lazybatman wrote:Scottie is ranked no. 21 on recently published NBA top 74 players. Salty much?
And he made 10 All defensive teams, not 6. My bad.
And before you start labelling Rodman as a chump look at these -
7 time rebounding champion and All NBA defensive team; 2 time DPOY; and I stress, a player who knew his role and was already a champion before he joined the Bulls
And Phil's resume only got further glorified in this doc.
Mike's not GOAT without any one of them and his supporting cast, and likely finishes his career getting swept out of first and second rounds.
In an alternate reality, Mike's not sticking to the 2010 Cavs under Dan Gilbert either, if indeed he sticks around till then.. Forget coming back to a 27 win team trying to win one for the Land. This is a guy who cared about Republicans buying shoes. That's 11 years of prime down the drain. He had problems with that Bulls front office. Imagine the meltdown/s he'd be having with his own Charlotte Hornets as a star player.
A lot of luck, help, effort and talent go into it. It's not freaking tennis or badminton, where you can win on your own.
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Real life evidence doesn't at all support this notion of yours that Jordan, under the same circumstances as LeBron, would've bolted Cleveland in 2010 under Dan Gilbert. In fact, it would suggest the opposite of what you opine to what Jordan would have done in this alternate universe you cite. Allow me to explain.
The LeBron James lead Cleveland Cavilers won 66 games in 2009 and 61 games in 2010 and had the #1 overall seed in the league above all other teams in both conferences. both seasons before getting upset in the postseason on both occasions; Orlando in 2009 in the ECF, who would go on to lose to the Lakers in the finals, and Boston in 2010, who would go on to lose to the Lakers in the finals. It was after the 2010 season that LeBron left Cleveland for what he felt were greener pastures in Miami in joining up with Wade and Bosh.
In 1988 Jordan's Bulls won 50 games and were seeded 3rd in the eastern conference. After beating the Cavs in rd 1 they lost to the eventual eastern conference champion #2 seeded Detroit Pistons in 5 games. The next season in 1989 the Bulls won 47 games and were the 6th seed in the eastern conf. They upset 3rd seeded Cleveland in round 1 and then went on to upset the the 2nd seeded NY Knicks in rd 2 before bowing out to the Pistons again, this time in the ECF, and this time with Detroit as the #1 seed, the same Pistons who would go on to win sweep the Lakers in the finals. Then the following season in 1990, the Bulls won 55 games, good for the 3rd seed in the east. After beating Milwaukee in rd 1 the Bulls took out the 2nd seeded Sixers. Then once again, for the 3rd straight season, the Bulls once again would go down to the Pistons, with Detroit again as the #1 seed and again in the ECF, this time in 7 games. I don't need to tell you what happened the next season beginning in 1991 and then all the seasons after that.
I provide this information to point out the poor logic to your hypothetical claim.
Because what your claim is, is that Jordan, had he been in LeBron's position in 2010, after leading his squad to the best record in the entire NBA with 66 wins in '09 and 61 in '10 for two consecutive seasons, before getting taken out both seasons to two non-title winning teams, he would have assuredly bolted Cleveland to join forces elsewhere just like LeBron had....
And you make this hypothetical claim in spite of the fact that the real Michael Jordan in real life, a guy who played on a squad who mustered up the 50 win 3rd seed, 47 win 6th seed, and 55 win 3rd seed in his own conference for three years running, losing to the same squad each time, a squad lost in the finals in 7 one year and crushed their western conference foe in the finals in the next two seasons; and yet in spite of not being able to breakthrough with the best record in the league in any of those seasons or anything close to it, and in spite of losing to the same damn team each time in the playoffs - and a dynastic team no less - not for 2 straight seasons with the Bulls anywhere near the #1 overall seed, but for three straight seasons with the Bulls nowhere near the #1 overall seed....the real life Michael Jordan, in spite of all of that working against him, stayed put, continued to go to work until he got over the hump
And you're going to tell me that this same Michael Jordan fella leaves Cleveland after 2010 after having won won 66 in '09 and 61 in '10 with the best record in the entire NBA both seasons, two years on a row, losing to good but not great non-title winning squads, in a conference landscape with no potential beasts or potential dynastic squads other than, I dunno, his own damn team, ya'know, the same squad who already had the best record in the NBA for two years running....just gets up and waives the white flag at that point and bolts his two-time 60+ win squad team he had shaped and the organization who had drafted him, to go and join up on some other team with other great players elsewhere!?
Do you see how foolish of a take this is on your part? Do you not know anything about Michael Jordan? Your hypothetical take is illogical sir. It's as if you disregard and ignore every actual thing that was a part of Michael Jordan's make-up. He was as stubborn of a fighter and competitor as there's ever been.
The general notion that the Cleveland situation as being some impossible situation to win in is preposterous. They had the #1 overall seed in the NBA for two consecutive years when LeBron left for Chrissakes. How can anyone believe that a team like never stood a chance to ever really compete for or win a title?? It's ridiculous.
Would Jordan have bolted Cleveland in 2010 under the same set of circumstances as LeBron? No, he would have done no such thing. No a shot in hell. Not in this world, not in that world, not in any.