Artest for Odom?

[eatyourchildren]

Lamar Odom is not versatile. People really need to stop saying that. If he's only good when the game is "wild and crazy" and not when things are slow in a halfcourt set, then that's not versatile. The fact that he can play all 5 positions but do none of them up to the level we want means he's a jack of all trades, master of none.

His drives are a dice roll--he hasn't shown an ability to use his off hand, he finger rolls every layup, and that's only if someone hasn't taken a charge from him because he hasn't learned how to use a hop step.

He shot ~65% free throws in the finals.

He has no midrange game.

[Bgil]

He shot ~65% free throws in the finals.

He has no midrange game.

Yes, but how does that relate to Artest? Ron has no mid-range and his free-throws are marginally better.

If he's only good when the game is "wild and crazy" and not when things are slow in a halfcourt set, then that's not versatile.

He's clearly versatile in other ways.

Lamar, finding his optimal role, was one of the major reasons we were as good as we were last season. A team 2 games from a title doesn't trade away one of its best players for Ron Artest. Odom and his passing, cutting, versatility, and speed at the 4 is basically the identity of our team. Changing that for Artest is just asking for disaster.

Unless Hinrich is in the deal as well then it's a no-go.

I'd rather play Bynum with the second unit so Lamar can get 25+ minutes at the 4 (and 8-10 at the 3) than trade him away for Artest. Kings have zero leverage, the inferior player with the attitude problem, and the team is going nowhere. Artest really really wants to come here. We have all the leverage.

They can have any combo of Farmar, Ariza, Luke, Vlad, Mihm, Sasha, Ronny, Yue, Karl, and picks but trading away a key piece to a near-championship team that just went through his best season ever (52.5% from the floor) is not a good idea. I think Mitch is thinking the same way and that's why the trade hasn't gone down already.

[semi-sentient]

Wait, people who watch games would take Odom over Artest REGARDLESS OF MENTAL ISSUES??

I'd have to strongly disagree, especially when you factor in how Odom disappears for huge stretches.

Sometimes Kings fans wish Artest would disappear offensively. He's shot them out of numerous games.

Let's not forget that Head-to-Head, Odom dominates Artest on both ends. He got laughed at when he botched to the media about Kobe not being man enough to guard him and someone reminded him that Lamar was locking him down.

That's not really a head-to-head matchup. Artest is busy guarding Kobe and expected to be the #1 option on the other end of the floor. That, and I don't ever recall Odom really shutting him down. Usually it's Artest taking a series of ill-advised shots that leads to his poor shooting, but then again he doesn't have his offense spoon-fed to him the way Odom does playing next to Kobe.

Whatever the case, Artest is being sought for defensive purposes, and in that respect, he's considerably better than Odom.

[tkb]

Kings have zero leverage, the inferior player with the attitude problem, and the team is going nowhere. Artest really really wants to come here. We have all the leverage.

Thanks for the laugh. I'm a big fan of Odom, but Artest as a basketball player is clearly better overall, and a better fit right now mind you.

[KF10]

God damn. So, many exaggerations and misconceptions about Artest. Especially, the Odom>>>Artest one.

[wfiles]

http://basketball.realgm.com/src_wireta ... or_artest/

Looks like this trade will happen soon if the Lakers are willing to take on Kenny Thomas' contract.

[CITYOFANGELSX3]

http://basketball.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/53612/20080716/lakers_still_the_favorite_for_artest/

Looks like this trade will happen soon if the Lakers are willing to take on Kenny Thomas' contract.

Thomas would fill Turiaf's role. But ill believe this trade when it happens.

[pillwenney]

For all of the games where Ron has been a hindrance offensively (on a consistent basis, not that many) there have been many, many more where he has basically won us the game on that end of the floor. His ball-stopping has become entirely overblown, probably because people are going off of reputation more than consistently watching him play this year.

[TonyMontana]

For all of the games where Ron has been a hindrance offensively (on a consistent basis, not that many) there have been many, many more where he has basically won us the game on that end of the floor. His ball-stopping has become entirely overblown, probably because people are going off of reputation more than consistently watching him play this year.

So true, I love the energy he brings.
I mean he does have the will and the desire to win, and I hope the Lakers do sign him.

[eatyourchildren]

Bgil, even assuming your assertion that Odom is a better player than Artest, this isn't a trade to just get/retain the best player available.

This is a trade to address specific needs:

The Lakers need at the 3-spot 1) another lock-down defender, 2) a good help defenders and 3) another player with iso-ability, and 4) someone who can shoot the long ball.

The Lakers can do without 1-man fastbreaks (because you dont get fastbreaks if you keep taking the ball out of the net), rebounding at the 3 (as shown by Phil's playing Vlad all the time), and passing at the 3 (see: Vlad).

Most importantly, the Lakers need someone who has balls and won't disappear under pressure (as evidenced by atrocious freethrow shooting in clutch and generally high-press situations i.e. the entire nba finals)

With respect to these needs, Artest is clearly the better player for the Lakers, even IF we believe your [incorrect] assumption that Odom is the better player overall.

[KB20]

Please get this done Mitch!

[semi-sentient]

For all of the games where Ron has been a hindrance offensively (on a consistent basis, not that many) there have been many, many more where he has basically won us the game on that end of the floor. His ball-stopping has become entirely overblown, probably because people are going off of reputation more than consistently watching him play this year.

I think the reason so many Lakers fans think he is a chucker and blows games is because he did exactly that this past season against the Lakers. However, I don't think that's much of a concern if he is traded to LA. In Sacramento, there isn't much choice except for Artest to try to take over down the stretch, whereas in LA everyone and their mama knows who the closer is. Not only that, but Pau Gasol is there in the event that Kobe is being swarmed.

Make no mistake, Artest's efficiency will rise with the P&G because the attention will be on Kobe and Gasol (just as Odom's, Kwame's, Mihm's, Gasol's, etc. increased). He's never played on a team that's been anywhere near as good offensively, so I'm sure he'll be able to find his place on the team without too much of a problem. If he doesn't, Phil will bench him for stretches until he gets with the program, just as he does with Kobe when he starts going into chucker mode for no apparent reason. That, and Bill has a lot of respect for Kobe, so I don't see him straying too often.

Get this trade done, I say.

[Bgil]

Bgil, even assuming your assertion that Odom is a better player than Artest, this isn't a trade to just get/retain the best player available.

This is a trade to address specific needs:

The Lakers need at the 3-spot 1) another lock-down defender, 2) a good help defenders and 3) another player with iso-ability, and 4) someone who can shoot the long ball.

Agreed but I'm not sold on Ron's iso-ability nor his outside shot. Historically, the guy has been a very low percentage-volume shooter. He gets his 20ppg but so did Ricky Davis in Minnesota. Artest is notorious for taking scores of bad shots. We don't need that. If iso-ability was what they wanted then they would have signed Maggette as he surely would have chosen us over anyone else.

I'd prefer a trade for Hinrich, who is also a lockdown defender, over Artest. His outside shot is also vastly superior, he's less of a headcase, and takes far fewer bad shots. Both have triangle experience. With Hinrich we can also pick up a good fit at SF with Thabo or Nocioni.

The Lakers can do without 1-man fastbreaks (because you dont get fastbreaks if you keep taking the ball out of the net), rebounding at the 3 (as shown by Phil's playing Vlad all the time), and passing at the 3 (see: Vlad).

I think having increased rebounding and passing at the three will only help us. Either way, I expect Odom to play most of his minutes at the PF position because Bynum surely won't be ready for more than about 30 minutes on the frontline, and Gasol will likely not play more than 35 either. That leaves another 31+ minutes at the 4 spot and I cringe thinking about who's going to cover those minutes if Lamar and Turiaf are gone.

Most importantly, the Lakers need someone who has balls and won't disappear under pressure (as evidenced by atrocious freethrow shooting in clutch and generally high-press situations i.e. the entire nba finals)

With respect to these needs, Artest is clearly the better player for the Lakers, even IF we believe your [incorrect] assumption that Odom is the better player overall

I believe Artest is a better fit on paper when everyone is healthy but I doubt our season will turn out like that. Big guys get in foul trouble, they get injured, and LO is our insurance policy for Gasol and Bynum. Unless we're getting two potential starters (Hinrich and Nocioni)

[CITYOFANGELSX3]

Wiretap says The mavs might be willing to trade howard for Artest.

[hoop_head]

Phil would have to bring the Zen with Artest, but I think Jackson would probably get the most out of Artest's talent. This seems like a smart option for the Lakers.

[dockingsched]

Wiretap says The mavs might be willing to trade howard for Artest.

doesn't make sense for the kings. howard is barely a yr younger and is an inferior player at the same position. they might as well extend artest before trading for howard.

[HarlemHeat37]

as a fan of a team that rivals LA, I'd want the Lakers to have Odom ANY DAY over Artest..Lamar Odom never scares me when my team plays him in any way..there's nothing about him that would scare me..Artest on the other hand..just his defense can impact the game at an great level..