Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
Well here is why Kobe gets so much credit.
Shaq had 7 years in the league(3 with the Lakers) b4 he won a title.
Not saying he wouldn't have won a title but he didn't. It only came after Kobe was an starter and all-star. Please remember he played behind good players Van-Excel and Eddie Jones.
For the 1st ring in his 4th season Kobe was 1 of 3 Lakers in double-digits the next player behind his playoff 21/4/4 was Glen Rice's 12/4/2.
The next ring 1 of 4 in double-digits. He moved his overall production up 29/7/6 the next options were Derrick Fisher(13/3/3) and Rick Fox(10/4/3).
The last ring again 1 of 3 Lakers in double-digits. He posted 26/5/5 next to Fishers 10/3/3
During this time Kobe was the Lakers leader in assist, best defender and best closer.
It is clear that the 3peat Lakers were Shaq/Kobe dominating the league.
Shaq had 7 years in the league(3 with the Lakers) b4 he won a title.
Not saying he wouldn't have won a title but he didn't. It only came after Kobe was an starter and all-star. Please remember he played behind good players Van-Excel and Eddie Jones.
For the 1st ring in his 4th season Kobe was 1 of 3 Lakers in double-digits the next player behind his playoff 21/4/4 was Glen Rice's 12/4/2.
The next ring 1 of 4 in double-digits. He moved his overall production up 29/7/6 the next options were Derrick Fisher(13/3/3) and Rick Fox(10/4/3).
The last ring again 1 of 3 Lakers in double-digits. He posted 26/5/5 next to Fishers 10/3/3
During this time Kobe was the Lakers leader in assist, best defender and best closer.
It is clear that the 3peat Lakers were Shaq/Kobe dominating the league.
Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
kasino wrote:Well here is why Kobe gets so much credit.
Shaq had 7 years in the league(3 with the Lakers) b4 he won a title.
Do you think you should look at his health and his competition at all?
I seriously don't know why I bother with you people.
Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
Gongxi wrote:kasino wrote:Well here is why Kobe gets so much credit.
Shaq had 7 years in the league(3 with the Lakers) b4 he won a title.
Do you think you should look at his health and his competition at all?
I seriously don't know why I bother with you people.
b4 I write can you make it clear what your asking?
are you asking about the competition Shaq had to go through in Orlando?
are you asking about his injuries do you mean 95-96?
did you read my post? I think its simple and informative.
Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
semi-sentient wrote:Just out of curiosity, what would Kobe's numbers have looked like from 2005-06 through 2007-08 if adjusted for pace using the years that Bird had his 3-year peak?
Anyone?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
kasino wrote:Gongxi wrote:kasino wrote:Well here is why Kobe gets so much credit.
Shaq had 7 years in the league(3 with the Lakers) b4 he won a title.
Do you think you should look at his health and his competition at all?
I seriously don't know why I bother with you people.
b4 I write can you make it clear what your asking?
are you asking about the competition Shaq had to go through in Orlando?
are you asking about his injuries do you mean 95-96?
did you read my post? I think its simple and informative.
I really did type something out. It had to do with Shaq's injuries throughout the mid 90s, his great successes with Penny, his amazing dominance, etc, and then contrasted that with Kobe, who came into his own while playing with this all-time great. But why bother? You don't care. You want Kobe to "win" these arguments and that's all. You don't come into them thinking "I'm going to be objective here" you come into it saying "How can I best argue for Kobe?"
So what does it matter?
Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
microfib4thewin wrote:Again, what rationale is there for Kobe to be above Duncan and Shaq with a 5th title? Saying that he will have more rings than both of them has never been a good argument because his role during the 3 peat was less than both Shaq and Duncan. Shaq and Duncan has spearheaded their team for 11 years, Shaq has been a good second option for two years, and Duncan is just entering that phase. Kobe has been a better second option than old Shaq and Duncan, but has only led his team as the best player for 6 years. That 5 year of difference cannot simply be made up with another ring because there is no evidence to suggest the young Kobe can win with a run of the mill allstar center back then like he does now.
8 time All-NBA 1st team
8 time All-Defense 1st team
7 Finals
5 Rings
Top 3 HCA efficiency ever
Kobe would have a very compelling case.
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
Gongxi wrote:kasino wrote:b4 I write can you make it clear what your asking?
are you asking about the competition Shaq had to go through in Orlando?
are you asking about his injuries do you mean 95-96?
did you read my post? I think its simple and informative.
I really did type something out. It had to do with Shaq's injuries throughout the mid 90s, his great successes with Penny, his amazing dominance, etc, and then contrasted that with Kobe, who came into his own while playing with this all-time great. But why bother? You don't care. You want Kobe to "win" these arguments and that's all. You don't come into them thinking "I'm going to be objective here" you come into it saying "How can I best argue for Kobe?"
So what does it matter?
Great success with Penny??? Shaq had the best supporting cast in 95' and got swept out of the Finals by a lesser squad and with HCA.
Amazing dominance??? Shaq was never 1st team in the mid 90's, and 2nd team once(1995).
Contrast with Kobe? When Kobe became a fulltime starter.....LA won the title and ended up with 6 Finals and 4 rings in 10 years. This could soon be 7 Finals & 5 rings in 11 years. Kobe is on the verge of 3 straight Finals appearance WITHOUT Shaq, and back to back titles.
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
Kobe can't lead a team without Shaq!
Kobe cant win without Shaq!
Kobe is the best one on one player whos allowed to go one on one because of Shaq!

Kobe cant win without Shaq!
Kobe is the best one on one player whos allowed to go one on one because of Shaq!

Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
AIRTIGHT wrote:han Hakeem and Shaq when it's blatantly obvious that Kobe has never spearheaded a championship effort or even an elite team effort in the fashion that Hakeem and Shaq have is hard to conceive as anythings other than outright 'Homer-ism'/'favoritism'.
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Kobe has already lead his team to a championship with less talent than Shaq ever did.
Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
Gongxi wrote:I really did type something out. It had to do with Shaq's injuries throughout the mid 90s, his great successes with Penny, his amazing dominance, etc, and then contrasted that with Kobe, who came into his own while playing with this all-time great. But why bother? You don't care. You want Kobe to "win" these arguments and that's all. You don't come into them thinking "I'm going to be objective here" you come into it saying "How can I best argue for Kobe?"
So what does it matter?
But in your mind Kobe is the inferior player and always well be. I never doubted Shaq's greatness but just wanted to make somethings clear.
You say his injures in the 90's well you mean 95-96 were he missed 28 games yet his team still finished with a great record 60-22.
Yes he had a great run with Penny. 1st round sweep/Finals sweep/ECF sweep
Yes Shaq was dominate and you really can't take nothing from that but wasn't winning.
Its really similar to KAJ and Magic.
Those Lakers weren't even as balanced as the Showtime who had great 3-5 options. It was truly just Shaq/Kobe.
All I'm saying Kobe gets as much credit as KAJ/Magic for those rings.
So his career is on the level with Shaq/Duncan and if he wins this ring I think he seperates from Shaq/Duncan to go with Bird/Magic.
Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
Of course in my mind Kobe is an inferior player to Shaq and always will be. Why? Because he simply was never as good as Shaq was, his longevity at this point is only comparable to Shaq- not better than- and he's declining as a player which means if he hasn't been better yet, there's really no chance he will be in the future unless he goes all Barry Bonds on us.
I'm sorry, but the only people that think Kobe Bryant is better than Shaquille O'Neal are Laker fans. What does that tell you?
I'm sorry, but the only people that think Kobe Bryant is better than Shaquille O'Neal are Laker fans. What does that tell you?
Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
Gongxi wrote:Of course in my mind Kobe is an inferior player to Shaq and always will be. Why? Because he simply was never as good as Shaq was, his longevity at this point is only comparable to Shaq- not better than- and he's declining as a player which means if he hasn't been better yet, there's really no chance he will be in the future unless he goes all Barry Bonds on us.
I'm sorry, but the only people that think Kobe Bryant is better than Shaquille O'Neal are Laker fans. What does that tell you?
Well your being close minded talking about me.
did you read anything I posted?
I don't know what the future holds for Kobe but at this moment on level with Shaq/Duncan and if he keeps winning....oh boy
Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
Not sure if this has been mentioned, but it's interesting to look at the retro player of the year votes here. Kobe hasn't won any of them, but has been in the top 5 in almost every year. In that regard, he's a bit like Stockton in terms of all time rankings, imo. Sustained dominance, but never head and shoulders above his peers. I've no problem with him in the top 10, but it's hard to say he's any higher if he's never totally been the best player in the league.
Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
kasino wrote:Gongxi wrote:Of course in my mind Kobe is an inferior player to Shaq and always will be. Why? Because he simply was never as good as Shaq was, his longevity at this point is only comparable to Shaq- not better than- and he's declining as a player which means if he hasn't been better yet, there's really no chance he will be in the future unless he goes all Barry Bonds on us.
I'm sorry, but the only people that think Kobe Bryant is better than Shaquille O'Neal are Laker fans. What does that tell you?
Well your being close minded talking about me.
did you read anything I posted?
I don't know what the future holds for Kobe but at this moment on level with Shaq/Duncan and if he keeps winning....oh boy
I give up. If you really think Kobe is on the Shaq/Duncan level...I just give up. I give up on you.
poopdamoop wrote:Not sure if this has been mentioned, but it's interesting to look at the retro player of the year votes here. Kobe hasn't won any of them, but has been in the top 5 in almost every year. In that regard, he's a bit like Stockton in terms of all time rankings, imo. Sustained dominance, but never head and shoulders above his peers. I've no problem with him in the top 10, but it's hard to say he's any higher if he's never totally been the best player in the league.
Yeah, that's the rub right there.
Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
Gongxi wrote:kasino wrote:Gongxi wrote:Of course in my mind Kobe is an inferior player to Shaq and always will be. Why? Because he simply was never as good as Shaq was, his longevity at this point is only comparable to Shaq- not better than- and he's declining as a player which means if he hasn't been better yet, there's really no chance he will be in the future unless he goes all Barry Bonds on us.
I'm sorry, but the only people that think Kobe Bryant is better than Shaquille O'Neal are Laker fans. What does that tell you?
Well your being close minded talking about me.
did you read anything I posted?
I don't know what the future holds for Kobe but at this moment on level with Shaq/Duncan and if he keeps winning....oh boy
I give up. If you really think Kobe is on the Shaq/Duncan level...I just give up. I give up on you.
you give up because you lost.
Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
lol at anyone trying to argue that Kobe vs Shaq/Duncan isnt even debatable.
Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
There needs to be a stickied thread outlining the criteria in comparing/ranking players.
Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
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Re: Where does Kobe rank All-Time with another Repeat?
There are only two guys in league history who have won NBA titles 10+ years apart in their career and averaged 35+ minutes per game in those years.
Bill Russell
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
If Kobe wins this year, he'll be the third.
Bill Russell
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
If Kobe wins this year, he'll be the third.