ImageImage

Blaming Michael Redd

Moderators: MickeyDavis, paulpressey25

BankIt
Junior
Posts: 252
And1: 0
Joined: Jul 22, 2007

Blaming Michael Redd 

Post#1 » by BankIt » Sun Feb 17, 2008 4:53 am

Excerpts from Sam Smith.

As difficult as it seems to comprehend now, Jordan still was struggling for recognition, especially among his peers, almost four years into his career. Perhaps it's a cautionary tale about wanting to see progress too quickly in players. Sure, Jordan was a star already and had set a record of 63 points in a playoff game.
But before that season his Bulls were a Pau Gasol-esque 1-10 in playoff games.

Hey, if he's so good, why can't his team win even a few playoff games? The whispers were growing louder around the NBA.
We all knew he was special," said Pat Riley, the coach of the Western Conference that year. "But at the time the Lakers were ready to win back-to-back. Yes, he began to change everyone's defensive rules, the Jordan rules. I remember having to defend him all different ways.

"Everybody in the league was thankful he didn't have the supporting cast at that time. But then the public was enamored with all the players in the '80s winning championships. Jordan was like an alien on his own planet."
That was, of course, when Jordan laid those 63 points on the Celtics, though the Bulls were swept in that playoff series. Could you distinguish greatness from selfishness? Was it just a talented player running up totals for a bad team?
"That's the coldest I've ever been in my life," Charles Barkley said. "Dominique [Wilkins] got robbed in the slam dunk. It's frustrating when a great player is not on a team that is that good. I felt that way with [ Kevin] Garnett. [ Allen] Iverson went through it. Michael was [going through it]. He has Brad Sellers and Dave Corzine. You can't expect much.

Poor Michael Redd. Even the greatest of all time with all his talent got the same treatment from fans and players. Damn unappreciative.
User avatar
ReasonablySober
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 106,963
And1: 41,489
Joined: Dec 02, 2001
Location: Cheap dinner. Watch basketball. Bone down.
Contact:

 

Post#2 » by ReasonablySober » Sun Feb 17, 2008 4:55 am

We're comparing Redd with Jordan now? Ok.
User avatar
paulpressey25
Senior Mod - Bucks
Senior Mod - Bucks
Posts: 62,521
And1: 29,523
Joined: Oct 27, 2002
     

 

Post#3 » by paulpressey25 » Sun Feb 17, 2008 4:59 am

DrugBust wrote:We're comparing Redd with Jordan now? Ok.


I can't tell if he's serious or sarcastic. Let's let him make his argument.
User avatar
th87
RealGM
Posts: 11,576
And1: 13,551
Joined: Dec 04, 2005

 

Post#4 » by th87 » Sun Feb 17, 2008 5:17 am

The "spirit" of it, I can see. I don't think Redd has yet figured out sharing and being efficient. This is the first year he's really had to try. I think we should give it time. But one of the backcourt has to go for defensive purposes.
User avatar
SugarRay34
Veteran
Posts: 2,914
And1: 11
Joined: Oct 10, 2003
Location: cappingthegame.com

 

Post#5 » by SugarRay34 » Sun Feb 17, 2008 5:20 am

The horrible thing about this is I think he is actually being serious when comparing a young Michael Jordan to Michael Redd. I wish we could become anything like the Jordan teams were in the late 80's early 90's just as an organization even
Bucks_Revenge
Banned User
Posts: 7,978
And1: 1
Joined: Oct 13, 2004

 

Post#6 » by Bucks_Revenge » Sun Feb 17, 2008 5:26 am

I agree that Michael Redd thinks he is Michael Jordan...
jeremyd236
General Manager
Posts: 7,927
And1: 16
Joined: Jan 07, 2005
Location: Appleton, WI

 

Post#7 » by jeremyd236 » Sun Feb 17, 2008 5:59 am

I don't think he's directly comparing Redd to Jordan in terms of style of play or anything (at least I'd hope not...)

I just think he's trying to say that even the best player to ever play the game needed help to win a ring.

I mean, you look at Jordan's teammates....

Some say Pippen would've been the best player in the NBA if Jordan didn't exist

Kukoc, a 6th man on the Bulls, may've started on any other NBA team.

Perhaps it's not fair to judge Redd yet considering he's never played with another All-Star on his team.

Hell, it took "better" players than Redd like KG, Pierce, and Allen all needing eachother to reach success.
Max Green
RealGM
Posts: 16,324
And1: 4,715
Joined: Jul 04, 2007
Location: Heelville
 

 

Post#8 » by Max Green » Sun Feb 17, 2008 6:04 am

jeremyd236 wrote:I don't think he's directly comparing Redd to Jordan in terms of style of play or anything (at least I'd hope not...)

I just think he's trying to say that even the best player to ever play the game needed help to win a ring.

I mean, you look at Jordan's teammates....

Some say Pippen would've been the best player in the NBA if Jordan didn't exist

Kukoc, a 6th man on the Bulls, may've started on any other NBA team.

Perhaps it's not fair to judge Redd yet considering he's never played with another All-Star on his team.

Hell, it took "better" players than Redd like KG, Pierce, and Allen all needing eachother to reach success.
Vice President of Parker-Nation.
#Jabariunleashed
#OwnTheFuture
:wizard: Maxtradamus
75totheMACCfund
Veteran
Posts: 2,600
And1: 47
Joined: Jul 16, 2006
Location: 53202
       

 

Post#9 » by 75totheMACCfund » Sun Feb 17, 2008 6:57 am

jeremyd236 wrote:I don't think he's directly comparing Redd to Jordan in terms of style of play or anything (at least I'd hope not...)

I just think he's trying to say that even the best player to ever play the game needed help to win a ring.

I mean, you look at Jordan's teammates....

Some say Pippen would've been the best player in the NBA if Jordan didn't exist

Kukoc, a 6th man on the Bulls, may've started on any other NBA team.

Perhaps it's not fair to judge Redd yet considering he's never played with another All-Star on his team.

Hell, it took "better" players than Redd like KG, Pierce, and Allen all needing eachother to reach success.


isn't Manu a 6th man? Didn't they win the championship last year? It's like the bulls of the 90s and the Spurs of today have some formula for winning it all?
Bucks_Revenge
Banned User
Posts: 7,978
And1: 1
Joined: Oct 13, 2004

 

Post#10 » by Bucks_Revenge » Sun Feb 17, 2008 7:23 am

75totheMACCfund wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



isn't Manu a 6th man? Didn't they win the championship last year? It's like the bulls of the 90s and the Spurs of today have some formula for winning it all?


AH....I think we are getting some where...like when Redd was a sixth man why couldn't we just keep that trend with Ray and Sam I am sure the right piece would of came..
User avatar
L&H_05
RealGM
Posts: 11,569
And1: 94
Joined: Oct 02, 2005
Location: I love this game !
     

 

Post#11 » by L&H_05 » Sun Feb 17, 2008 7:26 am

Blaming Redd is the right thing to do... He wanted the max contract, and with that he should take the responsibility for the team as it's leader...He wanted to be the man, he wanted his own team, and it's his job to help turn it around...

Look, speaking from a pure homer perspective, [Cavs Homer] the best thing that could have happened for everyone is Michael Redd signing with the Cavs in 05...

The Cavs would better off probably and the Bucks wouldn't have all this money tied into a guy that is not going to help them go anywhere...Maybe you are where you are now, but maybe not... Knowing what you know now and how it's played out, why wouldn't you go in another direction ??

Mike would be playing for a winning team and would probably be happy.. He would be on national TV all the time, and would probably get the proper recognition for his talents..

It's too late now, but for all parties involved it probably would have been the best for everyone, just on different levels... [/Cavs Homer]
Stopshere2
Head Coach
Posts: 6,001
And1: 38
Joined: Jan 01, 2006

 

Post#12 » by Stopshere2 » Sun Feb 17, 2008 7:34 am

75totheMACCfund wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



isn't Manu a 6th man? Didn't they win the championship last year? It's like the bulls of the 90s and the Spurs of today have some formula for winning it all?


The secret is convincing a starting caliber player that things will be better if he comes off the bench. In the Spurs case it's evidently true.

Coming off the bench, Ginobili averages 19/4/5. However, in 10 games as a starter this season he's had a whopping average of 25/6/6, albeit in 8 extra minutes. You get a guy that good coming off the bench and you'll have something special. As a 6th man, he's got similar numbers to Mo and he plays defence.
User avatar
Magic 32
Banned User
Posts: 69
And1: 0
Joined: Feb 10, 2008

 

Post#13 » by Magic 32 » Sun Feb 17, 2008 3:17 pm

L&H_05 wrote:Blaming Redd is the right thing to do... He wanted the max contract, and with that he should take the responsibility for the team as it's leader...He wanted to be the man, he wanted his own team, and it's his job to help turn it around...

Look, speaking from a pure homer perspective, [Cavs Homer] the best thing that could have happened for everyone is Michael Redd signing with the Cavs in 05...

The Cavs would better off probably and the Bucks wouldn't have all this money tied into a guy that is not going to help them go anywhere...Maybe you are where you are now, but maybe not... Knowing what you know now and how it's played out, why wouldn't you go in another direction ??

Mike would be playing for a winning team and would probably be happy.. He would be on national TV all the time, and would probably get the proper recognition for his talents..

It's too late now, but for all parties involved it probably would have been the best for everyone, just on different levels... [/Cavs Homer]


I agree with you! He should be the one to bring the team out of this hole. He put himself in this situation and it doesnt look like he knows how to get out of it.
User avatar
paulpressey25
Senior Mod - Bucks
Senior Mod - Bucks
Posts: 62,521
And1: 29,523
Joined: Oct 27, 2002
     

 

Post#14 » by paulpressey25 » Sun Feb 17, 2008 3:47 pm

L&H_05 wrote:It's too late now, but for all parties involved it probably would have been the best for everyone, just on different levels... [/Cavs Homer]


It's not too late....I'm the only guy on here willing to take a Redd for Gooden/Hughes/#1.

That deal makes sense to me from a Bucks perspective.....although I don't know if you guys want that. But with Bibby now gone, it is not looking like there are any trades you guys can make.
User avatar
kebzach
Bench Warmer
Posts: 1,397
And1: 11
Joined: Nov 13, 2006
Location: Illini Fan Trapped in WI

 

Post#15 » by kebzach » Sun Feb 17, 2008 4:01 pm

Bucks_Revenge wrote:I agree that Michael Redd thinks he is Michael Jordan...


And that's about where the comparisons should stop.
User avatar
Fight the Tank
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,059
And1: 0
Joined: Jan 21, 2008
Location: Healthy Players>Injured Players

 

Post#16 » by Fight the Tank » Sun Feb 17, 2008 6:37 pm

paulpressey25 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



It's not too late....I'm the only guy on here willing to take a Redd for Gooden/Hughes/#1.

That deal makes sense to me from a Bucks perspective.....although I don't know if you guys want that. But with Bibby now gone, it is not looking like there are any trades you guys can make.


I would do that too. I think you would need to add Gadzuric to that to make it work though.
"I just wanted to play because I just love the game," Jennings said. "It doesn't matter to me. I get up to play basketball. It's my job. I have to still be a professional and finish the season."
Newz
Banned User
Posts: 42,327
And1: 2,551
Joined: Dec 05, 2005

 

Post#17 » by Newz » Sun Feb 17, 2008 7:14 pm

kebzach wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



And that's about where the comparisons should stop.


Pfft, Redd has a better left hand than Jordan! :lol:
User avatar
L&H_05
RealGM
Posts: 11,569
And1: 94
Joined: Oct 02, 2005
Location: I love this game !
     

 

Post#18 » by L&H_05 » Sun Feb 17, 2008 7:43 pm

paulpressey25 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



It's not too late....I'm the only guy on here willing to take a Redd for Gooden/Hughes/#1.

That deal makes sense to me from a Bucks perspective.....although I don't know if you guys want that. But with Bibby now gone, it is not looking like there are any trades you guys can make.
It's not a deal that makes sense right now..When healthy our biggest strength as a team is defense and rebounding.... We lose both on this and a #1...

If they do anything, I think the Cavs make a minor move (maybe for Jack, Lowry or D-West in Seattle) and just roll with what they have...

Beginning this summer they will have 30 million in tradeable assets to work with...They really don't want to compromise this moving forward...
User avatar
Kerb Hohl
RealGM
Posts: 35,496
And1: 4,430
Joined: Jun 17, 2005
Location: Hmmmm...how many 1sts would Jason Richardson cost...?

 

Post#19 » by Kerb Hohl » Sun Feb 17, 2008 7:45 pm

They do both have the same first name. That pretty much means that we should have 6 O'Brien trophies and Redd minor league baseball jerseys in the coming years.
Newz
Banned User
Posts: 42,327
And1: 2,551
Joined: Dec 05, 2005

 

Post#20 » by Newz » Sun Feb 17, 2008 7:45 pm

L&H_05 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

It's not a deal that makes sense right now..When healthy our biggest strength as a team is defense and rebounding.... We lose both on this and a #1...

If they do anything, I think the Cavs make a minor move (maybe for Jack, Lowry or D-West in Seattle) and just roll with what they have...

Beginning this summer they will have 30 million in tradeable assets to work with...They really don't want to compromise this moving forward...


If you guys add Michael Redd I think you are the instant favorite to win the East.

Adding that type of scorer to team with LeBron makes that team extremely scary.

Return to Milwaukee Bucks