New Lineup

msiris · Post #21 » by **msiris** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 9:42 pm

Playing CV more will not increase his trade value. Per 20 he is already up there, but people know what they are getting in CV.

msiris · Post #22 » by **msiris** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 9:46 pm

MickeyDavis wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

I can't believe you think mods shouldn't have an opinion. And my opinion is that Ersan was useless last year.

I do not know why Ersan was valued so much either. He did not display much and he is still not doing it overseas.
And mods are robot, so keep your opinions to yourself. :lol:

Post #23 » by **MickeyDavis** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 9:53 pm

Ersans basketball IQ was incredibly low. Maybe, someday, he'll contribute in the NBA. I doubt it.

xTitan · Post #24 » by **xTitan** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 10:05 pm

MickeyDavis wrote:CV being in the doghouse goes back to an incident that happened last season.

Intriguing, anything else you can say?

Post #25 » by **MickeyDavis** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 10:07 pm

I wish I could. I'll say there there was an incident between LH and CV when LH was still an assistant. And LH handled it perfectly.

oshmeehan · Post #26 » by **oshmeehan** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 10:19 pm

Larry Harris wasn't an assistant coach....

Post #27 » by **MickeyDavis** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 10:41 pm

Oops meant LK.

LISTEN2JAZZ · Post #28 » by **LISTEN2JAZZ** » Sun Feb 3, 2008 10:56 pm

I agree that Yi probably has more untapped potential than CV, but it isn't a 100% certainty that this is the case. It's possible that the two players are the same age - if they're the same age (both 23), does that change anything about who should be spoon-fed minutes and who should have to earn them?

europa · Post #29 » by **europa** » Mon Feb 4, 2008 3:26 am

MickeyDavis wrote:I can't believe there is a debate about Ersan. Did anyone actually watch him play last year?

I never understood the love for this guy last season. He spent most of the season playing like a D-Leaguer in my opinion. He was overmatched almost constantly, shot poorly for much of the season, wasn't a good defender and didn't play very intelligently much of the time. He hustled and that was good to see but that's all he really did. And now he's out of the league and may never return. He's another of Harris' poor second-round draft decisions.

As far as the new lineup, I'm fine with benching Yi but I'd prefer to start Ruffin. He isn't the offensive player Villanueva is obviously but unlike Villanueva, he plays smart, is a willing defender and will do the dirty work. I'd could see him being a Mark Pope-type starter at PF. Villanueva simply hasn't done anything in my opinion to merit being a starter.

WRau1 · Post #30 » by **WRau1** » Mon Feb 4, 2008 3:34 am

I'd take Ersan over Yi right now. At least Ersan went to go get the ball and wouldn't get out muscled by Earl Boykins.

okanoho · Post #31 » by **okanoho** » Mon Feb 4, 2008 6:16 am

Boykins?
lol

what you smoking
i think i can out muscle Boykin, so do you

paul · Post #32 » by **paul** » Mon Feb 4, 2008 6:25 am

I can't believe anyone proposing a new starting lineup still has Yi in it. Like Bobby or not, even when he's not playing that well and is a bit 'invisible' he's not hurting us and is trying to do the team things to contribute. Our starting lineup should be as below imo, and should have been since day 1.

Mo
Redd
Bobby
CV
Bogut

Chuck Diesel · Post #33 » by **Chuck Diesel** » Mon Feb 4, 2008 7:03 am

Once Ersan figures some things out I think he will be a contributing player on an NBA team, someone along the lines of Bostjan Nachbar. His work ethic is so good and he the tools, he just needs to put some things together and continue to learn the game. I hope he stays in Europe for another year and gets a lot of playing time. He's been improving as the season goes along in Spain.

In my opinion Villanueva's issues will prevent him from ever being a big part of a winning team. He might put up 16 and 7 in a contract year, but it won't be for a winning team.

BucksRuleAll22 · Post #34 » by **BucksRuleAll22** » Mon Feb 4, 2008 9:56 am

New line up should be

Ivey
Mo
Redd
CV
Bogut

Yi
Mason
Bell
Gaza needs playing time
Simmons

europa · Post #35 » by **europa** » Mon Feb 4, 2008 3:07 pm

Nobody else wants to give Ruffin a shot at PF?

smauss · Post #36 » by **smauss** » Mon Feb 4, 2008 3:41 pm

Isn't it interesting how we are looking for someone to play the 4 when we have attempted to fill that position twice? In all fairness, I know Yi is a rook and I don't expect anymore out of him than what we've gotten to this point. I believe he will be a good NBA player, but it just seems ironic to me to be having this discussion. CV is an absolute sieve on defense. When he came into Sat's game I was astounded at how many point in the paint Houston got. If CV goes off and scores big on the offensive end the Bucks still only net zero at that position because of all the points he gives up. Bogut has to run around helping out guys enough but when CV is on the floor, Bogut should trade in his sneakers for roller skates.......

Yi, even though he is learning the NBA game and gives up strength is still a much better defender than CV. Give me someone to split time with Yi that can defend; Ruffin is our only alternative at this time IMO.

BTW, I absolutely hate all the switching the Bucks do on defense! It tends to create terrible miss-matches and our guys tend to be out of defensive position even when they do switch. I just don't like it; maybe I just don't understand it but I saw Saturday, I didn't like.

Rockmaninoff · Post #37 » by **Rockmaninoff** » Mon Feb 4, 2008 3:54 pm

europa wrote:Nobody else wants to give Ruffin a shot at PF?

I do!

Bell/Williams
Redd/Williams
Mason/Simmons
Ruffin/Villanueva
Bogut/Yi

The Bell, Redd, Mason triumvirate coming from this article about NBA trios. It's a glimmer, but that's pretty much all we've got...

Yi would be just as good as Voskuhl at backup center, although I'm not sure if it fulfills 'The Promise'. We'd have defense in the starting lineup, and scoring to spare off the bench.

Ruffin is probably our best offensive rebounder and hustle player. In related news, Brian Skinner is putting up 3.5 pts, 4 rbs, and 1.3 blks per game, in 14 mins per game.

Epicurus · Post #38 » by **Epicurus** » Mon Feb 4, 2008 6:08 pm

paul wrote:I can't believe anyone proposing a new starting lineup still has Yi in it. Like Bobby or not, even when he's not playing that well and is a bit 'invisible' he's not hurting us and is trying to do the team things to contribute. Our starting lineup should be as below imo, and should have been since day 1.

Mo
Redd
Bobby
CV
Bogut

This was the intended starting five to start last season. Of course, Simmons injury prevented it from occuring. Maybe it is time to see if it works--good outside shooting from 4 positions to open the lane for Bogut.

Isocleas2 · Post #39 » by **Isocleas2** » Mon Feb 4, 2008 6:14 pm

paulpressey25 wrote:I can't defend CV....he's got all sorts of issues.....

But CV's situation is complicated because he's got a Chinese money machine playing ahead of him......and CV's poor defense is just magnified 10x because he's got terrible defenders in Mo and Redd out there as well.

We are losing by 44 points with Yi starting.....it can't hurt to start CV, let him accumulate some stats....at a minimum it will boost his trade value.

Exactly. If CV isn't in the future plans, and by all accounts he doesn't appear to be, then why not give him more minutes and let him throw down a couple double-doubles? The guy plays well when motivated, and right now he's motivated to get the **** out of Milwaukee.

paul · Post #40 » by **paul** » Tue Feb 5, 2008 2:28 am

Epicurus wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

This was the intended starting five to start last season. Of course, Simmons injury prevented it from occuring. Maybe it is time to see if it works--good outside shooting from 4 positions to open the lane for Bogut.

My thoughts exactly Epi. It also give us one decent 'post entry' passer in Bobby.