Woj: Russ to Wizards, Wall to Rockets

[Wolveswin]

These polls are always silly.

GMs do the trade thinking they are winning their side of the trade.

We vote as if we know more or our opinions are more valid than what reality just showed us.

Time will tell us who won. That is all.

No kidding but where is the fun in that

Ha.

Real winner is Wall. He goes to a no state income Texas, warmer climate and plays with his college teammate. Wall all the way.

[FutureKnicksGM]

I like it for both, with the edge to WAS.

Two horrendous contracts swapped for each other.

Neither Westbrook or Wall are going to help Harden get out of the west, so might as well add a future pick for the eventual rebuild.

WAS get Beal some help at a low cost, and should be a solid Eastern Conference pretender. In theory, Russ with an all star in Beal who can play off the ball should work much better.

[K_chile22]

Worth noting that Wall did not want to be a wizard anymore and wanted to go to Houston to play with Harden (and presumably boogie but Woj didn't say that specifically)

Westbrook did not want to play in Houston and wanted to go to DC to reunite with Scott Brooks (and presumably Beal but Woj didn't say that specifically)

Both teams got guys who specifically wanted to be there for guys who did not


Edit: another big winner here is me. I was absolutely dreading watching Russ for another season. It ages you. Even if Wall is really bad, it won't be frustrating in quite the same way

[kobe_vs_jordan]

Not surprised the vote is so spread out, these are some high-variance players.

Is Washington getting good, MVP-level Russ? Or bad, grumpy, shoots his own team out of games Russ?

Is Houston getting good, back-to-his-old-self corner-3-factory Wall? Or bad, spotty-defence, never-gets-his-speed-back Wall?

A lot of possible outcomes here: if you expect the best of one and the worst of the other, your vote may look very different from someone who expects the opposite!

Think Wiz win alone by trading an expensive injured player for a healthy one.

[basketballwacko2]

Should be interesting. In one sense, this was probably the best outcome for both Houston and the Wizards.

Here take my problem and I'll take your problem.

[basketballwacko2]

Wall/Harden backcourt isn't going to work either. Just more expensive.

Not really Wall is paid slightly less than RW.

[basketballwacko2]

How more or less likely do y'all think this makes a Harden deal?

Harden being traded isn't a matter of if but when. Dumping RoCo and now eating Wall's contract for 1st round picks is a very clear direction. They're just holding out in an attempt to maximize their return (as the Nets package isn't exactly a home run for a top 5 player).

It's one #1 in 2023 and my not convey until it becomes 2 2nd's years later.

[basketballwacko2]

Agreed. Wall healthy should be an interesting fit with Harden. Hes a more willing passer. Plus we get the Wall + cousins combo finally! With wood and tucker.

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I just don't know about trading for Wall sight unseen after that injury.

I don't like it either. But Westbrook is who he is. Not like him having a good year changes his value much

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Wall and Westbrook's contracts are heinous $41 million one has had injury issues the other has never lead a team to win a title! Cheap at half the price.

[basketballwacko2]

Protections make this pretty terrible for Houston. Maybe it works out but it's bad process.

What's terrible is that they traded Chris Paul and picks for RW last year and now they're trading the guy and getting another over priced player who's had a lot of injuries and only getting one pick years down the road.

Hopefully for the Rocks Wall comes back to 80% of his former best yrs. Then maybe they don't look like idiots trying to run a basketball team. If Wall gets back near his form this could be ok. But what stinks is those picks they gave to the Thunder for RW.

[basketballwacko2]

John Wall just made twenty million dollars from this trade because of his trade kicker, plus Texas has no state income tax. Great for him financially.

He's on a max contract right? Can he get that trade kicker? I'm thinking it puts him over the max and he would have had to waive it to be traded. Also since he requested a trade you'd think he might not get it. But you're right about the income tax. The top
Washington DC income tax rate is 8.95%

[Slava]

Wizards get out of jail free here, Wall is cooked.

[basketballwacko2]

How many teams have an MLE or larger amount of money left to spend? If Houston was this desperate to dump Westbrook and he was this insistent on getting out of Houston, why not just agree to a buyout and waive him? Seems likely he could have landed an MLE-sized or greater contract for the next two or three years, so why not agree to chop, say, $15-20 million off the contract? That's potentially huge savings (which could either be pocketed or spent on healthy players) vs. paying Wall. Westbrook gets his choice of suitors. Just a thought, and maybe not a smart one.

(To preempt: I guess I know the answer. Dead money is dreaded, so even under the scenario that Wall never plays again, he's at least potentially moveable, while a waived Westbrook is stuck on the payroll. I'm just wondering whether, for a team that either needs healthy players to try to win with Harden, or is blowing it up and might as well save money, trading for Wall will actually work out better than waiving Westbrook.)

Buying out a contract of $131 million? Even if RW took $100 million stretched over 5 years is $20 million a year in dead money. It's a massive handicap.

I would have been reluctant to take Wall for only 1 #1. But a happy Wall is better than an unhappy Westbrook. And if Wall and Harden are friends it makes sense to appease Harden.

I'd says the Rocket should look at who's left in FA and see if there's anyone who can be gotten for a Vet minimum contract who might help them. Their chances of beating the Lakers or Clippers is slim, but you never know who might get hurt.

[Domejandro]

John Wall just made twenty million dollars from this trade because of his trade kicker, plus Texas has no state income tax. Great for him financially.

He's on a max contract right? Can he get that trade kicker? I'm thinking it puts him over the max and he would have had to waive it to be traded. Also since he requested a trade you'd think he might not get it. But you're right about the income tax. The top
Washington DC income tax rate is 8.95%

He cannot, I forgot that was a thing (it wasn't waived, but functionally it doesn't do anything).

[BadWolf]

Where did all this Wall is better then Westbrook takes come from? When was he better? How is a player that was never better in the first place, didn't play for two years due to injuries better then a guy that was 3rd team all NBA last season?

[Laimbeer]

Where did all this Wall is better then Westbrook takes come from? When was he better? How is a player that was never better in the first place, didn't play for two years due to injuries better then a guy that was 3rd team all NBA last season?

Yeah, this. I'm pretty surprised Russ' value was this low.

It's an absolute heist for Washington. Similar contracts, but one guy has very serious health concerns and isn't as good. I don't know if Westbrook works with Beal, but it's worth a shot. He didn't work with Harden because they're both ball dominant. Beal will be more of a Durant type of teammate, which worked pretty well.

[HartfordWhalers]

How many teams have an MLE or larger amount of money left to spend? If Houston was this desperate to dump Westbrook and he was this insistent on getting out of Houston, why not just agree to a buyout and waive him? Seems likely he could have landed an MLE-sized or greater contract for the next two or three years, so why not agree to chop, say, $15-20 million off the contract? That's potentially huge savings (which could either be pocketed or spent on healthy players) vs. paying Wall. Westbrook gets his choice of suitors. Just a thought, and maybe not a smart one.

(To preempt: I guess I know the answer. Dead money is dreaded, so even under the scenario that Wall never plays again, he's at least potentially moveable, while a waived Westbrook is stuck on the payroll. I'm just wondering whether, for a team that either needs healthy players to try to win with Harden, or is blowing it up and might as well save money, trading for Wall will actually work out better than waiving Westbrook.)

Buying out a contract of $131 million? Even if RW took $100 million stretched over 5 years is $20 million a year in dead money. It's a massive handicap.

I would have been reluctant to take Wall for only 1 #1. But a happy Wall is better than an unhappy Westbrook. And if Wall and Harden are friends it makes sense to appease Harden.

I'd says the Rocket should look at who's left in FA and see if there's anyone who can be gotten for a Vet minimum contract who might help them. Their chances of beating the Lakers or Clippers is slim, but you never know who might get hurt.

You can only have 15% of your cap in stretched players.

[SmartWentCrazy]

Brodie is going to have driving lanes for days playing with Bertans and Beal. Like this deal a lot for Washington.

I mean, Houston had a certain amount of outside shooting on their roster too...

Did I say elsewise?

When Houston played its small lineup, Westbrook played some of the best ball of his career. Washington should provide him with similar spacing, if not more so given how deep Bertans can stretch the floor. Is there a reason I cant like this for them?

[HardenToSixers]

These polls are always silly.

GMs do the trade thinking they are winning their side of the trade.

We vote as if we know more or our opinions are more valid than what reality just showed us.

Time will tell us who won. That is all.

Not really silly.

You are assuming 1) that some organizations aren’t complete dysfunctional and run by buffoons and 2) that cheap owners don’t make bad basketball decisions for luxury tax saving purposes.

Which in my opinion is the sillier stance to take.

[HardenToSixers]

Brodie is going to have driving lanes for days playing with Bertans and Beal. Like this deal a lot for Washington.

I mean, Houston had a certain amount of outside shooting on their roster too...

Did I say elsewise?

When Houston played its small lineup, Westbrook played some of the best ball of his career. Washington should provide him with similar spacing, if not more so given how deep Bertans can stretch the floor. Is there a reason I cant like this for them?

Yeah his 1.5 BPM in Houston was fantastic

[SmartWentCrazy]

I mean, Houston had a certain amount of outside shooting on their roster too...

Did I say elsewise?

When Houston played its small lineup, Westbrook played some of the best ball of his career. Washington should provide him with similar spacing, if not more so given how deep Bertans can stretch the floor. Is there a reason I cant like this for them?

Yeah his 1.5 BPM in Houston was fantastic

Remind me of Walls BPM last year

And, after the commitment to small ball, Russ averaged 32-8-7 on 57% TS. He was incredible.