MVP Watch 2008... Part 3.

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Post#581 » by FlightNo.23 » Fri Mar 14, 2008 4:30 am

eatyourchildren wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
Less effective? Lingering injury? For a second there I thought you were talking about a real injury, like a sprained ankle or torn ligament or something.

Best case Scenario: LeBron mans up, plays through pain in his NONSHOOTING HAND (which, by the way, he only uses on layups anyway, since he doesn't have any left handed bank/hook shots) and they go 6-0 in that span. Worst case scenario: They go 0-6 in that span.

Oops, that actually happened. Please, don't talk to a Lakers fan as though a sprained finger is an injury you sit six games for. Don't go there.


Why are you trying to find fault with everything LeBron does? I'm not behind the scenes of the Cavs, but the truth of the matter is Mike Brown held him out of a few of those games and I think it was a team decision to shut him down for those games.
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Post#582 » by The MVPlaya » Fri Mar 14, 2008 4:36 am

Primetime match-up tommorow night for the top 2 MVP candidates. Huge game for both teams.
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Post#583 » by INKtastic » Fri Mar 14, 2008 4:39 am

semi-sentient wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Orlando and Cleveland would not meet because neither one of them have a chance at anything better than the 3 or 4 seed. The 4 seed is in the same bracket as the 1 seed (Celtics), whereas the 3 seed is in the same bracket as the 2 seed (Pistons). No matter how you look at it, the Cavs would likely have to go through Detroit and Boston to reach the Finals, and there is no way that Orlando beats either one of those teams in the 2nd round.

Edit: spelling


Yep, the order doesn't matter that much. The only place the seeding really matters in the east is you'd prefer to not open with Washington assuming Arenas is back and close to 100% as Washington will be a tougher out than their record would suggests and if you have Detroit and Boston ahead of you, you'd prefer to get out of the first round quickly. You'd actually prefer Washington was down in the 7 spot, but tonight's game hurt the chances of that.
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Post#584 » by Bgil » Fri Mar 14, 2008 4:41 am

FlightNo.23 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Why are you trying to find fault with everything LeBron does? I'm not behind the scenes of the Cavs, but the truth of the matter is Mike Brown held him out of a few of those games and I think it was a team decision to shut him down for those games.


So what? Tell Lebron to grow some balls and tell the coach to shove it. I've seen guys play through cracked ribs and broken jaws. Kobe played with a dislocated right shoulder that the team said would keep him out 8 weeks. He sat out 2 weeks and came back because he said he could shoot left handed.

Somewhere on the internet theres a picture of AI and it lists all the crazy stuff he's played through. IIRC he's broken fingers dozens of times.
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Post#585 » by HouMac » Fri Mar 14, 2008 4:43 am

FlightNo.23 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Why are you trying to find fault with everything LeBron does? I'm not behind the scenes of the Cavs, but the truth of the matter is Mike Brown held him out of a few of those games and I think it was a team decision to shut him down for those games.


My suggestion to LeBron fans is to stop bothering with this boob, eat your children. I put him on my ignore list a few hrs ago and would recommend all of you to do the same. He has absolutely nothing concrete to add and majority of his knocks against LeBron are nothing short of laughable. Since everybody and their mother knows nobody in the league could do more w/ this Cavs squad(he thinks CP3 can though :rofl:)....you know what his biggest argument against LeBron is? That none of the Cavaliers have had a career year playing alongside him(Gooden did, but he found an excuse for that too!) :rofl:. This is something he came up with once his LeBron-makes-his-teammates-worse BS didn't work. Apparently his teammates being far worse w/o him then w/ him isn't important to him. His teammates SHOULD PLAY CAREER BALL ALONGSIDE HIM! That's when you know somebody's really "making his teammates better" :rofl:. Although there isn't a single veteran whose ever played career ball with Kobe either(Fisher had his best year as a Warrior a couple of years ago, EOC). But that's not important.

Seriously, use the ignore list.
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Post#586 » by FlightNo.23 » Fri Mar 14, 2008 4:47 am

Bgil wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



So what? Tell Lebron to grow some balls and tell the coach to shove it. I've seen guys play through cracked ribs and broken jaws. Kobe played with a dislocated right shoulder that the team said would keep him out 8 weeks. He sat out 2 weeks and came back because he said he could shoot left handed.

Somewhere on the internet theres a picture of AI and it lists all the crazy stuff he's played through. IIRC he's broken fingers dozens of times.


Why are you Laker fans so concerned about six games that LeBron missed? He's played with a broken nose and you know what, LeBron knows his body and I'm going to trust the Cavs' medical staff and LeBron on his decision to sit out.
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Post#587 » by abarl » Fri Mar 14, 2008 4:50 am

Its too bad CP3 didnt have some fans behind him because he deserves some real discussion.

Enough with this LBJ injury stuff.....who cares....really....the last thing this young kid needs is an injury to turn into something more serious.

Players playing with injuries in the West is a different animal entirely........you dont get bye matchups against teams like Was ( had to throw it in :))
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Post#588 » by HouMac » Fri Mar 14, 2008 4:52 am

FlightNo.23 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Why are you Laker fans so concerned about six games that LeBron missed?


LOL, CUZ THAT'S ALL THEY HAVE. What else are they gonna say? LeBron's stats are too awesome? His team's record is too good? His team sucks too much w/o him? I mean, you don't even see any of 'em saying how LeBron's style of play hurts his teammates. A good majority of Kobe fans have begun watching the Cavs over the last couple of months(kinda like how most MJ fans follow Kobe). And surely anyone watching the Cavs would know just how godawful his teammates are. Did anyone watch tonight's game? LeBron's teammates looked utterly incapable of making a play once Washington turned up the D in the 4th qtr. And I'm not even exaggerating. They are just so darn pathetic. Coach Mike Brown included!

Oh, and not letting LeBron off the hook. He was poor tonight as well. His first off game in 3 weeks. Looked a little tired. Must get tiring carrying garbage every second on the floor.
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Post#589 » by eatyourchildren » Fri Mar 14, 2008 5:10 am

HouMac wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



My suggestion to LeBron fans is to stop bothering with this boob, eat your children. I put him on my ignore list a few hrs ago and would recommend all of you to do the same. He has absolutely nothing concrete to add and majority of his knocks against LeBron are nothing short of laughable. Since everybody and their mother knows nobody in the league could do more w/ this Cavs squad(he thinks CP3 can though :rofl:)....you know what his biggest argument against LeBron is? That none of the Cavaliers have had a career year playing alongside him(Gooden did, but he found an excuse for that too!) :rofl:. This is something he came up with once his LeBron-makes-his-teammates-worse BS didn't work. Apparently his teammates being far worse w/o him then w/ him isn't important to him. His teammates SHOULD PLAY CAREER BALL ALONGSIDE HIM! That's when you know somebody's really "making his teammates better" :rofl:. Although there isn't a single veteran whose ever played career ball with Kobe either(Fisher had his best year as a Warrior a couple of years ago, EOC). But that's not important.

Seriously, use the ignore list.


I broke things down, argument and by argument, and he basically just vomited out his responses. He lost his cool and never followed up any of my posts with structured arguments. He might as well have been arguing feelings and emotions.

His responses have repeatedly been stream of consciousness cesspools, and on top of that, he refused to admit the illogic of using on court/off court stats. I mean, I cornered him on it and he was still defensive about it. I mean, it's a matter of LOGIC, not even of subjectivity. You can't just keep stamping your feet and putting your fingers in your ears. That's childish.

I didn't even come up with an excuse for Gooden. What was the excuse? I was all for letting him come up with a list just as I had, and he always dodged it. I never once purported to dismiss his examples. I welcomed them, and wanted a full comparison.

Finally, there are veterans playing their best alongside Kobe. Pau Gasol and Derek Fisher (playing on less minutes) are the two most shining examples, shooting their best fg% ever, with comparable numbers the rest of the way.

His argument was always: LeBron's teammates are trash, they suck they suck they suck. But that argument can only get you so far. Especially if they played better elsewhere.

Don't pout, HouMAC.
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Post#590 » by RobertGlory » Fri Mar 14, 2008 5:28 am

abarl wrote:Its too bad CP3 didnt have some fans behind him because he deserves some real discussion.

Enough with this LBJ injury stuff.....who cares....really....the last thing this young kid needs is an injury to turn into something more serious.

Players playing with injuries in the West is a different animal entirely........you dont get bye matchups against teams like Was ( had to throw it in :))


cp3 has fans (like me). what he doesn't have is obsessed homers.

and "you don't get bye matchups against teams like washington"

gotta give it to you for the inadvertant low blow on cp3 fans, even when you go out of your way to praise him

i can't wait for tomorrow night. gonna DVR it while i work
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Post#591 » by abarl » Fri Mar 14, 2008 5:30 am

hahaah hey glory i was actually giving a shot to LBJ .....u know...like how clevland lost to them tonite.....


I have never given a low blow to CP3.....i luv the kid....so dont be such a senstive homer :) (jokes)
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Post#592 » by RobertGlory » Fri Mar 14, 2008 5:37 am

i think now it's clear-cut kobe and cp3, with bronbron clearly in 3rd tonight

winner tomorrow night becomes #1 to me
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Post#593 » by abarl » Fri Mar 14, 2008 5:39 am

RobertGlory wrote:i think now it's clear-cut kobe and cp3, with bronbron clearly in 3rd tonight

winner tomorrow night becomes #1 to me


It was clear after the performance Paul put on against San An

The cavs just have hurt LBJ's backing these last 2 games....


2morrow will be fun.....
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Post#594 » by eatyourchildren » Fri Mar 14, 2008 5:47 am

RobertGlory wrote:i think now it's clear-cut kobe and cp3, with bronbron clearly in 3rd tonight

winner tomorrow night becomes #1 to me


It's too bad Bynum's not back yet. I always like seeing him match up against Chandler.

I think it's clear what the approach v. Paul is for the Lakers. Let him score, score, and score some more. If Paul kicks out, it'll be up to his shooters to make those shots. Lakers can get hurt by 3's.
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Post#595 » by RobertGlory » Fri Mar 14, 2008 6:34 am

peja had 36 with 10-13 3's, and cp3 had 19 with 21 assists, a season high, in the fourth game of the season, a 118-104 hornets win.

five lakers were in double figures on january 9th, a 109-80 lakers win. kobe had 19, 7 rebounds, and 7 assists. bynum had 17 and 9 rebounds.
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Post#596 » by tkb » Fri Mar 14, 2008 8:29 am

What's up with the LeBron hating? The guy is a complete beast.

Watching him and Kobe will be a joy for years to come. There isn't an inch of doubt that they are the 2 best players in the league IMO.

Based on precedent I don't think LeBron should win MVP this season, but that doesn't mean I don't think he's worthy the way he's been playing. He's been insane this year.

I will feel like Kobe is robbed (and no, I didn't think he should have won MVP last year as I ranked Dirk nr 1) if he doesn't win this season unless he drops off the last part of the season.
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Post#597 » by Bgil » Fri Mar 14, 2008 8:42 am

HouMac wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



LOL, CUZ THAT'S ALL THEY HAVE. What else are they gonna say? LeBron's stats are too awesome? His team's record is too good? His team sucks too much w/o him? I mean, you don't even see any of 'em saying how LeBron's style of play hurts his teammates. A good majority of Kobe fans have begun watching the Cavs over the last couple of months(kinda like how most MJ fans follow Kobe). And surely anyone watching the Cavs would know just how godawful his teammates are. Did anyone watch tonight's game? LeBron's teammates looked utterly incapable of making a play once Washington turned up the D in the 4th qtr. And I'm not even exaggerating. They are just so darn pathetic. Coach Mike Brown included!

Oh, and not letting LeBron off the hook. He was poor tonight as well. His first off game in 3 weeks. Looked a little tired. Must get tiring carrying garbage every second on the floor.


I called it. People would start saying Lebron's new teammates suck as soon as they started underperforming just like his last teammates did. Clearly there is only ONE constant here and it's Lebron. Obviously, the Cavs style of play is not working well if they're 13th in a league of 30 teams (after being 6th last season).
Lebron = Michael Vick and the Cavs Offense = the Falcons offense.
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Post#598 » by NO-KG-AI » Fri Mar 14, 2008 11:10 am

Lol, you sound like the people who were saying the same things about Kobe.
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Post#599 » by prekazi » Fri Mar 14, 2008 11:29 am

I don't believe that Cavs style of playing isn't working because they're a back to back 50 wins team and they made the finals last year. With this squad and coach it's a huge achievement. You guys don't want to admit it but that's what it is. I agree Cavs have to change because they're a very limited team. LeBron has to carry all the load in an offensive system which DOESN'T FIT HIS GAME AT ALL. I can't imagine LeBron's numbers on an uptempo team.

Anyway injuries-bad schedule or not, 50 wins look impossible for the Cavs so LeBron is out of the question for the MVP race. I think it's between Kobe-Paul and Garnett from now on. Kobe is the leading candidate because his team is better than Paul's and his stats are better than KG.
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Post#600 » by Bgil » Fri Mar 14, 2008 12:22 pm

I don't believe that Cavs style of playing isn't working because they're a back to back 50 wins team and they made the finals last year. With this squad and coach it's a huge achievement. You guys don't want to admit it but that's what it is.


50 wins in the East was about equal to 44-47 wins in the West. A solid accomplishment and quite inline with the talent they have (had). getting to the Finals, and past Detroit, was overachieving big time though.

Not hitting 50 wins this season despite more teams doing it than ever before is vastly underachieving. Hell, Washington might hit 45 without Gilbert for most of the season.
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