ESPN's 'The Last Dance' -- ongoing discussion

Moderators: Clav, Domejandro, ken6199, bisme37, Dirk, KingDavid, cupcakesnake, bwgood77, zimpy27, infinite11285

User avatar
LKN
General Manager
Posts: 9,678
And1: 15,580
Joined: Jun 04, 2018
       

Re: ESPN's 'The Last Dance' -- ongoing discussion 

Post#841 » by LKN » Tue May 12, 2020 4:21 pm

Alize wrote:
LKN wrote:
Alize wrote:Outside shooting are 3 pointers and beyond
The "normal" line haha, you mean the shortened line which was introduced in 1994 and was reverted back in 1997, no wonder MJs 3PFG% dropped from 37,4 in 1996-97 to 23,8% in 1997/98, in 1993 he was 35,2% and never reached near 40% in the seaons prior, with the longer line.

Lebron is a better outside shooter, period



Sent from my SM-G950F using RealGM mobile app


No actually I mean the normal line. MJ actually shot better from the normal line in the playoffs than he did from the shortened line. So yes - MJ has about a 34.5% 3PFG % from the normal line in the postseason.

Calling LeBron a better oustide shooter isn't just a dumb opinion it's objectively false. MJ is a vastly better shooter as soon as you get past 10 feet from the basket. Lebron can't even consistently shoot 40% from mid range while MJ shot close to 50% from mid range for much of his career.

It's fine to think LeBron is a better player than MJ (even though I'd disagree), but there's no debate at all about shooting.
Of course Michael is a better mid-range player but mid-range is not outside shooting, period

Sent from my SM-G950F using RealGM mobile app


WTF are you talking about?..... so your claim is that prior to the introduction of the 3 point shot outside shooting didn't exist?

Outside shooting has always been defined as basically any shot taken from 10 ft away or further.

LOL - where you do people come from? It's like the nonsense gets more insane every single day.
carrrnuttt
Senior
Posts: 592
And1: 595
Joined: Jan 10, 2005
       

Re: ESPN's 'The Last Dance' -- ongoing discussion 

Post#842 » by carrrnuttt » Tue May 12, 2020 4:28 pm

Alize wrote:Of course Michael is a better mid-range player but mid-range is not outside shooting, period

Sent from my SM-G950F using RealGM mobile app


The 3-second lane is "inside," anything not in that is "outside."

Jesus. Basketball much?

https://betterbasketball.com/attack-zones-without-a-3-point-shot/

You do have to have some players that can make a shot outside of the lane, however. If you have to depend on lay-ups only, then a zone will win. You must occasionally make a shot outside the lane in order to stretch the zone and get the ball inside. Every good zone offense will have a little bit of both – a threat from the outside and a threat from the inside.

But “outside” does not necessarily mean 3 pointers. If you can only shoot lay-ups, then you’re going to lose no matter what offense you run. There’s no magic pill for the inability to make a shot. And there’s no zone offense that creates only inside shots. If it existed, then everyone would run it and no one would play zones.


And here's a book by SVG and JVG's father about outside shooting: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/051623563X/ref=dbs_a_def_rwt_hsch_vapi_taft_p1_i0

Instructions and photographs show how to execute a jump shot in basketball, discussing how to prepare for and adjust the shot and how to practice shooting.


Says nothing about 3-pt shooting, no?
Triples333
Assistant Coach
Posts: 3,786
And1: 3,672
Joined: Sep 05, 2016

Re: ESPN's 'The Last Dance' -- ongoing discussion 

Post#843 » by Triples333 » Tue May 12, 2020 4:29 pm

Brofessor24 wrote:
HurdyGurdyMan wrote:LeBron tweets passive-aggressively. Also mocks an opposite player for having the flu (and gets his ass kicked in the process)

https://sports.yahoo.com/kevin-love-calls-lebron-james-160001095.html

If you complain about Jordan's bullying you have never really played a minute of team sports in your life.


Tweeting "passive-aggressively?" Oh, the horror.

If Dirk actually had the flu, shame on him for playing IMO. I understand that he wanted to help his team, but he risked getting other people sick in the process (what he did was selfless, but also selfish at the same time).

If you are running the risk of getting other people sick, you deserve to be made fun of IMO.

Based on my life experience, the passive-aggressive/dismissive "leader" is never going to get the respect (at the time, or later) at anywhere close to the level of the man who is direct and constantly pushing his guys. Lebron's leadership style towards both his teammates and coaches has been painful to watch at times throughout his career. He's 35 and still openly rolls his eyes or throws his hands up on the court as he saunters back defensively. It has been this way his entire career. Forget the passive aggressive tweeting (though clearly a pathetic trait of his that you will not see out of a great leader). The leadership ability of these two players is not a debate.
carrrnuttt
Senior
Posts: 592
And1: 595
Joined: Jan 10, 2005
       

Re: ESPN's 'The Last Dance' -- ongoing discussion 

Post#844 » by carrrnuttt » Tue May 12, 2020 4:30 pm

The fact that Bron stans are willing to twist basketball's definitions in of itself just to find a way to one-up Jordan is just sad and silly.

It's not even about basketball at all, at that point.
User avatar
Alize
Senior
Posts: 749
And1: 283
Joined: Jul 26, 2012

Re: ESPN's 'The Last Dance' -- ongoing discussion 

Post#845 » by Alize » Tue May 12, 2020 4:41 pm

The fact that you switch from regular season stats to playoffs stats when its needed, shows your cherry picking.

for example in 1996/97 Playoffs Michael shot 48,1% from 16ft to 3pt and 19,4% from 3pt, then in 1997/98 Playoffs he shot 38,4% from 16ft to 3pt and 30,2% from 3pt. Thats just bad outside shooting.
Context matters too, your 35,2 % (from 84 to 93 Playoffs) equals 0.8 of 2.2 threes made per game, thats very low volume, he didnt even made a 3 per game bruuuh

Lets look at regular season, where the sample size is much bigger:
Lebron 34,4 % career 3ptfg% on 1.5 of 4.3 threes made per game

Michael Jordan 32,7% career 3ptfg% on 0.5 of 1.7 threes made (lol) per game, even with 4 seasons where the line was shortoned he is not close to LeBrons Outside shooting, sorry

But mid-range, i give you that



Sent from my SM-G950F using RealGM mobile app
User avatar
Alize
Senior
Posts: 749
And1: 283
Joined: Jul 26, 2012

Re: ESPN's 'The Last Dance' -- ongoing discussion 

Post#846 » by Alize » Tue May 12, 2020 4:48 pm

And i give you on more example:

Chris Paul is a way better mid range player than Steph Curry, does it make him the better outside shooter? Of course not.
So thats that.

Sent from my SM-G950F using RealGM mobile app
User avatar
Alize
Senior
Posts: 749
And1: 283
Joined: Jul 26, 2012

Re: ESPN's 'The Last Dance' -- ongoing discussion 

Post#847 » by Alize » Tue May 12, 2020 4:59 pm

Bruuh its not 1990, outside shooting is everything beyond 3, stop grabbing out old Basketball books lol
LKN wrote:
Alize wrote:
LKN wrote:
No actually I mean the normal line. MJ actually shot better from the normal line in the playoffs than he did from the shortened line. So yes - MJ has about a 34.5% 3PFG % from the normal line in the postseason.

Calling LeBron a better oustide shooter isn't just a dumb opinion it's objectively false. MJ is a vastly better shooter as soon as you get past 10 feet from the basket. Lebron can't even consistently shoot 40% from mid range while MJ shot close to 50% from mid range for much of his career.

It's fine to think LeBron is a better player than MJ (even though I'd disagree), but there's no debate at all about shooting.
Of course Michael is a better mid-range player but mid-range is not outside shooting, period

Sent from my SM-G950F using RealGM mobile app


WTF are you talking about?..... so your claim is that prior to the introduction of the 3 point shot outside shooting didn't exist?

Outside shooting has always been defined as basically any shot taken from 10 ft away or further.

LOL - where you do people come from? It's like the nonsense gets more insane every single day.


Sent from my SM-G950F using RealGM mobile app
User avatar
LKN
General Manager
Posts: 9,678
And1: 15,580
Joined: Jun 04, 2018
       

Re: ESPN's 'The Last Dance' -- ongoing discussion 

Post#848 » by LKN » Tue May 12, 2020 5:07 pm

Alize wrote:And i give you on more example:

Chris Paul is a way better mid range player than Steph Curry, does it make him the better outside shooter? Of course not.
So thats that.

Sent from my SM-G950F using RealGM mobile app


Curry

10-16 ft - .454
16-3pt - .466
3 pt - .435

Paul
10-16 ft - .481
16-3pt - .461
3 pt - .370

You suck at this. Paul isn't "Way better" than Curry from mid range... and outside shooting includes BOTH mid range and 3 point shots. It's obvious that Curry is a way better shooter since his 3 point % is way higher than Paul.

Paul only had an advantage from 10-16 ft and that advantage is much smaller than Curry's 3 point advantage.

It's actually really debatable which guy is the better mid range shooter.


In any case that's a terrible analogy because LeBron isn't a good 3 point shooter OR a good mid range shooter.

He's literally average to below average from every spot on the court other than 0-3 ft (where he's elite)

MJ was good to elite every where except 3 point shots - where he was about league average for his career (actually slightly above if you ignore the short line seasons)


There's literally no argument or data that puts LBJ anywhere near MJ as a shooter. You are embarrassing yourself.
User avatar
Alize
Senior
Posts: 749
And1: 283
Joined: Jul 26, 2012

Re: ESPN's 'The Last Dance' -- ongoing discussion 

Post#849 » by Alize » Tue May 12, 2020 5:14 pm

Lol, outside shooting is everything from 3pt and beyond, every player of today will tell you that, the game has changed drastically

Chris is shooting better from mid-range and even with higher volume of shots, so that makes him superior from mid-range, still he is not the better outside shooter because he is not better from 3.
LKN wrote:
Alize wrote:And i give you on more example:

Chris Paul is a way better mid range player than Steph Curry, does it make him the better outside shooter? Of course not.
So thats that.

Sent from my SM-G950F using RealGM mobile app


Curry

10-16 ft - .454
16-3pt - .466
3 pt - .435

Paul
10-16 ft - .481
16-3pt - .461
3 pt - .370

You suck at this. Paul isn't "Way better" than Curry from mid range... and outside shooting includes BOTH mid range and 3 point shots. It's obvious that Curry is a way better shooter since his 3 point % is way higher than Paul.

Paul only had an advantage from 10-16 ft and that advantage is much smaller than Curry's 3 point advantage.

It's actually really debatable which guy is the better mid range shooter.


Sent from my SM-G950F using RealGM mobile app
User avatar
LKN
General Manager
Posts: 9,678
And1: 15,580
Joined: Jun 04, 2018
       

Re: ESPN's 'The Last Dance' -- ongoing discussion 

Post#850 » by LKN » Tue May 12, 2020 5:16 pm

Alize wrote:Lol, outside shooting is everything from 3pt and beyond, every player of today will tell you that, the game has changed drastically

Chris is shooting better from mid-range and even with higher volume of shots, so that makes him superior from mid-range, still he is not the better outside shooter because he is not better from 3.
LKN wrote:
Alize wrote:And i give you on more example:

Chris Paul is a way better mid range player than Steph Curry, does it make him the better outside shooter? Of course not.
So thats that.

Sent from my SM-G950F using RealGM mobile app


Curry

10-16 ft - .454
16-3pt - .466
3 pt - .435

Paul
10-16 ft - .481
16-3pt - .461
3 pt - .370

You suck at this. Paul isn't "Way better" than Curry from mid range... and outside shooting includes BOTH mid range and 3 point shots. It's obvious that Curry is a way better shooter since his 3 point % is way higher than Paul.

Paul only had an advantage from 10-16 ft and that advantage is much smaller than Curry's 3 point advantage.

It's actually really debatable which guy is the better mid range shooter.


Sent from my SM-G950F using RealGM mobile app


Image
Mr.Raptorsingh
RealGM
Posts: 35,047
And1: 28,666
Joined: May 17, 2007
 

Re: ESPN's 'The Last Dance' -- ongoing discussion 

Post#851 » by Mr.Raptorsingh » Tue May 12, 2020 5:18 pm

evilpimp972 wrote:
Read on Twitter


:lol:


:lol: :lol: :lol:
Brofessor24
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,787
And1: 888
Joined: Sep 06, 2018
Location: Inside of your mom.

Re: ESPN's 'The Last Dance' -- ongoing discussion 

Post#852 » by Brofessor24 » Tue May 12, 2020 5:19 pm

Triples333 wrote:
Brofessor24 wrote:
HurdyGurdyMan wrote:LeBron tweets passive-aggressively. Also mocks an opposite player for having the flu (and gets his ass kicked in the process)

https://sports.yahoo.com/kevin-love-calls-lebron-james-160001095.html

If you complain about Jordan's bullying you have never really played a minute of team sports in your life.


Tweeting "passive-aggressively?" Oh, the horror.

If Dirk actually had the flu, shame on him for playing IMO. I understand that he wanted to help his team, but he risked getting other people sick in the process (what he did was selfless, but also selfish at the same time).

If you are running the risk of getting other people sick, you deserve to be made fun of IMO.

Based on my life experience, the passive-aggressive/dismissive "leader" is never going to get the respect (at the time, or later) at anywhere close to the level of the man who is direct and constantly pushing his guys. Lebron's leadership style towards both his teammates and coaches has been painful to watch at times throughout his career. He's 35 and still openly rolls his eyes or throws his hands up on the court as he saunters back defensively. It has been this way his entire career. Forget the passive aggressive tweeting (though clearly a pathetic trait of his that you will not see out of a great leader). The leadership ability of these two players is not a debate.


It's disingenuous to act like MJ always did the right thing with regard to being a team leader. LBJ and MJ have made some mistakes.
User avatar
LKN
General Manager
Posts: 9,678
And1: 15,580
Joined: Jun 04, 2018
       

Re: ESPN's 'The Last Dance' -- ongoing discussion 

Post#853 » by LKN » Tue May 12, 2020 5:25 pm

Mr.Raptorsingh wrote:
evilpimp972 wrote:
Read on Twitter


:lol:


:lol: :lol: :lol:


I'm dying.... :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Triples333
Assistant Coach
Posts: 3,786
And1: 3,672
Joined: Sep 05, 2016

Re: ESPN's 'The Last Dance' -- ongoing discussion 

Post#854 » by Triples333 » Tue May 12, 2020 5:26 pm

Brofessor24 wrote:
Triples333 wrote:
Brofessor24 wrote:
Tweeting "passive-aggressively?" Oh, the horror.

If Dirk actually had the flu, shame on him for playing IMO. I understand that he wanted to help his team, but he risked getting other people sick in the process (what he did was selfless, but also selfish at the same time).

If you are running the risk of getting other people sick, you deserve to be made fun of IMO.

Based on my life experience, the passive-aggressive/dismissive "leader" is never going to get the respect (at the time, or later) at anywhere close to the level of the man who is direct and constantly pushing his guys. Lebron's leadership style towards both his teammates and coaches has been painful to watch at times throughout his career. He's 35 and still openly rolls his eyes or throws his hands up on the court as he saunters back defensively. It has been this way his entire career. Forget the passive aggressive tweeting (though clearly a pathetic trait of his that you will not see out of a great leader). The leadership ability of these two players is not a debate.


It's disingenuous to act like MJ always did the right thing with regard to being a team leader. LBJ and MJ have made some mistakes.

Quite the strawman argument there. That's not what I said. But the shortcomings of 'Bron's leadership ability are very plain to see with his antics. This has been a constant criticism of his throughout his career towards both his teammates and coaches, and for good reason. His passive-aggressive nature is one of his clear shortfalls. There is quite literally zero benefit to that behavior (and do understand that I realize he has other leadership qualities that are absolutely positive, but this is a glaring/constant weakness).
User avatar
Alize
Senior
Posts: 749
And1: 283
Joined: Jul 26, 2012

Re: ESPN's 'The Last Dance' -- ongoing discussion 

Post#855 » by Alize » Tue May 12, 2020 5:28 pm

LKN wrote:
Alize wrote:Lol, outside shooting is everything from 3pt and beyond, every player of today will tell you that, the game has changed drastically

Chris is shooting better from mid-range and even with higher volume of shots, so that makes him superior from mid-range, still he is not the better outside shooter because he is not better from 3.
LKN wrote:
Curry

10-16 ft - .454
16-3pt - .466
3 pt - .435

Paul
10-16 ft - .481
16-3pt - .461
3 pt - .370

You suck at this. Paul isn't "Way better" than Curry from mid range... and outside shooting includes BOTH mid range and 3 point shots. It's obvious that Curry is a way better shooter since his 3 point % is way higher than Paul.

Paul only had an advantage from 10-16 ft and that advantage is much smaller than Curry's 3 point advantage.

It's actually really debatable which guy is the better mid range shooter.


Sent from my SM-G950F using RealGM mobile app


Image
Haha, no stats to cherry pick from left?



Sent from my SM-G950F using RealGM mobile app
User avatar
Alize
Senior
Posts: 749
And1: 283
Joined: Jul 26, 2012

Re: ESPN's 'The Last Dance' -- ongoing discussion 

Post#856 » by Alize » Tue May 12, 2020 5:30 pm

So weak weak, but i think his coaches and teammates would say something else
Triples333 wrote:
Brofessor24 wrote:
Triples333 wrote:Based on my life experience, the passive-aggressive/dismissive "leader" is never going to get the respect (at the time, or later) at anywhere close to the level of the man who is direct and constantly pushing his guys. Lebron's leadership style towards both his teammates and coaches has been painful to watch at times throughout his career. He's 35 and still openly rolls his eyes or throws his hands up on the court as he saunters back defensively. It has been this way his entire career. Forget the passive aggressive tweeting (though clearly a pathetic trait of his that you will not see out of a great leader). The leadership ability of these two players is not a debate.


It's disingenuous to act like MJ always did the right thing with regard to being a team leader. LBJ and MJ have made some mistakes.

Quite the strawman argument there. That's not what I said. But the shortcomings of 'Bron's leadership ability are very plain to see with his antics. This has been a constant criticism of his throughout his career towards both his teammates and coaches, and for good reason. His passive-aggressive nature is one of his clear shortfalls. There is quite literally zero benefit to that behavior (and do understand that I realize he has other leadership qualities that are absolutely positive, but this is a glaring/constant weakness).


Sent from my SM-G950F using RealGM mobile app
User avatar
ssang
Sophomore
Posts: 133
And1: 366
Joined: Jun 08, 2011
       

Re: ESPN's 'The Last Dance' -- ongoing discussion 

Post#857 » by ssang » Tue May 12, 2020 5:31 pm

Alize wrote:
LKN wrote:
Alize wrote:Outside shooting are 3 pointers and beyond
The "normal" line haha, you mean the shortened line which was introduced in 1994 and was reverted back in 1997, no wonder MJs 3PFG% dropped from 37,4 in 1996-97 to 23,8% in 1997/98, in 1993 he was 35,2% and never reached near 40% in the seaons prior, with the longer line.

Lebron is a better outside shooter, period



Sent from my SM-G950F using RealGM mobile app


No actually I mean the normal line. MJ actually shot better from the normal line in the playoffs than he did from the shortened line. So yes - MJ has about a 34.5% 3PFG % from the normal line in the postseason.

Calling LeBron a better oustide shooter isn't just a dumb opinion it's objectively false. MJ is a vastly better shooter as soon as you get past 10 feet from the basket. Lebron can't even consistently shoot 40% from mid range while MJ shot close to 50% from mid range for much of his career.

It's fine to think LeBron is a better player than MJ (even though I'd disagree), but there's no debate at all about shooting.
Of course Michael is a better mid-range player but mid-range is not outside shooting, period

Sent from my SM-G950F using RealGM mobile app

Oh okay, I get it now. So you - Alize - are the be-all-end-all as to whom dictates the definition of the general term "outside shooting"; and in your dictation as to what is defined as "outside shooting", it doesn't include mid-range shooting, but rather, "outside shooting" is exclusive to only attempts from the three-point line and beyond.

I hate to break it to you, but that's not how this works. You don't get to redefine the parameters as to what's been widely agreed upon and accepted as to what constitutes as outside shooting.

You know, there's a more specific name for what you're claiming to be as the definition of an outside shot; something which you claimed "Outside shooting are 3-pointers and beyond". Actually, shots taken from three-points and beyond is what most people like to call "three point shooting" (gee, imagine that!)

And while, yes, outside shooting would also include three-point shooting, the term outside shooting, in and of itself, is not mutually exclusive to shots only taken from the three-point line and beyond. Like I said, those types of shots - shots from three-point line and beyond - are better suited to the term "three-point shooting". Ya dig?

The vague term "outside shooting" isn't something that's quantifiable to a hard definition. However, for as long as anyone can remember, the adopted meaning as to what the vague term "outside shooting" is in reference towards, would be jump shots taken from beyond the paint/lane.

The measurements are an NBA lane are 15 ft long by 16 ft wide. For all intents and purposes, any jump shot taken from any spot on the court from beyond those painted measurements (i.e. 17 ft, 20 ft, 23 ft 9 inches, 30 ft, etc., etc.) should be, and is, considered an outside jump shot - AKA outside shooting.

And with this all said, when considering the comprehensive, all-encompassing, widely intended and widely accepted term "outside shooting"....by nearly all tangible measures, Michael Jordan was a clear and decidedly better outside shooter than LeBron James.

Try not to overthink this one.
carrrnuttt
Senior
Posts: 592
And1: 595
Joined: Jan 10, 2005
       

Re: ESPN's 'The Last Dance' -- ongoing discussion 

Post#858 » by carrrnuttt » Tue May 12, 2020 5:38 pm

ssang wrote:
Alize wrote:
LKN wrote:
No actually I mean the normal line. MJ actually shot better from the normal line in the playoffs than he did from the shortened line. So yes - MJ has about a 34.5% 3PFG % from the normal line in the postseason.

Calling LeBron a better oustide shooter isn't just a dumb opinion it's objectively false. MJ is a vastly better shooter as soon as you get past 10 feet from the basket. Lebron can't even consistently shoot 40% from mid range while MJ shot close to 50% from mid range for much of his career.

It's fine to think LeBron is a better player than MJ (even though I'd disagree), but there's no debate at all about shooting.
Of course Michael is a better mid-range player but mid-range is not outside shooting, period

Sent from my SM-G950F using RealGM mobile app

Oh okay, I get it now. So you - Alize - are the be-all-end-all as to whom dictates the definition of the general term "outside shooting"; and in your dictation as to what is defined as "outside shooting", it doesn't include mid-range shooting, but rather, "outside shooting" is exclusive to only attempts from the three-point line and beyond.

I hate to break it to you, but that's not how this works. You don't get to redefine the parameters as to what's been widely agreed upon and accepted as to what constitutes as outside shooting.

You know, there's a more specific name for what you're claiming to be as the definition of an outside shot; something which you claimed "Outside shooting are 3-pointers and beyond". Actually, shots taken from three-points and beyond is what most people like to call "three point shooting" (gee, imagine that!)

And while, yes, outside shooting would also include three-point shooting, the term outside shooting, in and of itself, is not mutually exclusive to shots only taken from the three-point line and beyond. Like I said, those types of shots - shots from three-point line and beyond - are better suited to the term "three-point shooting". Ya dig?

The vague term "outside shooting" isn't something that's quantifiable to a hard definition. However, for as long as anyone can remember, the adopted meaning as to what the vague term "outside shooting" is in reference towards, would be jump shots taken from beyond the paint/lane.

The measurements are an NBA lane are 15 ft long by 16 ft wide. For all intents and purposes, any jump shot taken from any spot on the court from beyond those painted measurements (i.e. 17 ft, 20 ft, 23 ft 9 inches, 30 ft, etc., etc.) should be, and is, considered an outside jump shot - AKA outside shooting.

And with this all said, when considering the comprehensive, all-encompassing, widely intended and widely accepted term "outside shooting"....by nearly all tangible measures, Michael Jordan was a clear and decidedly better outside shooter than LeBron James.

Try not to overthink this one.


As I mentioned above, there is literally a book about this: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/051623563X/ref=dbs_a_def_rwt_hsch_vapi_taft_p1_i0

Instructions and photographs show how to execute a jump shot in basketball, discussing how to prepare for and adjust the shot and how to practice shooting.


Nope. Nothing about 3-pt shooting there...
User avatar
Alize
Senior
Posts: 749
And1: 283
Joined: Jul 26, 2012

Re: ESPN's 'The Last Dance' -- ongoing discussion 

Post#859 » by Alize » Tue May 12, 2020 5:45 pm

I'm not overthinking, todays outside shooting is 3 pointers and beyond, a small amount of players takes 16ft to 3pt shots anymore because they are not efficient

Ask a machine, Google for example, "best outside shooters in the nba" and it will give you the best 3-pt specialist of the NBA history






Sent from my SM-G950F using RealGM mobile app
Brofessor24
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,787
And1: 888
Joined: Sep 06, 2018
Location: Inside of your mom.

Re: ESPN's 'The Last Dance' -- ongoing discussion 

Post#860 » by Brofessor24 » Tue May 12, 2020 6:02 pm

Triples333 wrote:
Brofessor24 wrote:
Triples333 wrote:Based on my life experience, the passive-aggressive/dismissive "leader" is never going to get the respect (at the time, or later) at anywhere close to the level of the man who is direct and constantly pushing his guys. Lebron's leadership style towards both his teammates and coaches has been painful to watch at times throughout his career. He's 35 and still openly rolls his eyes or throws his hands up on the court as he saunters back defensively. It has been this way his entire career. Forget the passive aggressive tweeting (though clearly a pathetic trait of his that you will not see out of a great leader). The leadership ability of these two players is not a debate.


It's disingenuous to act like MJ always did the right thing with regard to being a team leader. LBJ and MJ have made some mistakes.

Quite the strawman argument there. That's not what I said. But the shortcomings of 'Bron's leadership ability are very plain to see with his antics. This has been a constant criticism of his throughout his career towards both his teammates and coaches, and for good reason. His passive-aggressive nature is one of his clear shortfalls. There is quite literally zero benefit to that behavior (and do understand that I realize he has other leadership qualities that are absolutely positive, but this is a glaring/constant weakness).


Agree to disagree boyo.

Return to The General Board