The ROTY/Rookie Discussion Thread, Part III

[RB34]

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14-36

[the_process]

Mitchell is unreal. He has to be ROTY.

Love Mitchell. Would be good with me if he and Simmons split the ROY award.

That being said, Mitchell has been handed the keys to the Jazz in a way Ben has not with Philly. The Jazz have no one else who can volume score. He was awesome tonight against SA... and had 35 points on 34 shots. Not overly impressive. And it’s like that every night. Other than shooting and scoring, Simmons is objectively better at everything else on the basketball court.

[clyde21]

14-34.......

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14-36

So what? He's a rookie. The fact that he's carrying the offense load for Utah almost single-handedly and not backing down is incredible. Defenses are throwing the entire book on him and he's still producing.

#Legend

[RB34]

14-34.......

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14-36

So what? He's a rookie. The fact that he's carrying the offense load for Utah almost single-handedly and not backing down is incredible. Defenses are throwing the entire book on him and he's still producing.

#Legend

Just trying to look at it the same way Ben Simmons get looked at.

[clyde21]

14-36

So what? He's a rookie. The fact that he's carrying the offense load for Utah almost single-handedly and not backing down is incredible. Defenses are throwing the entire book on him and he's still producing.

#Legend

Just trying to look at it the same way Ben Simmons get looked at.

Ben Simmons doesn't have the onus of carrying the entire Sixers offense on his shoulders, and I don't think he'll ever have to shoot it 35 times. It's a non-point.

[michaelm]

The game is 4 quarters. If not for his teammates carrying the load for 3/4's of a game it wouldn't even matter what DM did in the 4th.

Simmons plays a full 3 to 4 quarters every game, whether it is scoring, or getting his teammates going or playing lockdown defense.

To be clear, I am Australian and an out and out Simmons fan, but am annoyed by those who feel the need to deride another great young player in Mitchell.

And yes the game is played over 4 quarters, and what matters I would have thought is a player's team winning the game, whether by a consistent level of play over the whole 4 quarters or by better play/clutch shooting in the 4th quarter. Both players haven't played 82 games yet, and both Simmons' heady and consistent play as a rookie PG and Mitchell's ability to win games for his team by clutch shooting in the 4th quarter are remarkable given the inexperience of both players.

Mitchell's shooting in the clutch stats are 38/24%, how exactly is that remarkable? Compare that to Simmons, who is 67/0 or even Tatum 62/67%...

Who cares ?. What matters is winning the games (which Utah didn't end up doing tonight obviously), not the shooting percentage of a player instrumental in winning.

I am a Simmons partisan as I said, and as has been posted elsewhere his point guard play seems to be ever improving and his team is winning more now imo significantly as a consequence of this, as well as having bolstered their bench, without him needing to score more points than he does. The 76ers also imo will end up the better team this season, although I accept arguments this shouldn't necessarily be a factor in deciding ROTY.

[RB34]

So what? He's a rookie. The fact that he's carrying the offense load for Utah almost single-handedly and not backing down is incredible. Defenses are throwing the entire book on him and he's still producing.

#Legend

Just trying to look at it the same way Ben Simmons get looked at.

Ben Simmons doesn't have the onus of carrying the entire Sixers offense on his shoulders, and I don't think he'll ever have to shoot it 35 times. It's a non-point.

You think Simmons does not effect the 6ers offence? You’re kidding yourself.

[clyde21]

Just trying to look at it the same way Ben Simmons get looked at.

Ben Simmons doesn't have the onus of carrying the entire Sixers offense on his shoulders, and I don't think he'll ever have to shoot it 35 times. It's a non-point.

You think Simmons does not effect the 6ers offence? You’re kidding yourself.

Lol...are you ok? When the heck did I say that? Read that sentence again.

[phifans]

So what? He's a rookie. The fact that he's carrying the offense load for Utah almost single-handedly and not backing down is incredible. Defenses are throwing the entire book on him and he's still producing.

#Legend

Just trying to look at it the same way Ben Simmons get looked at.

Ben Simmons doesn't have the onus of carrying the entire Sixers offense on his shoulders, and I don't think he'll ever have to shoot it 35 times. It's a non-point.

To be honest you guys will have a better chance to win this game if the one who carry your entire offense did not take 22 bricks out of 36 attempts.

He seems like a MVP the last three minutes in the fourth quater but a below average volume scorer the rest of the game.

[Black Mage]

Ben Simmons doesn't have the onus of carrying the entire Sixers offense on his shoulders, and I don't think he'll ever have to shoot it 35 times. It's a non-point.

You think Simmons does not effect the 6ers offence? You’re kidding yourself.

Lol...are you ok? When the heck did I say that? Read that sentence again.

I read your post the same as RB34. Maybe you know what you meant, but it certainly didn't come out as you think it did.

[clyde21]

You think Simmons does not effect the 6ers offence? You’re kidding yourself.

Lol...are you ok? When the heck did I say that? Read that sentence again.

I read your post the same as RB34. Maybe you know what you meant, but it certainly didn't come out as you think it did.

How did it come out? I'm curious.

Here it is again:

"Simmons doesn't have the onus of carrying the entire Sixers offense on his shoulders."

Somehow in your head that translates into:

"Simmons does not effect the 6ers offense"

???

[bebopdeluxe]

14-34.......

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14-36

So what? He's a rookie. The fact that he's carrying the offense load for Utah almost single-handedly and not backing down is incredible. Defenses are throwing the entire book on him and he's still producing.

#Legend

Dude shot 14-for-35 (40%)...4–for-13 from 3 (31%). You call that producing?

I call that high-volume, high-usage chucking.

Seriously. This guy has ridiculously high usage, is a completely undisciplined 3-point shooter, but HE GETS POINTZ!!!...so it’s all good.

And, as was pointed out above, his “clutch” shooting numbers are nothing to write home about either.

THIRTY FIVE shots. Wow.

Snyder has given the kid the keys to the candy store, and the kid is EATING. He is an unquestioned talent. But given his insane usage %, and the insane minutes he is playing for a rookie, the fact that Simmons is STILL smoking Mitchell from an analytical/statistical perspective just reinforces how inefficient Mitchell is.

(and I am a Sixers/Iverson fan...so I understand the challenges of rooting for a volume shooter/scorer)

[Patsfan1081]

To be clear, I am Australian and an out and out Simmons fan, but am annoyed by those who feel the need to deride another great young player in Mitchell.

And yes the game is played over 4 quarters, and what matters I would have thought is a player's team winning the game, whether by a consistent level of play over the whole 4 quarters or by better play/clutch shooting in the 4th quarter. Both players haven't played 82 games yet, and both Simmons' heady and consistent play as a rookie PG and Mitchell's ability to win games for his team by clutch shooting in the 4th quarter are remarkable given the inexperience of both players.

Mitchell's shooting in the clutch stats are 38/24%, how exactly is that remarkable? Compare that to Simmons, who is 67/0 or even Tatum 62/67%...

Who cares ?. What matters is winning the games (which Utah didn't end up doing tonight obviously), not the shooting percentage of a player instrumental in winning.

I am a Simmons partisan as I said, and as has been posted elsewhere his point guard play seems to be ever improving and his team is winning more now imo significantly as a consequence of this, as well as having bolstered their bench, without him needing to score more points than he does. The 76ers also imo will end up the better team this season, although I accept arguments this shouldn't necessarily be a factor in deciding ROTY.

?? Obviously if your stats are poor in clutch time then you're not a remarkable clutch player. How is missing shots helping a team win? Gobert's clutch stats are very good, it's not surprising that their good play correlates with his return. I just don't get hyped over volume scoring, not that Booker has been out Jackson is doing the same thing.

[clyde21]

14-36

So what? He's a rookie. The fact that he's carrying the offense load for Utah almost single-handedly and not backing down is incredible. Defenses are throwing the entire book on him and he's still producing.

#Legend

Dude shot 14-for-35 (40%)...4–for-13 from 3 (31%). You call that producing?

I call that high-volume, high-usage chucking.

Seriously. This guy has ridiculously high usage, is a completely undisciplined 3-point shooter, but HE GETS POINTZ!!!...so it’s all good.

And, as was pointed out above, his “clutch” shooting numbers are nothing to write home about either.

THIRTY FIVE shots. Wow.

Snyder has given the kid the keys to the candy store, and the kid is EATING. He is an unquestioned talent. But given his insane usage %, and the insane minutes he is playing for a rookie, the fact that Simmons is STILL smoking Mitchell from an analytical/statistical perspective just reinforces how inefficient Mitchell is.

(and I am a Sixers/Iverson fan...so I understand the challenges of rooting for a volume shooter/scorer)

I get why Sixers fans are hating on Mitchell. It makes sense.

[Patsfan1081]

So what? He's a rookie. The fact that he's carrying the offense load for Utah almost single-handedly and not backing down is incredible. Defenses are throwing the entire book on him and he's still producing.

#Legend

Dude shot 14-for-35 (40%)...4–for-13 from 3 (31%). You call that producing?

I call that high-volume, high-usage chucking.

Seriously. This guy has ridiculously high usage, is a completely undisciplined 3-point shooter, but HE GETS POINTZ!!!...so it’s all good.

And, as was pointed out above, his “clutch” shooting numbers are nothing to write home about either.

THIRTY FIVE shots. Wow.

Snyder has given the kid the keys to the candy store, and the kid is EATING. He is an unquestioned talent. But given his insane usage %, and the insane minutes he is playing for a rookie, the fact that Simmons is STILL smoking Mitchell from an analytical/statistical perspective just reinforces how inefficient Mitchell is.

(and I am a Sixers/Iverson fan...so I understand the challenges of rooting for a volume shooter/scorer)

I get why Sixers fans are hating on Mitchell. It makes sense.

I'm not a Sixers fan but....not agreeing that he should be rookie of the year dose not equate to hating on him. I still believe he's a good player and should early be first team rookie. I'm more impressive when a rookie is a efficient shooter and a positive on the defensive end.

[RB34]

Lol...are you ok? When the heck did I say that? Read that sentence again.

I read your post the same as RB34. Maybe you know what you meant, but it certainly didn't come out as you think it did.

How did it come out? I'm curious.

Here it is again:

"Simmons doesn't have the onus of carrying the entire Sixers offense on his shoulders."

Somehow in your head that translates into:

"Simmons does not effect the 6ers offense"

???

There were 4 other Jazz players in double figures including 2 with 20. Mitchell doesn’t carry the entire offence, stop.

[Black Mage]

Lol...are you ok? When the heck did I say that? Read that sentence again.

I read your post the same as RB34. Maybe you know what you meant, but it certainly didn't come out as you think it did.

How did it come out? I'm curious.

Here it is again:

"Simmons doesn't have the onus of carrying the entire Sixers offense on his shoulders."

Somehow in your head that translates into:

"Simmons does not effect the 6ers offense"

???

I don't know how you can say the primary play initiator and team leader in assists doesn't have the onus of the offense put on him. He doesn't score it like Embiid, I get that, but he orchestrates the offense and tells guys where to go or where they need to be.

[Black Mage]

I read your post the same as RB34. Maybe you know what you meant, but it certainly didn't come out as you think it did.

How did it come out? I'm curious.

Here it is again:

"Simmons doesn't have the onus of carrying the entire Sixers offense on his shoulders."

Somehow in your head that translates into:

"Simmons does not effect the 6ers offense"

???

There were 4 other Jazz players in double figures including 2 with 20. Mitchell doesn’t carry the entire offence, stop.

Of course DM does, didn't you read the last few pages, the first 3 quarters don't count and only the fourth quarter matters whre DM is involved.

[clyde21]

I read your post the same as RB34. Maybe you know what you meant, but it certainly didn't come out as you think it did.

How did it come out? I'm curious.

Here it is again:

"Simmons doesn't have the onus of carrying the entire Sixers offense on his shoulders."

Somehow in your head that translates into:

"Simmons does not effect the 6ers offense"

???

There were 4 other Jazz players in double figures including 2 with 20. Mitchell doesn’t carry the entire offence, stop.

Really? Who else do they rely on offensively? Their second leading scorer is in Cleveland. Their third leading scorer is Rudy Gobert who's not exactly an offensive juggernaut and missed half the season to boot. Who's left? Joe Ingles and Ricky Rubio?

Mitchell is the focal point of their offense scheme. He goes into every game as the opposing defense's primary focus, and is dropping 22/5/5/2 per 36 on 17 PER and a 55 TS% as a true rookie.

Give me a break. He's **** legit and you trying to downplay him by mentioning how many shots he missed is just you being salty AF.

[clyde21]

I read your post the same as RB34. Maybe you know what you meant, but it certainly didn't come out as you think it did.

How did it come out? I'm curious.

Here it is again:

"Simmons doesn't have the onus of carrying the entire Sixers offense on his shoulders."

Somehow in your head that translates into:

"Simmons does not effect the 6ers offense"

???

I don't know how you can say the primary play initiator and team leader in assists doesn't have the onus of the offense put on him. He doesn't score it like Embiid, I get that, but he orchestrates the offense and tells guys where to go or where they need to be.

He doesn't. He shares that onus with a guy named Joel Embiid, who's averaging 27/13/4 per 36 if you haven't noticed. The difference is that Mitchell gets the defense's full attention as he's the focal point of Utah's offense. Simmons plays with a guy named Joel Embiid who's a focal point all on his own.