Should Billy King be fired?

[Prokorov]

Huh?

He literally said VC4P "was a big proponent on taking Paul George".

at #3 or prior to the season ending?

No one suggested Paul George at #3 but because the Nets had a second pick in the first round people were wondering who the Nets would select with the second.

VC was very high on Paul George but saw that there was no way Paul George would be available to us at the 27th pick.

Two months before the draft (Apr. 28th), he accurately predicted this:

"I would LOVE Paul George, but I think he's going to catapult up draft boards by the time June rolls around."

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9 days later (May 7th):

"Paul George is so likely to be off the board at least 10 picks before ours, I just can't see him being there at 27. I think he has a good shot to go late lotto."

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Day of the draft:

Wow, if Paul George falls and we trade up to get him, I can't tell you how happy I'll be.

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There other comments in that thread where he talks about how good he thinks George would be.

So yes, he wanted to take him in the draft but knew that there was basically no way for us to get him at 27.

Right, well that was the point... the poster earlier was criticizing King for taking George OVER Favors. my point being, you really cant hate on king for a picking a guy no one had anywhere near top 3 talent.

VC liked geroge, sure, but not so much he adovacated top 3 pick for him over favors/cousins

[vincecarter4pres]

Yeah, I wanted the Nets to try and trade Devin Harris for the 10th pick and snag him as well. I also had come up with a couple trade ideas with the Clippers at 9.

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[NyCeEvO]

Right, well that was the point... the poster earlier was criticizing King for taking George OVER Favors. my point being, you really cant hate on king for a picking a guy no one had anywhere near top 3 talent.

VC liked geroge, sure, but not so much he adovacated top 3 pick for him over favors/cousins

BK wasn't even GM at the time lol.

Side note: Rod Thorn was going out with a bang in that draft. We traded both the 27th and 31st picks for Damion James (#24).

I didn't make an account here yet but I was avid reader/lurker and I remember people being pretty pissed about trading to picks for James because they didn't see a future for him at all. The funny thing is that Jordan Crawford is still getting contracts in the league while Damion James is barely a 10-day contract player these days lol.

[MrDollarBills]

Rod Thorn **** ed the Nets on purpose when he left. He knew damn well all of those moves were atrocious.

[Prokorov]

Rod Thorn **** ed the Nets on purpose when he left. He knew damn well all of those moves were atrocious.

I disagree 10000000%

Other then Travis Outlaw(which was undone by amnesty) Thorne handed king an amazing situation:

A 22 year old 18/9 center on a rookie deal (lopez)
A 19 year old #3 pick rookie(Favors)
A 23 year old versatile rotation player (Terrance Williams)
39 million dollars in cap room/expiring contracts
4 first round picks in the next 3 years, with a roster ready already in tank mode

Can you really walk into a better situation as a GM other then inheriting a championship calibur team?

-young players already showing promise, high ceiling athletic rookie who the league all seems to be buzzing over, tons of cap room and expiring, tons of likely lottery picks

[MGrand15]

Didn't Thorn sign Travis Outlaw, Jordan Farmar, Anthony Morrow and Johan Petro then leave? Sure he didn't destroy us but locking up such mediocre talent then leaving was ridiculous.

The Outlaw deal was particularly terrible. Outlaw was TERRIBLE the year before and there was no chance in hell he was getting a deal anywhere near what we gave him. I watched a rookie Nic Batum take his starting spot in Portland and watched him consistently make terrible plays. I couldn't believe that deal when that happened.

[Prokorov]

Didn't Thorn sign Travis Outlaw, Jordan Farmar, Anthony Morrow and Johan Petro then leave? Sure he didn't destroy us but locking up such mediocre talent then leaving was ridiculous.

He signed that trio(morrow, petro, farmar) to 1 year deals. so they were all expiring leaving us with either an asset at the deadline or pure cap space at the end of the deal. he had to sign someone to fill out the roster and did so with a team that could tank for another top pick.

The Outlaw deal was particularly terrible. Outlaw was TERRIBLE the year before and there was no chance in hell he was getting a deal anywhere near what we gave him. I watched a rookie Nic Batum take his starting spot in Portland and watched him consistently make terrible plays. I couldn't believe that deal when that happened.

it was a horrible deal. but lets not get carried away. it was 7M per season and wiped away with amnesty. King was left in an ideal situaion. you realyl cant ask for more in a rebuild then:

- young 19/8 center
- #3 pick rookie
- 4 first rounders in the next 3 years
- insane amount of cap space
- franchise moving to NY

[therealbig3]

I agree, it's pretty ridiculous how badly King **** ed things up.

I still say that people brushing aside the Gerald Wallace trade as "just one bad move" are completely missing the point. Look at where that landed us.

-Trading for Gerald Wallace with a sure-fire lotto pick possibly cost us Anthony Davis...we won 22 games that year, NO (the team that got the #1 pick) won 21 games. We were 6-10 with Wallace in the lineup...if we had gone 4-12, we would have won 20 games and would have had a worse record (and thus a better chance of getting #1) than the team that actually got #1.

-Trading for Gerald Wallace at minimum cost us a higher pick...that pick was pretty much a lock top 5 pick.

-Trading for Gerald Wallace completely erased whatever chance we had at trading for Dwight Howard...sure, things got messed up when Dwight opted in, but everyone knew that trade talks were just going to open up again in the summer...saving our assets for that time was of utmost importance, but instead, we had nothing to offer Orlando when trade talks resurfaced.

-Signing Gerald Wallace to a monster contract that nobody else was willing to match in either years or annual salary put us further in luxury tax hell, and partially contributed to Prokhorov wanting to cut funding.

-Gerald Wallace the player was an abomination that was ridiculously overpaid.

-Gerald Wallace's uselessness as a player, on the kind of contract he had, meant that trading him away cost us 2 future 1st rounders, which could easily end up being lotto picks.

The Gerald Wallace trade **** ed up SO many things for us, it's impossible to simply brush that aside. That one move was worth an on-the-spot firing. We threw away any chances of landing a once in a generation talent, as well as our overall most valuable trade asset, we killed our chances at landing an elite superstar that was BEGGING to come here, we signed him to a monster deal that put us further in luxury tax hell and when he proved how useless he was, it made him a complete anchor of a contract that required us to use whatever few assets we had left just to get rid of him.

[MGrand15]

Things that make the Wallace trade worse:

1. No one was offering a lottery first round pick for him, let alone one with such a weak protection

2. Wallace was declining during that half season in Portland. Numbers were down, 3pt shot down the drain. He was already 29 with an extensive injury history and a game that completely depended on athleticism.

3. He said he only protected the pick for "top 3" because we only liked 3 players in the draft. Such a ridiculous statement. A pick that's 4-8 is a huge asset for a trade if you don't actually like anyone in the draft. Someone was likely to fall that would've been helpful.

[MrDollarBills]

If you think King's rationale was bad you should have read the garbage being spewed by the mouthpiece for the Nets front office over on "that blog" in efforts to put a positive spin on that trade.

It was akin to Nancy Pelosi saying "we have to pass it to find out what's in it" about Obamacare.

[Paradise]

If you think King's rationale was bad you should have read the garbage being spewed by the mouthpiece for the Nets front office over on "that blog" in efforts to put a positive spin on that trade.

It was akin to Nancy Pelosi saying "we have to pass it to find out what's in it" about Obamacare.

"Billy was going to take Tyler Zeller with the 6th pick anyways"

[Bro Johnson]

Didn't Thorn sign Travis Outlaw, Jordan Farmar, Anthony Morrow and Johan Petro then leave? Sure he didn't destroy us but locking up such mediocre talent then leaving was ridiculous.

He signed that trio(morrow, petro, farmar) to 1 year deals. so they were all expiring leaving us with either an asset at the deadline or pure cap space at the end of the deal. he had to sign someone to fill out the roster and did so with a team that could tank for another top pick.

The Outlaw deal was particularly terrible. Outlaw was TERRIBLE the year before and there was no chance in hell he was getting a deal anywhere near what we gave him. I watched a rookie Nic Batum take his starting spot in Portland and watched him consistently make terrible plays. I couldn't believe that deal when that happened.

it was a horrible deal. but lets not get carried away. it was 7M per season and wiped away with amnesty. King was left in an ideal situaion. you realyl cant ask for more in a rebuild then:

- young 19/8 center
- #3 pick rookie
- 4 first rounders in the next 3 years
- insane amount of cap space


- franchise moving to NY

I'm pretty sure Morrow, Farmar, and Petroe not signed to one year deals. I know for a fact Petro was signed to three year deal.

[jbeachboy]

dwill probably would of went to dallas if we didnt trade for gerald wallace. I dont blame king , orlando was never trading howard here to nets no matter what

[therealbig3]

dwill probably would of went to dallas if we didnt trade for gerald wallace.

Based on what?

[jbeachboy]

he mentioned having joe johnson and gerald coming back along with brook and humphries as reason to why he stayed. he wanted veterans and not a draft pick rookie.

he was comparing our roster to dallas at the time he said

[kerry kittles]

dwill probably would of went to dallas if we didnt trade for gerald wallace. I dont blame king , orlando was never trading howard here to nets no matter what

And we would've got Goran Dragic then and be better off.

[jbeachboy]

dragic was with rockets at time under contract? i dont think we would of gotten him, he was traded?

[Paradise]

dwill probably would of went to dallas if we didnt trade for gerald wallace. I dont blame king , orlando was never trading howard here to nets no matter what

And we would've got Goran Dragic then and be better off.

I don't see how. Everyone does realize Dragic wouldn't be anywhere near as good under Avery Johnson?

[kerry kittles]

dragic was with rockets at time under contract? i dont think we would of gotten him, he was traded?

He was a free agent and signed with the Suns.

[kerry kittles]

dwill probably would of went to dallas if we didnt trade for gerald wallace. I dont blame king , orlando was never trading howard here to nets no matter what

And we would've got Goran Dragic then and be better off.

I don't see how. Everyone does realize Dragic wouldn't be anywhere near as good under Avery Johnson?

Well we wouldn't have a maxed Deron Williams on our books that's the first part of it. PG is the deepest position in the league:
- Lowry just signed a 4 years $48 million contract
- Rondo is making $13 million next season
- Conley $8.6 million
- Dragic $7.5 million
- Teague $8 million
- Lawson $11.5 million
- Curry $10.6 million

DWill's making $20 million next season and has 2 more after that. How would we not be better off if we had let DWill walk and signed Dragic, yes that is Monday morning quarterbacking, but you just said you don't see how we'd be better off.

Instead we appeased him by overpaying in 2 trades, lost out on a high lotto pick and don't have control of our own draft pick until 2019, (pick swaps in Johnson deal + paying the Celtics to take on Wallace).

And Avery only lasted 2 months into that season. Johnson was a Thorn hiring and I don't think he was here long-term. Still think Kidd comes here with or without Dwill. He's power hungry and we're the only ones who would've made him HC straight from his playing days. Dragic would've been fine under Kidd. And either way Dragic at $7.5 million gives the team a lot more flexibility than DWill.

Here are both there numbers last year:
Dragic: 20.3 ppg on 60.4 TS%, 6 apg, 2.9 TO, 119 ortg, 10.3 WS, 21.4 PER

DWill: 16 ppg on 56.4 TS%, 6.1 apg, 2.2 TO, 112 ortg, 5.4 WS, 17.6 PER

Dragic was 3rd team All NBA, DWill was laying goose eggs in the playoffs. The gap was huge last year. If he had Avery as a coach, what happens his numbers drop to Deron's Williams level and he's making a 1/3 of what DWill is and isn't a thorn in the side of our 2016 plans?