The-Power's Big Board 2023

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The-Power
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The-Power's Big Board 2023 

Post#1 » by The-Power » Fri Dec 23, 2022 4:04 pm

A first attempt at a big board, and a large one at that with 45 ranked players and dozens more listed as potentially interesting prospects. Of course I still anticipate a lot of movement over the course of the season.

TIER 0 (Generational Prospects)
1. Victor Wembanyama
Spoiler:
Not much to say. One of those players where ‘generational talent’ does not feel like a stretch to describe him.

TIER 1 (Top-in-the-Draft Prospects)
2. Scoot Henderson
Spoiler:
Although I wish we had seen more of him up to this date, he looks like a solid #1 prospect in drafts without a generational talent.

TIER 2-3 (High to Late Lottery Prospects)
3. Cam Whitmore
4. Anthony Black
5. Jarace Walker
6. Keyonte George
7. Brandon Miller
8. Jett Howard
9. Taylor Hendricks
---
10. Julian Phillips
11. GG Jackson
12. Amen Thompson
13. Ausar Thompson
Spoiler:
Large group of players where I expect that only some of them will end up in my Tier 2 and some will drop to Tier 3. I had Whitmore and Black slightly ahead of the rest but especially with Whitmore, it is certainly possible that he drops – he will probably have to show more than he has so far to stick to that spot. 5-9 are surefire lottery picks to me if not for something unexpected happening, but the order is still very fluid.

10-14 are bigger question marks for me. Phillips can only stay in that range if he starts to shoot and make 3s – he hasn’t so far, which was unexpected to me because I bought him as a potentially great shooter when I watched him in HS. If he continues to struggle or be passive from behind the arc, he’ll drop. GG Jackson could solidify himself with the other group of forwards, but he’ll have to improve in certain aspects for me to be comfortable to place him there. The Thompson twins could drop or rise – I still haven’t made up my mind completely on them, but safe to say that I am more skeptical than a lot of internet scouts.

TIER 4 (Post-Lottery Prospects)
14. Jalen Wilson
15. Maxwell Lewis
16. Gradey Dick
17. Cason Wallace
---
18. Baba Miller
19. Dariq Whitehead
20. Nick Smith
---
21. Andre Jackson
22. Kris Murray
23. Ricky Council IV
24. Jordan Hawkins
Spoiler:
This is the tier where I expect solid NBA players to be the median outcome. 18-20 is the range with three Freshmen-aged players who I am not as high on as others at this moment but who could have a strong rise if they show more than they have, which feels very possible. But for now, this is where I would be more comfortable drafting them. Ahead of some more experienced players with a clearer role but less upside. Big shout-out to Andre Jackson who has really won me over as someone who just plays good basketball – he does not look to score but does about everything else well. He reminds me of GSW Iguodala in that sense.

Tier 5-6 (Late-First/Early-Second to Mid-Second Prospects)
Spoiler:
25. Dillon Mitchell
26. Kel'el Ware
27. Terquavion Smith
28. Colby Jones
29. Donovan Clingan
30. Jaylen Clark
31. Kevin McCullar
32. Arterio Morris
33. Sidy Sissoko
34. Ja’Vier Francis
35. Terrence Shannon Jr.
36. James Naji
37. Leonard Miller
38. Noah Clowney
39. Trey Alexander
40. Julian Strawther
41. Kyle Filipowski
42. Tyrese Hunter
43. Marcus Sasser
44. Jordan Walsh
45. Trevon Brazile

An even larger groups of players who I like as late 1st/early 2nd round picks. This group may eventually Some players could still rise, but for a lot of them there is a natural ceiling as to how high they can realistically end up because they essentially are who they are or have clearly limited roles in the NBA. Shout out to Colby Jones, Arterio Morris, Sidy Sissoko and Ja’Vier Francis who I seem to like more than most (at least from what I have seen around the internet last time I checked – could be obsolete already).


Rest (Likely-to-Potentially Draftable, Watchlist)
Spoiler:
Ugonna Onyenso
Chris Livingston
Azoulas Tubelis
Amari Bailey
Rayan Rupert
Dereck Lively II
Pelle Larsson
Oumar Ballo
Baylor Scheiermann
Adam Flagler
Wesley Cardet Jr.
KJ Simpson
Arthur Kaluma
DaRon Holmes II
Tucker DeVries
Terrance Arceneaux
Jalen Hood-Schifino
Trayce Jackson-Davis
Keyontae Johnson
Oscar Tshiebwe
Nikola Djurisic
Malcolm Cazalon
K.J. Williams
David Joplin
Kameron Jones
Deandre Williams
Isaiah Wong
Deshawndre Washington
Brice Sensabaugh
Felix Okpara
Milos Uzan
Will Richardson
Jalen Pickett
Bryce Hopkins
Zach Edey
Judah Mintz
Mike Miles
Wade Taylor IV
Daniel Batcho
Wade Taylor IV
Adama Sanogo
Keshon Gilbert
Kobe Johnson
Tre White
Kadin Shedrick
Connor Essegian

This is mostly a watchlist in no particular order. All those are players that I consider to be either draftable or potentially draftable (a lot of them probably will not declare for the draft this year anyways). A bunch of them could also still rise a bit for me.

If probably forgot someone obvious but too many players to even notice.
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Re: The-Power's Big Board 2023 

Post#2 » by reanimator » Fri Dec 23, 2022 4:26 pm

Nice.

Why so low on Cason Wallace?

I assume with Black so high, you're all in on him as a scorer/shooter, at least enough to leverage his playmaking. What gives you such confident?

Jarace is a kid who was not someone I would deem as a competent perimeter shooter. Are you buying in on the 3pt%? And if not, what do you see there that makes you so high on him? I assume the defensive versatility and playmaking.
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Re: The-Power's Big Board 2023 

Post#3 » by clyde21 » Fri Dec 23, 2022 5:31 pm

some disagreements but very solid overall imho

love Andre Jackson but ballsy at 21, but I get it.
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Re: The-Power's Big Board 2023 

Post#4 » by The-Power » Sat Dec 24, 2022 1:17 am

reanimator wrote:Nice.

Why so low on Cason Wallace?

I assume with Black so high, you're all in on him as a scorer/shooter, at least enough to leverage his playmaking. What gives you such confident?

Jarace is a kid who was not someone I would deem as a competent perimeter shooter. Are you buying in on the 3pt%? And if not, what do you see there that makes you so high on him? I assume the defensive versatility and playmaking.

Thanks for the feedback.

Re: Wallace. I actually thought I wasn't that low on him at #17. I like him. I suppose compared to those who have him higher, I see him as having a lower ceiling. My expectation for him is to become a lower-level starting PG or a very good PG off the bench. Someone who defends, runs the offense, hit 3s when open – but I don't see him as an offensive engine. Think Tyus Jones or DeAnthony Melton. Best case scenario is someone like Jrue Holiday perhaps? A PG in that mold is a tough sell for in the lottery but I like his floor. Of course if he reaches his ceiling then he would have been underdrafted in hindsight but that's of course true for all players on that list.

Re: Black. I was actually a bit lower on him in HS but he has convinced me more and more in college (and part of the ranking is also that I do not see the draft as anything special (yet) after the top 2, although I like the top 10 a lot). He shoots better than I expected but most importantly, he has been more aggressive at times and he has shown finishes with strength on his drives, and his defense has really translated well. I also love his feel for the game. I see him in the mold of Cade Cunningham. Cade was a better shooter and more aggressive and advanced scorer, so I have him as a better prospect coming out of college – but besides that, Black can compete with Cade and even has advantages over him in some areas. So long as he is aggressive enough as a scorer when he needs to, I think he can potentially lead an NBA offense; not as a pure scorer but as a primary decision-maker who is trusted to make those around him better. So it's not that I'm all in on him as a shooter or scorer, but I do think he has shown the potential to be good enough that all his other qualities will make a big impact on an NBA team.

Re: Jarace. I think he'll be a stretch big. Not at 40% or high volume but enough to make teams respect him. I am high on him because I really like his all-around profile. Good rebounder, switchable big who should be able to play the 5 when teams size down, positive connective passer, respectable shooter and he even has some on-ball ability (not enough to just give him the ball to create but enough intrigue to have his value climb). He should be a better finisher and draw more fouls around the rim with his physical ability, so this is something I'll watch out for the rest of the season. I think he should have appeal for similar reasons that Banchero had out of college – although Jarace is a worse scorer and worse on the ball, but better defensively. Now, Banchero has really taken his physicality to the next level in the NBA and Jarace will have to do the same if he wants to reach his ceiling, and we'll have to see where that goes. To draw another comparison: I also believe Jarace could be a more mobile and better passing version of current Isaiah Stewart, which would not be awe-inspiring but a really good NBA player. That being said, I currently have him #5 but if he continues to struggle (relatively speaking) with his finishing closer to the rim and continues to have an abysmal FTr, I can certainly see dropping him to the back-end of the top 10 (already I have the 5-9 range as very close with players in the 10-13 range who could easily end up in that range, too) or even the late lottery (I have a hard time seeing him lower than that unless his performance drops off considerably).
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Re: The-Power's Big Board 2023 

Post#5 » by The-Power » Sat Dec 24, 2022 1:32 am

clyde21 wrote:some disagreements but very solid overall imho

I'll probably have some serious disagreements with myself two months down the road. :D

clyde21 wrote:love Andre Jackson but ballsy at 21, but I get it.

Yeah, it looks high. But I've been watching him the past couple weeks more intensely and just end up thinking ‘this guy just does everything well but score and elevates everyone around him’. And if he can do that in the NBA, then he'll make an impact. There are a lot of scorers in the NBA. If you can make life easier for them and defend at a high level, coaches will value you. Now, there could be a threshold as a scorer that he doesn't pass but I would be more worried if he was a complete non-shooter or did not have NBA athleticism.

If we disregard his scoring for a moment, we have a wing player who this year – per 100 possessions – gives you 10.7 AST to only 3.2 TOV, 12.6 REB, 2.9 STL and 1.9 BLK (4.8 Stocks). That's just insane all-around production, and then you look at him and see how good of an athlete he is and how he just understands basketball instinctively, and it becomes difficult to not be infatuated with him as a prospect to some degree. As I hinted at already, I wouldn't be shocked if he developed into a GSW Iguodala kind of player in the NBA. Or a bigger and more explosive Lonzo Ball without the 3pt shot.
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Re: The-Power's Big Board 2023 

Post#6 » by clyde21 » Sat Dec 24, 2022 1:45 am

The-Power wrote:
clyde21 wrote:some disagreements but very solid overall imho

I'll probably have some serious disagreements with myself two months down the road. :D

clyde21 wrote:love Andre Jackson but ballsy at 21, but I get it.

Yeah, it looks high. But I've been watching him the past couple weeks more intensely and just end up thinking ‘this guy just does everything well but score and elevates everyone around him’. And if he can do that in the NBA, then he'll make an impact. There are a lot of scorers in the NBA. If you can make life easier for them and defend at a high level, coaches will value you. Now, there could be a threshold as a scorer that he doesn't pass but I would be more worried if he was a complete non-shooter or did not have NBA athleticism.

If we disregard his scoring for a moment, we have a wing player who this year – per 100 possessions – gives you 10.7 AST to only 3.2 TOV, 12.6 REB, 2.9 STL and 1.9 BLK (4.8 Stocks). That's just insane all-around production, and then you look at him and see how good of an athlete he is and how he just understands basketball instinctively, and it becomes difficult to not be infatuated with him as a prospect to some degree. As I hinted at already, I wouldn't be shocked if he developed into a GSW Iguodala kind of player in the NBA. Or a bigger and more explosive Lonzo Ball without the 3pt shot.


that's all part of the fun

and i completely get the glue guy aspect, nobody values these guys that can contribute without the ball on both sides more than me, but i'd feel more comfortable at the scoring aspect tho if I saw some improvement in efficiency this year, he's shooting worse from the field, from 3, and getting to the FT line at a lower clip. obviously still early but I was coming into this year with some expectations for him offensively that he not only hasn't met, but seems to have actually went the other way so far.

and the problem is in today's NBA it's hard to get away with 0 offense players, so that's why I am evaling him as a PG bc I'd want the ball in his hands as much as possible as a secondary guy maybe in a shorter Dray role (or like you said Iggy)...but that playmaking HAS to translate otherwise yea, no chance he'll see the court.

that said, I actually don't have him too far off, probably in the 31-40 range for me (so the first part of the 2nd) and completely get the intrigue.
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Re: The-Power's Big Board 2023 

Post#7 » by Jstock12 » Sun Dec 25, 2022 1:31 pm

The-Power wrote:
Rest (Likely-to-Potentially Draftable, Watchlist)

Azoulas Tubelis


8-)

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Re: The-Power's Big Board 2023 

Post#8 » by The-Power » Mon Feb 27, 2023 1:24 pm

Updated Top 10

1. Victor Wembanyama

2. Brandon Miller
3. Scoot Henderson

4. Jarace Walker
5. Anthony Black
6. Sidy Cissoko
7. Taylor Hendricks
8. Cam Whitmore
9. Keyonte George

The 10th spot is very much open at this point. Considering Jett Howard, Jordan Hawkins, Cason Wallace, maybe even Kris Murray and a couple others for the spot but none of them has fully convinced me yet to deserve to be ranked in that spot ahead of the others. I'm still very much wait and see here and don't love the end of the lottery.

The biggest riser is obviously Cissoko, who has won me over after closely watching more of his games and thinking about his upside but his ranking is still very fluid for me. Miller is also a clear riser for me and solidified himself in the tier with Scoot (most of that is due to what Miller has shown, but I'm slightly more concerned about Scoot's floor also). I also can't help but continue to be high (or even higher) on Hendricks as a potentially elite role player. Jordan Hawkins has also grown on me but needs the right system in the NBA to fully realize his potential. I'm also finding fewer reasons to keep Murray as low as I had him before but that has perhaps more to do with other players not convincing me as much as I had hoped. I'd also now move Jaylen Clark, Kevin McCullar and Leonard Miller a bit up from where I had them before and solidly into the top 30. Sasser should move up a bit, too. Obviously Sensabaugh would now make a huge leap into the top 20 most likely even though I'm not a ‘Sensabaugh truther’ myself. I would also add Makhi Mitchell to the list, I think he could be worth picking up with an early second round pick. Lively would also be bumped up a bit.

Whitmore is one of the biggest droppers inside the top 10 for me. I just really question his decision-making and passing skills, but he continues to have the athletic appeal and all the tools to be a valuable starter at the next level if he buys into more of a glue-guy role that leads with defense and off-ball offense. I've also grown more skeptical of George's floor after his playmaking dropped off considerably during conference play, but I still like him enough that I would roll the dice in the top 10. Howard also haven't alleviated any of the concerns unfortunately. From the ones previously in the top 10 consideration for me, I've dropped GG Jackson a lot (late first round perhaps) and I have also dropped the Thompson twins from my consideration for the time being (still in the process of evaluating them, though, but I have just too many concerns at this point). Also Julian Phillips has dropped a bit for me – I still like him but without the evidence of his shot coming around it's just difficult to keep him that high (still most definitely a top 20 pick for me). Same goes for Andre Jackson but from a lower starting point. I've also grown a bit more skeptical of Jalen Wilson and how he translates to the NBA, and I'm pretty out on Ricky Council IV at this point. I would also push down Baba Miller – who I was unsure of before and who hasn't really convinced me in international play to buy into his hype – but not sure how far down (but I don't see how he warrants any first-round buzz right now).

I'll try to at least update my top 30 some time in March but found it difficult to settle on a firm ranking just yet.
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Re: The-Power's Big Board 2023 

Post#9 » by The-Power » Thu Nov 2, 2023 7:01 pm

For posteriority, the last big board I posted on March 15.

Spoiler:
The-Power wrote:TOP 30

1. Victor Wembanyama

2. Brandon Miller

3. Scoot Henderson
4. Jarace Walker
5. Anthony Black
6. Sidy Cissoko
7. Taylor Hendricks
8. Cam Whitmore
9. Keyonte George

--- 10 to 30 not in a strict order (but less confidence in the players towards the end) –––
Kris Murray
Jordan Hawkins
Cason Wallace
Jett Howard
Brice Sensabaugh
Grady Dick
Ausar Thompson
Julian Phillips
Dariq Whitehead
Amen Thompson
Nick Smith
Leonard Miller
Jaylen Clark
Dereck Lively
G.G. Jackson
Kevin McCullar
Jalen Wilson
Kobe Bufkin
Maxwell Lewis
Marcus Sasser
Kobe Johnson

I'm sure I'm missing someone obvious. A couple players are right on the fringe and could easily jump up and into the list as I think more about the post-lottery rankings.

https://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?p=104837251#p104837251

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