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[AQuintus]

http://www.canishoopus.com/2010/6/20/15 ... e-pa-rumor

Highlights:

The Twolves goal is to have "deals in principle" in place with as many players/teams as possible, so rather than starting negotiations when a FA of interest "pops up", a deal could be triggered immediately as the FA dominoes start to fall.

PA reported on one such "deal in principle". My FO friend says that that are actually a few "deals in principle" in place. And he expects even a few more to be made before July 1. Sorry - no names - in fact - I did not even ask. But my FO friend said that the Twolves were being "very aggressive" with their offers to make ours standout.

and:

I can offer a little more. Big Al will be involved in any major FA sign and trade. There is not much stomach to pay Big Al and a FA with the staff knowing that we still need more pieces (and time) to be a championship caliber team. Rather, we will be sweetening Big Al with current/future draft picks

[Klomp]

Thanks for posting this AQ

[shangrila]

Interesting. This just makes me want to get to the draft even faster.

[Krapinsky]

six to midnight

[Esohny]

I read the rest of his post. He says that they're looking to trade at least 1 of this year's later firsts and future Wolves 1st rounders along with Al to "sweeten the deal." I find this odd for a couple of reasons. For one thing, the other team would be getting a 1st rounder 2 years after we convey the 1st rounder to the Clippers; that seems like a gamble on their part that the pick is eventually worth anything, since a lot can happen in 3-4 seasons.

Plus, just who are we going after in a S&T that would get that many assets anyway? S&Ts aren't equal value deals usually, and I can't see us getting someone like Bosh, Wade, etc. So it makes it sound like we're going to massively overpay in a S&T for Gay or something.

Shrug. I think the draft and free agency just need to get here already.

[AQuintus]

I read the rest of his post. He says that they're looking to trade at least 1 of this year's later firsts and future Wolves 1st rounders along with Al to "sweeten the deal." I find this odd for a couple of reasons. For one thing, the other team would be getting a 1st rounder 2 years after we convey the 1st rounder to the Clippers; that seems like a gamble on their part that the pick is eventually worth anything, since a lot can happen in 3-4 seasons.

He also says that other teams don't have much faith in the Wolves ever being a good team. So who knows?

Plus, just who are we going after in a S&T that would get that many assets anyway? S&Ts aren't equal value deals usually, and I can't see us getting someone like Bosh, Wade, etc. So it makes it sound like we're going to massively overpay in a S&T for Gay or something.

Bosh, Amare, Joe Johnson, and Gay are the only one that make much sense. The article specifically mentioned FAs, but I think that there's a good chance their looking at Melo, too.

[Breakdown777]

The second quote in the OP is exactly what I assumed after I read the first one about the Wolves looking to be the most aggressive right off the bat. It matches the "Big Al in Demand" Thread/Rumor.
I don't think that the 23 is that much extra, but if you are talking S&T, then maybe it is. TOR is rumored to want a low 1st rounder for Ebanks, maybe MN caught on and Offered Al + 23 + gomes/filler/cap space.
If you are a team that knows you cannot keep your FA, and you know that you have a fall back option standing offer of Big Al before any other team makes an offer, that probably does make you look pretty appealing. I wonder how much all this work will pay off. I'm having my doubts if it pays off at all. How many "Fall back" options are really going to be necessary? I think most players will shoot for number 1 option at all costs. I also find it funny that from the sound of it the majority of the league, owners, and GM's don't take MN very seriously, think Kahn is a clown who is putting tons of effort into something that doesn't seem like a winning strategy, and doesn't believe the wolves will be good for a long time.
I hope future 1st rounders aren't involved, because it's pretty stupid for a team that's been in the lottery like 5 years, (and has gotten progressively worse each year) to trade future 1sts. I'd hope that they are at least lottery protected.

[Cyborg21]

Bye big Al?

[younggunsmn]

I read the whole thing. It's nice seeing that he is doing his due diligence chasing down all scenarios, but if he is SERIOUSLY considering letting another team dictate who we use one of our draft picks on, for a sign and trade that there is a small chance the player will even agree to, he is OUT OF HIS MIND and clearly learned nothing at all from the Flynn/Tyreke/James Johnson fiasco last draft. This also takes us out of good opportunities to trade up or down by essentially freezing the draft pick.

Joe Johnson, Amare, Bosh, Rudy Gay are the only likely targets. Of those Gay is the only one we have a reasonable shot at. But Why in the world would memphis take Al Jefferson but not be willing to match Rudy Gay? Thabeet is their only bad deal and he still has potential. I can see Kahn offering Al+ a future 1st for an overpaid Gay, and I don't think that's a good idea at all.

However Danny Granger is Base Year Comp until 7/1, which means he ain't going anywhere until then. I could totally see us drafting a player at 4,16,or 23 for Indy and trading it when the moratorium lifts in a package for Granger. That kind of deal is okay as long as you can trust whomever you are dealing with not to welch on it and you don't give up the farm for him.

Hopefully this is all smoke, and those "deals in principle" really involve us maneuvering in the draft and/or dealing Al or Love for a top 7 pick.

I'd blow it off as smoke, but JustAFan's "source" has been consistently anti-kahn, unlike the other ones that are for the most part giving a vague believable company line. That scares me a little as it might be an actual "leak" and not smoke they are filtering out there. Of course just as likely it's a lonely guy in his mom's basement.

If they trade for Melo without an extension and give up any decent assets, they should just fold the team, what an embarrassment that would be when he walked.

Much more likely "deal in principle" scenarios for our capspace involve us absorbing contracts and picking up assets (the opposite of his scenario). Miami may be drafting at 18 for US if we take a contract along with sending us a future 1st. So could Chicago at 17, or a team with potential tax problems like Utah at 9 or NO at 11. Such trades would probably be announced after the draft, even if they couldn't be executed for another 2 weeks, to prevent fans from falling in love with their draft pick.

Interesting with Utah telling D. Jones they were getting a pick in the 20's to convince him to come in for a workout. could be us at 23. 16+23 is interesting, could be memphis, they can offer 12+25. Maybe Pekovic+23 for 9, that would be awesome.

[Worm Guts]

I read the whole thing. It's nice seeing that he is doing his due diligence chasing down all scenarios, but if he is SERIOUSLY considering letting another team dictate who we use one of our draft picks on, for a sign and trade that there is a small chance the player will even agree to, he is OUT OF HIS MIND and clearly learned nothing at all from the Flynn/Tyreke/James Johnson fiasco last draft. This also takes us out of good opportunities to trade up or down by essentially freezing the draft pick.
.

That''s a big reach from what's been posted. The post said Kahn would attempt get deals in principal with as many teams as possible, that implies that the deals would be im place for whichever free agent accepts them. You can't draft for multiple teams. I'm assuming the deals would need to have some wiggle room,

[Worm Guts]

Joe Johnson, Amare, Bosh, Rudy Gay are the only likely targets. Of those Gay is the only one we have a reasonable shot at. But Why in the world would memphis take Al Jefferson but not be willing to match Rudy Gay? Thabeet is their only bad deal and he still has potential. I can see Kahn offering Al+ a future 1st for an overpaid Gay, and I don't think that's a good idea at all.

.

I don't expect we're offering Al and future firsts for Rudy Gay. It would be for Bosh or somether major free agent. My biggest concern here wouldn't be that Kahn's lining up a bad deal, it's would be that he's wasting his time lining up sign and trades for players like Bosh or Wade when there's no chance they would ever come here.

[St.Nick]

Again, I think this goes along with what I was saying. He's putting this out there to make the Minnesota Front Office LOOK LIKE they are trying to come through with a huge name with that cap room. It buys them some leverage in the court of public opinion when things don't work out and they have to take lesser FA's.

Savvy fans say, "gimme a break", but less intelligent fans will eat it up, letting dreams of getting Bosh, Wade, etcetera, make them believe that Kahn is doing a bang up job in trying to improve the team.

The proof will be in the pudding at the end of this FA season. If the team makes bad/marginal moves, its because Kahn didn't understand the circumstances or just chose to ignore them for his own good.

If he ends up with some impact players via FA and trade, then he'll have shown that he knows what he's doing and I'm the fool.

[mandurugo]

Again, I think this goes along with what I was saying. He's putting this out there to make the Minnesota Front Office LOOK LIKE they are trying to come through with a huge name with that cap room. It buys them some leverage in the court of public opinion when things don't work out and they have to take lesser FA's.

Basically, you think he's taking the New York approach. Hard to judge until we see how it plays out.

[Dewey]

Again, I think this goes along with what I was saying. He's putting this out there to make the Minnesota Front Office LOOK LIKE they are trying to come through with a huge name with that cap room. It buys them some leverage in the court of public opinion when things don't work out and they have to take lesser FA's.

Savvy fans say, "gimme a break", but less intelligent fans will eat it up, letting dreams of getting Bosh, Wade, etcetera, make them believe that Kahn is doing a bang up job in trying to improve the team.

The proof will be in the pudding at the end of this FA season. If the team makes bad/marginal moves, its because Kahn didn't understand the circumstances or just chose to ignore them for his own good.

If he ends up with some impact players via FA and trade, then he'll have shown that he knows what he's doing and I'm the fool.

Th emore I look at the Bosh situation, I'm not sure Toronto can find a better trade partner ... MN has a Big to give. Can Toronto get a PF better (20/10 guy like Al) than Bosh in return? Doubtful. Plus, we have leverage picks to add in as well. In principle, we'd send Jefferson/16/23 and still have the #4, Pekovic, some cap space. Maybe that would be left for the Melo deal ...

[Worm Guts]

Th emore I look at the Bosh situation, I'm not sure Toronto can find a better trade partner ... MN has a Big to give. Can Toronto get a PF better (20/10 guy like Al) than Bosh in return? Doubtful. Plus, we have leverage picks to add in as well. In principle, we'd send Jefferson/16/23 and still have the #4, Pekovic, some cap space. Maybe that would be left for the Melo deal ...

But it's not up to Toronto, it's up to Bosh. Maybe if we were to somehow trade for Melo or Chris Paul first, you could get some interest from Bosh. Then maybe you throw a big S&T offer at Toronto so they'll push Bosh towards Minny.
It still seems incredibly far fetched.

[St.Nick]

You guys have the pieces to get Bosh, but its not an ideal situation for a UFA aspiring to join a contender to come to a team that's just been gutted in order to acquire him.

The Melo deal makes more sense, if the Wolves are deadset on getting a big name. Love, Wesley Johnson, rights to Rubio for Melo. Big price to pay, but perhaps worth it, especially if Kahn could draft some ready to play role players and sign some decent vets in FA.

Flynn/Sessions
A.Morrow/Ellington
Melo/C.Brewer/Q.Poindexter
A.Jefferson/L.Sanders
Darko/Pekovic

Meh...better, but not earth shattering. I still think its unlikely to add someone like Melo for too many reasons.

[Dewey]

Th emore I look at the Bosh situation, I'm not sure Toronto can find a better trade partner ... MN has a Big to give. Can Toronto get a PF better (20/10 guy like Al) than Bosh in return? Doubtful. Plus, we have leverage picks to add in as well. In principle, we'd send Jefferson/16/23 and still have the #4, Pekovic, some cap space. Maybe that would be left for the Melo deal ...

But it's not up to Toronto, it's up to Bosh. Maybe if we were to somehow trade for Melo or Chris Paul first, you could get some interest from Bosh. Then maybe you throw a big S&T offer at Toronto so they'll push Bosh towards Minny.
It still seems incredibly far fetched.

Ya I realize it's up to Bosh, but naturally feel like it will be somewhat favorable for the teams as well, and from what I understand, Bosh may be somewhat accommodating as long as it does not impact his long-term goals.

We have some pieces to work with, but we do need to account for our teams lack of leadership ... a guy like Bosh DOES have to have confidence that K.Rambis and D.Kahn can/will put things together. Naturally, it would help if Bosh knew another FA could be aquired this off-season before adding Rubio next year. Guys like Gomes, Ellington, Hollins, Wilkins, Sessions, etc are not real attractive.

[Dewey]

You guys have the pieces to get Bosh, but its not an ideal situation for a UFA aspiring to join a contender to come to a team that's just been gutted in order to acquire him.

The Melo deal makes more sense, if the Wolves are deadset on getting a big name. Love, Wesley Johnson, rights to Rubio for Melo. Big price to pay, but perhaps worth it, especially if Kahn could draft some ready to play role players and sign some decent vets in FA.

Flynn/Sessions
A.Morrow/Ellington
Melo/C.Brewer/Q.Poindexter
A.Jefferson/L.Sanders
Darko/Pekovic

Meh...better, but not earth shattering. I still think its unlikely to add someone like Melo for too many reasons.

Wolves will never let 3 assets go for a player with only 1 year left on his contract, especially, when one of them is the Rube.

[Worm Guts]

Wolves will never let 3 assets go for a player with only 1 year left on his contract, especially, when one of them is the Rube.

I wouldn't say that. I think the only shot we'd have to get Bosh would be to get Melo. And to get Melo you'd have to gamble on him only having 1 year left on his contract.

[TRUEwolvesFAN04]

The only way we are going to trade for Melo is if he agrees to an extension first.