious clown show of an organization.

If a team is serious about winning titles, you need to use the draft to bolster your team by taking the BEST prospect on the board, not the best prospect who sign for less than 120% of scale or 80% of scale or whatever cheapout ask.

Jake fischer:

League sources say Boston has been so focused on its accounting that it took an interesting approach with the No. 28 pick.

In considering various prospects to select with that late first-round turn Wednesday night, sources say that the Celtics initially looked for players who would be willing to accept 80% of their rookie scale contract salary, which is the lowest figure first-round picks can be paid.

I don't think they are being cheap. The over the apron is so limiting that you can't win if you are a multiple time repeater. Flat out, this isn't only about money, it is about roster building. Yes, you can be cheap. It also don't be stupid .

If anyone is trying to think the owners are doing this because they are cheap, then you fundamentally do t understand the CBA. I don't care about lux tax, pay or don't pay, but they are tying salary management to ability it make trades and sign players.

As it turns out, they said Hugo Gonzalez refused an 80% of scale offer. But the point, is the we booked themselves so far over the line that it could have affected our ability to add rookie talent to the team.

I don't think that this is smart roster management. You can't overextend yourself so much financially that you can't draft freely. It's considered customary for a draftee to get a 120% scale offer and a huge dishonor if an agent does not get their draftee a 120% scale offer.

Its not cheapness per se, it's making tradeoffs. Last year, OKC had 8 players on rookie scale contracts and they played major roles. Celtics had two rookie scale players: Walsh and Scheierman. And those guys didn't play much of a role. Brad and Coaches made the choice to de-emphasize draft/rookies and extend vets to larger salaried contracts going way over the tax/apron line, and into the penalties.

I don't think whether a draftee will take $2.4 or $3 million should ever factor into who we select and we should always appropriately value the draft that we have room in the budget to offer our draftee the customary %120 of rookie scale salary.

[Curmudgeon]

If we move Simons, will we be comfortable with having only one true shot creator on the team?

You mean Payton Pritchard?

[Bill Lumbergh]

The front office won't be making any moves this year that aren't about 26-27 and beyond. If any of their moves this summer result in some success this year, it's gravy, but not the goal. Yes, I am Captain Obvious.

[cloverleaf]

The front office won't be making any moves this year that aren't about 26-27 and beyond. If any of their moves this summer result in some success this year, it's gravy, but not the goal. Yes, I am Captain Obvious.

No, they'll at least field a decent center rotation instead of making a mockery of their lineup and play for the year.

[Bill Lumbergh]

The front office won't be making any moves this year that aren't about 26-27 and beyond. If any of their moves this summer result in some success this year, it's gravy, but not the goal. Yes, I am Captain Obvious.

No, they'll at least field a decent center rotation instead of making a mockery of their lineup and play for the year.

If doing so won't in any way negatively impact 26-27 and beyond, it's fine.

[flintsky21]

If we move Simons, will we be comfortable with having only one true shot creator on the team?

You mean Payton Pritchard?

Touche

[celtxman]

Read on Twitter

Maybe that means they're losing Jerome who was great for them.

It may be more about dumping Garland. Mobley just exploded to $46M per, with Mitchell at $48M and Garland at $40M

[cloverleaf]

When the Reiensdorf Bulls did this with Marquis Teague it was used in the media to represent the Bulls as a cheap, subserious clown show of an organization.

If a team is serious about winning titles, you need to use the draft to bolster your team by taking the BEST prospect on the board, not the best prospect who sign for less than 120% of scale or 80% of scale or whatever cheapout ask.

I don't think they are being cheap. The over the apron is so limiting that you can't win if you are a multiple time repeater. Flat out, this isn't only about money, it is about roster building. Yes, you can be cheap. It also don't be stupid .

If anyone is trying to think the owners are doing this because they are cheap, then you fundamentally do t understand the CBA. I don't care about lux tax, pay or don't pay, but they are tying salary management to ability it make trades and sign players.

As it turns out, they said Hugo Gonzalez refused an 80% of scale offer. But the point, is the we booked themselves so far over the line that it could have affected our ability to add rookie talent to the team.

I don't think that this is smart roster management. You can't overextend yourself so much financially that you can't draft freely. It's considered customary for a draftee to get a 120% scale offer and a huge dishonor if an agent does not get their draftee a 120% scale offer.

Its not cheapness per se, it's making tradeoffs. Last year, OKC had 8 players on rookie scale contracts and they played major roles. Celtics had two rookie scale players: Walsh and Scheierman. And those guys didn't play much of a role. Brad and Coaches made the choice to de-emphasize draft/rookies and extend vets to larger salaried contracts going way over the tax/apron line, and into the penalties.

I don't think whether a draftee will take $2.4 or $3 million should ever factor into who we select and we should always appropriately value the draft that we have room in the budget to offer our draftee the customary %120 of rookie scale salary.

That's truly pathetic. Brad should feel like a munchkin with this getting out.

Good for Hugo not taking the bait.

[165bows]

By contrast I haven't heard any credible buzz about Sam Hauser's inclusion in serious trade conversations. The interest would surely be there given Hauser's perimeter prowess and the value contract he holds over the next four years, but the Celtics have largely achieved their financial goals by moving Holiday and Porziņģis. They don't have to trade Hauser. It is also presumed that the Celtics still hope to compete for a playoff spot next season even while Jayson Tatum recovers from a torn Achilles and Hauser figures to be an integral contributor to such aims.

Interesting. Might be a bit of a log jam with Hauser/Niang..and with Scheirman/Walsh/Hugo all trying to get some of those wing mins too..

Offloading Hauser would make it less of a logjam, while saving $ we can use to sign Kornet/Al..

There’s no logjam as I detailed in a prior thread they are down 2000+ minutes still and have the thinnest front court in the league right now.

[cloverleaf]

The front office won't be making any moves this year that aren't about 26-27 and beyond. If any of their moves this summer result in some success this year, it's gravy, but not the goal. Yes, I am Captain Obvious.

No, they'll at least field a decent center rotation instead of making a mockery of their lineup and play for the year.

If doing so won't in any way negatively impact 26-27 and beyond, it's fine.

Not having a laughingstock lineup in 25-26 supports 26-27 and beyond, but I know what you mean.

[cloverleaf]

By contrast I haven't heard any credible buzz about Sam Hauser's inclusion in serious trade conversations. The interest would surely be there given Hauser's perimeter prowess and the value contract he holds over the next four years, but the Celtics have largely achieved their financial goals by moving Holiday and Porziņģis. They don't have to trade Hauser. It is also presumed that the Celtics still hope to compete for a playoff spot next season even while Jayson Tatum recovers from a torn Achilles and Hauser figures to be an integral contributor to such aims.

Interesting. Might be a bit of a log jam with Hauser/Niang..and with Scheirman/Walsh/Hugo all trying to get some of those wing mins too..

Offloading Hauser would make it less of a logjam, while saving $ we can use to sign Kornet/Al..

There’s no logjam as I detailed in a prior thread they are down 2000+ minutes still and have the thinnest front court in the league right now.

Scheierman/Hugo can play 2/3 now, though it's not as if either is ready to command more than 24 minutes next year, and Walsh hasn't shown anything beyond deep bench at this point.

[cloverleaf]

Interesting. Might be a bit of a log jam with Hauser/Niang..and with Scheirman/Walsh/Hugo all trying to get some of those wing mins too..

Offloading Hauser would make it less of a logjam, while saving $ we can use to sign Kornet/Al..

There’s no logjam as I detailed in a prior thread they are down 2000+ minutes still and have the thinnest front court in the league right now.

Scheierman/Hugo can play 2/3 now, though it's not as if either is ready to command more than 24 minutes next year, and Walsh hasn't shown anything beyond deep bench at this point.

Similarly, Hauser and Niang aren't more than 24-minute men themselves.

[redslastlaugh]

My take is you do your evals, you have your big board, you get to #28 and you take your best available. If that was Hugo Gonzalez, great.

If that was another player, but that player refused to accept less than 120% of scale for pick #28, so we pivoted and took Hugo, that's bad.

According to spotrac, the 120% offer for #28 is $2,783,880. When Hugo signs his deal, his salary will become public. If his first yr salary is less than $2,783,880, Celtics fans will have their answer.
https://www.spotrac.com/nba/cba/rookie-scale

Good for Hugo not taking the bait.

[GoCeltics123]

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