Worst contract so far?

[KL78192020]

The worst is yet to come..."Harrison Barnes signs for 5/$130" realgm in shambles..

[DeezRaptors]

I say it's Mozgov. I watched a bunch of film on their rookie Zubac and I think he is already as good as Mozgov who has already started his decline. They didn't need him.

That's false. Mozgov didnt get playing time much last year cause the Cavs used a different style. Hos first year with them he played well. The Lakers hsd to use 90% of the cap space this yesr so they had to sign someone to fill that in so they dont get penalized.

[DrClutch]

I don't get the Derozan. We're getting him from 26-31 (his prime). He's a 23, 4 and 4 guy with a high usage (granted not great efficiency).

The contract isn't great, but it isn't close to the worst contracts being handed out this offseason.

If you saw the playoffs he was a no show, derozan struggles to make shot & play d ... DC benched him couple of times so raps would get back in game... yeah he's still young but we'll see if getting 45 mill extra pays off

[Duffman100]

I don't get the Derozan. We're getting him from 26-31 (his prime). He's a 23, 4 and 4 guy with a high usage (granted not great efficiency).

The contract isn't great, but it isn't close to the worst contracts being handed out this offseason.

If you saw the playoffs he was a no show, derozan struggles to make shot & play d ... DC benched him couple of times so raps would get back in game... yeah he's still young but we'll see if getting 45 mill extra pays off

He actually improved as the playoffs went on.

[Austincys21]

Grizzles overall... Although if they can finally stay healthy always needed a shooter. Parsons can hurt or really really help them.

Conley
Allen
Parsons
Zbo
Gasol

Can be ok ecspevially with Vogel. But dam that money

[GopherIt!]

Mike Conley: $153M
NBA free agent contracts: $1.75B
Armchair GM'ing from my mom's basement: priceless

[Viper1500]

Grizzles overall... Although if they can finally stay healthy always needed a shooter. Parsons can hurt or really really help them.

Conley
Allen
Parsons
Zbo
Gasol

Can be ok ecspevially with Vogel. But dam that money

what?

[Austincys21]

Grizzles overall... Although if they can finally stay healthy always needed a shooter. Parsons can hurt or really really help them.

Conley
Allen
Parsons
Zbo
Gasol

Can be ok ecspevially with Vogel. But dam that money

what?

Didn't they hire Vogel. The Pacers ex coach ?

[Rapaz]

Grizzles overall... Although if they can finally stay healthy always needed a shooter. Parsons can hurt or really really help them.

Conley
Allen
Parsons
Zbo
Gasol

Can be ok ecspevially with Vogel. But dam that money

what?

Didn't they hire Vogel. The Pacers ex coach ?

Orlando hired Vogel. Memphis hired this fine woman's husband:

[Capn'O]

Re: Noah. The size of the contract doesn't bother me, and I totally get why Jackson would want to take a shot at Noah - he's a beautiful passer and Phil loves those...but the way the Knicks basically continue to double down on a core more focused on Melo than KP to me screams that they are about to fall into the same trap they always fall into.

Before KP was such a hit, I would have merely sighed because it's not like I saw anything else enticing to do with the roster. But once you get someone like KP, that's your new franchise. Fine to keep Melo, particularly since you may not have a choice, but working to build around Melo's biological clock is precisely what you don't want your GM to do. It could be Dolan of course, but the additional concerns is that we may end up concluding that as a GM, Phil Jackson is a heck of a coach.

(Of course, a heck of a coach to me seems like he wouldn't be salivating over this team either, but I'll give Phil and his 11 rings the benefit of the doubt on that one.)

What Phil is saying publicly is that he doesn't want to put KP in a losing situation early in his career and have him get accustomed to it. A guy like Noah, in particular, is a winner and is actually a great stylistic fit next to KP as an elite rebounder, defender, and passer. He's a mentor to the Knicks' young slew of bigs as well as a guy that can still anchor a defense. I think there is some merit in that.

That said, Zach Lowe reported yesterday that the Knicks entertained Melo deals but once Cleveland won it all (and will likely stand pat) there really wasn't a destination that he would agree to. So Melo's here and has dug his heels in on that matter. The Rose move is much more of a "Melo timeline" move than the Noah one imo. I can tell you right here that the Knicks successes depend a lot more on Derrick Rose's health than Joakim Noah one way or another. At this point in his career, Joakim can put a good team with scoring over the top but if you don't have elite offensive players with him he's less effective. Without Rose, they will have trouble scoring and particularly so when Melo is on the bench.

At the end of the day, free agency isn't really the place to get KP a running mate on his timeline. You do it through the draft or via trading young players and the Knicks were bereft of their picks this year. Now, they have all their firsts going forward and what projects to be a decent second from the Bulls. So I think Phil figured that you get Rose. If he's healthy, you have a good year. If he's not, you probably don't and maybe you have a chance of getting that guy in next year's stacked draft. If that happens, having a vet like Noah still helps in the long term. Melo's happy because you tried. The environment is good.

[deanwoof]

what?

Didn't they hire Vogel. The Pacers ex coach ?

Orlando hired Vogel. Memphis hired this fine woman's husband:

Almost looks like she has a dick or a tail

[Doctor MJ]

Re: Noah. The size of the contract doesn't bother me, and I totally get why Jackson would want to take a shot at Noah - he's a beautiful passer and Phil loves those...but the way the Knicks basically continue to double down on a core more focused on Melo than KP to me screams that they are about to fall into the same trap they always fall into.

Before KP was such a hit, I would have merely sighed because it's not like I saw anything else enticing to do with the roster. But once you get someone like KP, that's your new franchise. Fine to keep Melo, particularly since you may not have a choice, but working to build around Melo's biological clock is precisely what you don't want your GM to do. It could be Dolan of course, but the additional concerns is that we may end up concluding that as a GM, Phil Jackson is a heck of a coach.

(Of course, a heck of a coach to me seems like he wouldn't be salivating over this team either, but I'll give Phil and his 11 rings the benefit of the doubt on that one.)

What Phil is saying publicly is that he doesn't want to put KP in a losing situation early in his career and have him get accustomed to it. A guy like Noah, in particular, is a winner and is actually a great stylistic fit next to KP as an elite rebounder, defender, and passer. He's a mentor to the Knicks' young slew of bigs as well as a guy that can still anchor a defense. I think there is some merit in that.

That said, Zach Lowe reported yesterday that the Knicks entertained Melo deals but once Cleveland won it all (and will likely stand pat) there really wasn't a destination that he would agree to. So Melo's here and has dug his heels in on that matter. The Rose move is much more of a "Melo timeline" move than the Noah one imo. I can tell you right here that the Knicks successes depend a lot more on Derrick Rose's health than Joakim Noah one way or another. At this point in his career, Joakim can put a good team with scoring over the top but if you don't have elite offensive players with him he's less effective. Without Rose, they will have trouble scoring and particularly so when Melo is on the bench.

At the end of the day, free agency isn't really the place to get KP a running mate on his timeline. You do it through the draft or via trading young players and the Knicks were bereft of their picks this year. Now, they have all their firsts going forward and what projects to be a decent second from the Bulls. So I think Phil figured that you get Rose. If he's healthy, you have a good year. If he's not, you probably don't and maybe you have a chance of getting that guy in next year's stacked draft. If that happens, having a vet like Noah still helps in the long term. Melo's happy because you tried. The environment is good.

Good post.

I think the fundamental issue I have isn't that they should be going after guys in free agency around KP's age because you're right that's not possible, rather it's that if you know KP is your franchise, you need to make sure you're not doing anything that may make it harder to build around him.

If everything goes perfectly with these signings it won't be an issue. You'll have a team that isn't a serious contender, but it's at least good, and that and the draw of New York will help sign other guys to actually help KP when the time comes.

But of course, we haven't seen things go perfectly for the Knicks in a long time for a reason. I look at Rose and Noah and see that at best they help the team still-not-win-titles, and at worst, they continue to leave the team paying too much for guys who aren't helping at all.

[Grits n Gravy]

what?

Didn't they hire Vogel. The Pacers ex coach ?

Orlando hired Vogel. Memphis hired this fine woman's husband:

Dam Fizz - Eva Mendes look a like

[rcfc1]

I've basically been projectile vomiting nonstop since free agency opened.

[Capn'O]

Re: Noah. The size of the contract doesn't bother me, and I totally get why Jackson would want to take a shot at Noah - he's a beautiful passer and Phil loves those...but the way the Knicks basically continue to double down on a core more focused on Melo than KP to me screams that they are about to fall into the same trap they always fall into.

Before KP was such a hit, I would have merely sighed because it's not like I saw anything else enticing to do with the roster. But once you get someone like KP, that's your new franchise. Fine to keep Melo, particularly since you may not have a choice, but working to build around Melo's biological clock is precisely what you don't want your GM to do. It could be Dolan of course, but the additional concerns is that we may end up concluding that as a GM, Phil Jackson is a heck of a coach.

(Of course, a heck of a coach to me seems like he wouldn't be salivating over this team either, but I'll give Phil and his 11 rings the benefit of the doubt on that one.)

What Phil is saying publicly is that he doesn't want to put KP in a losing situation early in his career and have him get accustomed to it. A guy like Noah, in particular, is a winner and is actually a great stylistic fit next to KP as an elite rebounder, defender, and passer. He's a mentor to the Knicks' young slew of bigs as well as a guy that can still anchor a defense. I think there is some merit in that.

That said, Zach Lowe reported yesterday that the Knicks entertained Melo deals but once Cleveland won it all (and will likely stand pat) there really wasn't a destination that he would agree to. So Melo's here and has dug his heels in on that matter. The Rose move is much more of a "Melo timeline" move than the Noah one imo. I can tell you right here that the Knicks successes depend a lot more on Derrick Rose's health than Joakim Noah one way or another. At this point in his career, Joakim can put a good team with scoring over the top but if you don't have elite offensive players with him he's less effective. Without Rose, they will have trouble scoring and particularly so when Melo is on the bench.

At the end of the day, free agency isn't really the place to get KP a running mate on his timeline. You do it through the draft or via trading young players and the Knicks were bereft of their picks this year. Now, they have all their firsts going forward and what projects to be a decent second from the Bulls. So I think Phil figured that you get Rose. If he's healthy, you have a good year. If he's not, you probably don't and maybe you have a chance of getting that guy in next year's stacked draft. If that happens, having a vet like Noah still helps in the long term. Melo's happy because you tried. The environment is good.

Good post.

I think the fundamental issue I have isn't that they should be going after guys in free agency around KP's age because you're right that's not possible, rather it's that if you know KP is your franchise, you need to make sure you're not doing anything that may make it harder to build around him.

If everything goes perfectly with these signings it won't be an issue. You'll have a team that isn't a serious contender, but it's at least good, and that and the draw of New York will help sign other guys to actually help KP when the time comes.

But of course, we haven't seen things go perfectly for the Knicks in a long time for a reason. I look at Rose and Noah and see that at best they help the team still-not-win-titles, and at worst, they continue to leave the team paying too much for guys who aren't helping at all.

I don't disagree. In any event - Melo/KP is the Great Knick Tension right now. In some sense, it's a good problem to have in that it means the Knicks actually drafted a franchise player and plan to keep him and Melo is still a force on offense. They get along really well with KP learning a lot from Melo. But at some point something has to give if it doesn't lead to _some_ on court success. I wonder what happens if/when Rose breaks down. Does Melo make the call then and waive his NTC* or is he hunkering down for the long haul? Stay tuned!

*

Spoiler:

I do like that Clarkson contract. He can be a piece of it

[Doctor MJ]

What Phil is saying publicly is that he doesn't want to put KP in a losing situation early in his career and have him get accustomed to it. A guy like Noah, in particular, is a winner and is actually a great stylistic fit next to KP as an elite rebounder, defender, and passer. He's a mentor to the Knicks' young slew of bigs as well as a guy that can still anchor a defense. I think there is some merit in that.

That said, Zach Lowe reported yesterday that the Knicks entertained Melo deals but once Cleveland won it all (and will likely stand pat) there really wasn't a destination that he would agree to. So Melo's here and has dug his heels in on that matter. The Rose move is much more of a "Melo timeline" move than the Noah one imo. I can tell you right here that the Knicks successes depend a lot more on Derrick Rose's health than Joakim Noah one way or another. At this point in his career, Joakim can put a good team with scoring over the top but if you don't have elite offensive players with him he's less effective. Without Rose, they will have trouble scoring and particularly so when Melo is on the bench.

At the end of the day, free agency isn't really the place to get KP a running mate on his timeline. You do it through the draft or via trading young players and the Knicks were bereft of their picks this year. Now, they have all their firsts going forward and what projects to be a decent second from the Bulls. So I think Phil figured that you get Rose. If he's healthy, you have a good year. If he's not, you probably don't and maybe you have a chance of getting that guy in next year's stacked draft. If that happens, having a vet like Noah still helps in the long term. Melo's happy because you tried. The environment is good.

Good post.

I think the fundamental issue I have isn't that they should be going after guys in free agency around KP's age because you're right that's not possible, rather it's that if you know KP is your franchise, you need to make sure you're not doing anything that may make it harder to build around him.

If everything goes perfectly with these signings it won't be an issue. You'll have a team that isn't a serious contender, but it's at least good, and that and the draw of New York will help sign other guys to actually help KP when the time comes.

But of course, we haven't seen things go perfectly for the Knicks in a long time for a reason. I look at Rose and Noah and see that at best they help the team still-not-win-titles, and at worst, they continue to leave the team paying too much for guys who aren't helping at all.

I don't disagree. In any event - Melo/KP is the Great Knick Tension right now. In some sense, it's a good problem to have in that it means the Knicks actually drafted a franchise player and plan to keep him and Melo is still a force on offense. They get along really well with KP learning a lot from Melo. But at some point something has to give if it doesn't lead to _some_ on court success. I wonder what happens if/when Rose breaks down. Does Melo make the call then and waive his NTC* or is he hunkering down for the long haul? Stay tuned!

*

Spoiler:

I do like that Clarkson contract. He can be a piece of it

The thing about that tension is that it was there even before they got KP. If Phil was really looking to patiently build a healthy context in New York in contrast to what everyone's done in NY for the past decade plus, it didn't make sense to re-sign Melo at all. They re-signed him because they didn't have anything else going for them, and now they are signing more guys basically because otherwise you have to acknowledge re-signing Melo was a mistake.

So yeah, all of this would be true even if KP were a bust, but I had hoped that KP being such a hit would let Phil gracefully pull the franchise away from brink, and instead to me it just looks like they literally weren't prepared to actually capitalize in the event that their high draft picks weren't busts.

[Ballerhogger]

i think Noah is the worst. He's a older defender with no offensive at all. Mosgov is pretty bad but i think he can have good year as starting player.

[Capn'O]

Good post.

I think the fundamental issue I have isn't that they should be going after guys in free agency around KP's age because you're right that's not possible, rather it's that if you know KP is your franchise, you need to make sure you're not doing anything that may make it harder to build around him.

If everything goes perfectly with these signings it won't be an issue. You'll have a team that isn't a serious contender, but it's at least good, and that and the draw of New York will help sign other guys to actually help KP when the time comes.

But of course, we haven't seen things go perfectly for the Knicks in a long time for a reason. I look at Rose and Noah and see that at best they help the team still-not-win-titles, and at worst, they continue to leave the team paying too much for guys who aren't helping at all.

I don't disagree. In any event - Melo/KP is the Great Knick Tension right now. In some sense, it's a good problem to have in that it means the Knicks actually drafted a franchise player and plan to keep him and Melo is still a force on offense. They get along really well with KP learning a lot from Melo. But at some point something has to give if it doesn't lead to _some_ on court success. I wonder what happens if/when Rose breaks down. Does Melo make the call then and waive his NTC* or is he hunkering down for the long haul? Stay tuned!

*

Spoiler:

I do like that Clarkson contract. He can be a piece of it

The thing about that tension is that it was there even before they got KP. If Phil was really looking to patiently build a healthy context in New York in contrast to what everyone's done in NY for the past decade plus, it didn't make sense to re-sign Melo at all. They re-signed him because they didn't have anything else going for them, and now they are signing more guys basically because otherwise you have to acknowledge re-signing Melo was a mistake.

So yeah, all of this would be true even if KP were a bust, but I had hoped that KP being such a hit would let Phil gracefully pull the franchise away from brink, and instead to me it just looks like they literally weren't prepared to actually capitalize in the event that their high draft picks weren't busts.

They were definitely not ready for him to be this good this fast.

[SF_Warriors]

Ummm... Turner played really well with the Celts and won them quite a few games. He's not a franchise player, but he's a better player than he was with the 76ers.

A broken clock is right twice a day.

Except he was good all season.....

Ive been down on turner his career thus far, but he had a respectable season

Was especially impressed with his rebounding and assists #s although he was always a good rebounder for his size.

The contract is absolutely disgusting however

[suntzuballin]

A majority of them and more to come .NBA is gonna have a real rude awaking soon.

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